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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#112976: Nov 23rd 2019 at 10:07:42 AM

[up] I don't think the switch was made in Winter Soldier. That wouldn't have made any sense. Remember: Talos isn't as good a spy as Fury is and also Fury had the pager at the end of Infinity War that Carol gave him.

The most likely explanation is that the switch happened post-Endgame and pre-Far From Home.

chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#112977: Nov 23rd 2019 at 10:12:40 AM

Yeah, I'm pretty sure Word of God has confirmed that Talos was only disguised as Fury for the duration of Far From Home.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#112979: Nov 23rd 2019 at 11:49:04 AM

Talos' rant to Fury at the Far From Home makes it pretty clear he only just got the job and is overwhelmed by all the awkward situations he was thrust into.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Nov 23rd 2019 at 11:49:27 AM

GNinja The Element of Hyperbole. from The deepest, darkest corner of his mind. Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
The Element of Hyperbole.
#112980: Nov 23rd 2019 at 11:49:17 AM

I'm such a bad comic fan. I can't really muster much excitement for whatever Fury is doing. I'm still not 100% sure what the point of the switcheroo was. If it's because there's no way the REAL Fury would've fallen for Beck, then doesn't that make Far From Home something of an Idiot Plot in retrospect? If the only way it works is to take a character and replace them with what's essentially a stupider version of themselves?

I guess it could be to reinforce the whole "Nothing is at it seems" theme that Mysterio tends to leave in his wake

Edited by GNinja on Nov 23rd 2019 at 7:51:45 PM

Kaze ni Nare!
tiamkara Let’s Have the Dark Courage to Sin Tonight from Augusta, GA Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Let’s Have the Dark Courage to Sin Tonight
#112981: Nov 23rd 2019 at 12:13:02 PM

I guess it’s just the MCU’s weird way of setting up Secret War.

Bet we don’t hear a single thing about this for another three or four years.

“If you have a message for the devil give it to me and I’ll take it to him.”
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#112982: Nov 23rd 2019 at 12:37:40 PM

well dur its a SECRET WAR course you wont hear about it..

Unless someone tells,someone always tells

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#112983: Nov 23rd 2019 at 1:00:49 PM

You mean Secret Invasion?

Not that I wouldn’t want Secret Wars. I’d love to eee The Beyonder.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Nov 23rd 2019 at 1:00:59 AM

chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#112984: Nov 23rd 2019 at 1:04:51 PM

Well there's Secret Wars, and then there's also Secret Wars. Neither are which are to be confused with Marvel's other miniseries Secret War.

... You think comic writers have problems coming up with original names for events?

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#112985: Nov 23rd 2019 at 1:43:33 PM

How many crises happened after Final Crisis, anyway?

But also, there's an entire trope about how original names are hard.

tiamkara Let’s Have the Dark Courage to Sin Tonight from Augusta, GA Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Let’s Have the Dark Courage to Sin Tonight
#112986: Nov 23rd 2019 at 3:08:25 PM

Secret something-or-other.

Battleworld is probably another ten years off. What a bummer. Would be a really good basis for the next Endgame-level movie.

But it’s possible. I’d argue it’s even likely if the multiverse is gonna be an aspect of this particular “saga”.

Would it be weird if Marvel used the multiverse to introduce the Fox X-Men universe through a Secret Wars sort of thing? They did Age of Apocalypse and Days of Future Past so.. yanno..

“If you have a message for the devil give it to me and I’ll take it to him.”
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#112987: Nov 23rd 2019 at 3:16:42 PM

What’s funny is that Secret Wars was titled because focus groups indicated that children responded to the words “secret” and “wars” and since the event was initially intended to sell toys, that’s what the name became

And also influenced which characters would be in it and all the toyetic secret bases and vehicles

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#112988: Nov 23rd 2019 at 5:54:21 PM

[up][up] Given that Endgame was itself the culmination of over 10 years of buildup, we shouldn't expect the next Endgame-level movie for another 10 years anyways.

As for Mutants, I think they are going to just do a straightforward reboot. They'll find some way to explain why they've thus far flown under the radar and that will be that.

I think the best way might be for mutants to have always been around, but extremely rare So rare that that even people who made it their business to know didn't know about mutants so much as a few random individuals with inexplicable abilities but not how those individuals are related. However some event, possibly one that has already occurred, causes a massive surge in mutant population in the years following Endgame. That way we can still have historical mutants when it's especially vital to the specific character's backstory, but have a sizeable modern mutant population.

Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#112989: Nov 23rd 2019 at 6:07:45 PM

I'd like a reverse House of M situation where, instead of taking away mutant powers from the world, Wanda unleashes mutations on the world at large.

The legend has returned.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#112990: Nov 23rd 2019 at 6:08:47 PM

So, she'd be the mutant Messiah.

At least they'd hate her a bit less than they do in the comics, what with calling her a pretender and all.

One Strip! One Strip!
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#112991: Nov 23rd 2019 at 6:08:48 PM

Joke here about a boy named Timmy turner wishing he had superpowers..

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
AyyItsMidnight Look, just be decent to one another ok? Since: Oct, 2018
Look, just be decent to one another ok?
#112992: Nov 23rd 2019 at 6:09:04 PM

All I ask is to give a damn about mutants that aren't Wolverine, Professor X and Magneto. In fact, I'd be just fine with holding off on including those three for a while.

[up]Something something Cosmo the Space Dog?

Edited by AyyItsMidnight on Nov 23rd 2019 at 6:11:34 AM

Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#112993: Nov 23rd 2019 at 6:10:53 PM

The first movie is literally about the original five Xmen.

It's never been done before in any media since the comics. It could work.

One Strip! One Strip!
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#112994: Nov 23rd 2019 at 6:12:17 PM

I think all of this speculation about how mutants are going to appear in the MCU is just kind of silly. I bet you that mutants will show and...that's it. Someone will say "After the Blip, there was a massive uptick in genetic mutation" and that'll be that. Nothing to do with Wanda or Doctor Strange or whathaveyou. There would still be mutants pre-Blip, but they would be rarer.

chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#112995: Nov 23rd 2019 at 7:48:31 PM

If you say the mutant population was say... in the low thousands, then I'd say that's plausible enough for mutants to lay low for as long as they have. That still gives you large number of characters to work with, but still keeps the mutant population a definite minority among the world populace.

From what I can gather, the comics had a mutant population that was around 30 million, which would be a harder sell for a world where mutants are just now coming into the public eye. Of course, post-House of M reduced that to a few hundred, which I think might be a bit too small for the series to start off with.

Of course, there's the real possibility the MCU won't address how large the mutant population is, but it's something to speculate about.

RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#112996: Nov 23rd 2019 at 8:14:24 PM

I'd honestly like it if, in the MCU, "mutant" was simply used as a catchall term for "humans with superpowers".

You get injected with the super soldier serum? You're a mutant. You get bitten by a radioactive spider and gain spider powers? You're a mutant. Some weird quirk in your DNA lets you move objects with your mind? You're a mutant, too.

Throw in some mention that, with so many science experiments run amuck and cosmic energy explosions hitting the Earth lately, and superpowered folk are turning up all over the place, and boom: there you go.

Just seems like it'd simplify everything a great deal.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#112997: Nov 23rd 2019 at 8:17:33 PM

The MCU already has “enhanced” for that.

I figured the opposite direction is all you really need to buffer in the mutants: there were mutants before, but were simply put into the purview of “enhanced” alongside the likes of people like Cap or Spidey, and only recently became singled out.

tiamkara Let’s Have the Dark Courage to Sin Tonight from Augusta, GA Since: Jul, 2012 Relationship Status: Complex: I'm real, they are imaginary
Let’s Have the Dark Courage to Sin Tonight
#112998: Nov 23rd 2019 at 8:59:09 PM

Underrated Civil War dialogue:

Clint Barton, to T’Challa: We haven’t met yet. I’m Clint.

T’Challa: I don’t care.

“If you have a message for the devil give it to me and I’ll take it to him.”
Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#112999: Nov 24th 2019 at 1:03:15 AM

[up]x5 That's more or less what I'm suggesting, except perhaps with the blip replaced by some other recent-ish event.

Mutants need to be simultaneously so obscure in the 90's that even someone working for SHIELD (albeit at a fairly low level) had seemingly no idea they were a thing, and common enough in modern day for them to be a meaningfully distinct category from the random superheroes we already have.

There are many ways to achieve that, some are subtle and only explained in retrospect, and some are direct and would be better explicitly shown onscreen. The best way is ultimately going to be determined by the story they want to tell.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#113000: Nov 24th 2019 at 1:12:23 AM

Mutants need to be simultaneously so obscure in the 90's that even someone working for SHIELD (albeit at a fairly low level) had seemingly no idea they were a thing

Is that a thing? How far back does the "enhanced" label go in the MCU?

We definitely know they've had people with superpowers for ages, even before Captain Marvel.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Nov 24th 2019 at 1:15:31 AM


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