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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Discar Since: Jun, 2009
#113576: Dec 4th 2019 at 8:59:31 PM

Although it working perfectly makes it a failure by military standards.

They want a mass producible super soldier serum, not something where they have to seek out the pure of heart.

Eh, people with hearts like Steve are rare, but America is big. They'd be able to find more than enough candidates. Better that the serum only works perfectly on the pure of heart than turning a bunch of assholes into Super Soldiers, who can randomly decide to murder a bunch of people at any time and you can't do anything about it.

Remember, the real military does not want Sociopathic Soldiers.

Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#113577: Dec 4th 2019 at 9:02:00 PM

Blonsky didn't get Vita-Rays either, right?

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#113578: Dec 4th 2019 at 9:09:48 PM

Blonsky got a series of injections and from what we saw no radiation exposure, save for eventually Bruce's gamma-irradiated blood.

One of Howard's inventions in Agent Carter Season 1 emitted Vita-Rays, so maybe his formula got closer and it was just tested on the wrong people.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Dec 4th 2019 at 9:23:23 AM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#113579: Dec 4th 2019 at 9:15:03 PM

I wonder who else in the MCU it might have worked on.

My best guess is Peter, but even so Peter had a degree of Glory Hound when we first met him, and even after that tends he to be motivated by seeking the validation of others, which is a small flaw that he's starting to grow past, but which would absolutely get warped to hell by the serum.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Dec 4th 2019 at 9:15:58 AM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#113580: Dec 4th 2019 at 9:51:23 PM

They don't want sociopath soldiers but they don't want Steve Rogers either. He has a tendency of following his own moral compass.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#113581: Dec 4th 2019 at 9:57:17 PM

Well, they're gonna have to settle for the second one.

Better to have someone who will still follow orders as long as they are good, as opposed to...

One Strip! One Strip!
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#113582: Dec 4th 2019 at 10:16:06 PM

Well they don't get steve either

He went off to follow his own moral compass, got branded a traitor, and spent several years doing his own thing, came back and tried to save the world anyway, things were eventful, and now he's retired.

They get Sam now.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Discar Since: Jun, 2009
#113583: Dec 4th 2019 at 10:31:19 PM

I was thinking of it more in terms of Erskine selling the project. "Only the pure of heart can safely use this" is a bug, but it's a bug that can be sold as a feature.

Though it's not clear if he ever told anyone except Steve about that bug. Phillips thought that bully was a good choice for the serum, which would be stupid if he knew that negative traits would be magnified. Though it's also possible that Erskine told them about the bug and they dismissed it as an exaggeration.

Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.
RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#113584: Dec 4th 2019 at 10:40:11 PM

Transforming a person based on their character might explain why Hydra only ever used the serum on people whose personalities had been erased (or at least repressed), so that there wouldn't be any unpredictable transformations.

Edited by RavenWilder on Dec 4th 2019 at 10:42:28 AM

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#113585: Dec 4th 2019 at 10:41:25 PM

Blonsky went rogue in a week, Steve went rogue after half a dozen-ish years. More bang for your buck the Steve way. tongue

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#113586: Dec 4th 2019 at 10:44:39 PM

I also like and subscribe to the idea that the serum did work on Blonsky, but he became Abomination because Emil Blonsky is no Steve Rogers. Blonsky failed the character test just like the Red Skull before him.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#113587: Dec 4th 2019 at 10:52:45 PM

It'd be fun to speculate what would happen to other characters exposed to the super soldier serum.

Tony is such a mass of issues that its frightening to consider in his case.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#113588: Dec 4th 2019 at 10:58:45 PM

Super Soldier Tony...

I'm thinking, like, the Ultimate version of Reed Richards. Manic, ludicrously intelligent, obsessed with bringing his idea of the future into reality by any means necessary.

I'm pretty sure Super Soldier Hawkeye is basically just Ronin, but maybe less willing to listen to reason. Super Soldier Widow... honestly, it depends on when in the timeline she gets dosed - I feel like Endgame Widow would end up okay.

Iron Man 2 or Avengers 1 Widow, though, with her ruthless streak and lack of trust of people... probably not.

Who knows if the serum would even work on Thor. Either way, though, I feel like we've already seen "what if the base elements of Thor's personality were exaggerated, especially the negative parts" in pre-character development Thor 1.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Dec 4th 2019 at 11:00:19 AM

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#113589: Dec 4th 2019 at 10:59:23 PM

Honestly I generally assume the serum isn't, like, magic or anything. Just has a psychosomatic element to it that caused Red Skull's face to do... that because he was so full of angry, violent thoughts it screwed with his bodily systems while the serum did its thing.

Edited by Anomalocaris20 on Dec 4th 2019 at 2:03:53 PM

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#113590: Dec 5th 2019 at 12:02:09 AM

Erskine mentioned in that case that Schmidt's disfigurement was due to the serum not being complete.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#113591: Dec 5th 2019 at 12:33:29 AM

Oh.

Well then that's that I guess.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
ShadowWingLG Since: Dec, 2013
#113592: Dec 5th 2019 at 12:35:14 AM

It may have been both. Incomplete serum and the fact Red Skull was a complete monster.

MrSeyker Since: Apr, 2011
#113593: Dec 5th 2019 at 1:51:03 AM

From what the movie shows us, you need all the elements to get a stable super soldier.

Steve recieved a multiple intramusuclar injections simultaneously (which initiated cellular alteration) and was bathed in vita-rays immediately afterwards (to stimulate cellular growth).

From the flashback, Schmidt got a single injection to the arm which seems to have transformed him right then an there. No exposure to vita-rays. Recieved a prototype kf the serum according to Erskine.

Blonsky for his part recieved three injections, two intramuscular and one medular. Was not exposed to vita-rays.

Blonsky was performing well, and he fully recovered from being broken by Hulk, so the cellular regeneration was working.

Then he got a second set of injections on top which triggered the start of a mutation. And then exposure to Hulk's gamma radiated blood sent him into overdrive.

And keep in mind that Blonsky recieved a recreation of the serum created from blood samples of Steve that had undergone further tampering (Banner's research was meant to be part of it).

There are so many variables to consider in the Serum that it's not unreasonable that Steve became the only successful subject.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#113594: Dec 5th 2019 at 4:05:56 AM

Blonsky was also an older man with the wear and tear that comes with years of combat on the field. The serum was able to make him better than new.

Disgusted, but not surprised
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#113595: Dec 5th 2019 at 7:54:57 AM

It'd be fun to speculate what would happen to other characters exposed to the super soldier serum.

Tony is such a mass of issues that its frightening to consider in his case.

Tony can be surprisingly self aware about what a mess he is. I actually think the formula would increase this as well. I can half picture him telling everyone they need to lock him up in the deepest pit imaginable because he knows what a disaster he'd be as a Super-Soldier.

One Strip! One Strip!
TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#113596: Dec 5th 2019 at 8:52:00 AM

Last night, Tom Holland showed up on Jimmy Kimmel Live and apparently Tom was pretty buzzed when it came time to save Spider-Man...

Bob Iger saying "there is a world where we can make [Spider-Man staying in the MCU] work" sort of speaks volumes (at least to me) about how serious he took Spider-Man's presence MCU. Like if one piece of the MCU pie was permanently taken out of the equation, the whole picture would feel off.

Wow. [tup]

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Dec 5th 2019 at 11:55:03 AM

Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#113597: Dec 5th 2019 at 11:32:40 AM

Bob Iger is essentially the Tywin to Feige's Tyrion. The Mastermind

Just Makima.
jakobitis Doctor of Doctorates from Somewhere, somewhen Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Doctor of Doctorates
#113598: Dec 5th 2019 at 11:51:44 AM

So long as Feige doesn't end up shooting Iger on the toilet. Uh, spoilers.

"These 'no-nonsense' solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex world of jet-powered apes and time travel."
Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#113599: Dec 5th 2019 at 12:30:14 PM

[up] x4 Do you think they'd try to copy Peter now? Just saying. Super strength, speed, can take a train to the face and has the ability to perceive his surroundings to the point of walking through major hails of gunfire without getting hurt. And pre-bite Peter is about a couple steps above pre serum Steve.

Wake me up at your own risk.
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#113600: Dec 5th 2019 at 1:32:27 PM

I recall in the Ultimate-verse, Green Goblin and Miles Morales Spider-Man were made from projects trying to recreate Peter's spider bite. Worked out for Miles, with some bonus powers, didn't turn out so great for Osborn.


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