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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#112251: Nov 10th 2019 at 8:51:16 AM

Yellowjacket (Cross) understood and outwitted the heist once he suspected Hope, planned around their plan well enough that their plan only succeeded because of the "three Goombas", would've had Hank Dead if he didn't decide at the last second to do it himself, and forced Lang into a presumed suicide attack that he only recovered from because of his connection with his daughter.

And oh yeah, even without direct engagement, pushed Hank to the point where his only options were come out of retirement, risk Hope's life, or involve and risk an innocent bystander.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Nov 10th 2019 at 10:51:42 AM

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#112252: Nov 10th 2019 at 8:51:18 AM

Aldrich is by far the worst MCU villain in my opinion.

Films anyway, don't remember all the show villains right now, but even then I don't think there was somebody below that.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#112253: Nov 10th 2019 at 8:55:11 AM

Tony pushed himself and Killian was nearby when it happened. Stark's PTSD crisis over New York is what caused him to be stupid and just give out his actual home address to be bombed to kingdom come, which is also basically where Killian's menace to Tony began and ended.

Wouldn't Tony's address have been pretty easy to find anyway? The man is a celebrity and I doubt this was even the first time his address had been revealed to the public.

And let's not forget he fooled the entire country, including Tony, into thinking the Mandarin was some scary foreigner in a cave and not another American.

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#112254: Nov 10th 2019 at 8:55:43 AM

Vanko, meanwhile, was one of the best early villains. He almost singlehandedly proved to the world that they can neither trust nor rely on Tony Stark or "heroes", and that Stark isn't unique. It's only because that movie needed to have a happy ending that the lesson didn't sink in until Winter Soldier, Age of Ultron, and Civil War. He actually did make "god" bleed, and his "You Lose" while dying was entirely right.

And he started while living with his father in exile, with a box of scraps.

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#112255: Nov 10th 2019 at 8:57:36 AM

How was Winter Soldier a movie about how you can't rely on Stark or heroes? Stark wasn't even in Winter Soldier.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#112256: Nov 10th 2019 at 8:59:31 AM

I like Iron Man 3 more than most of you but with the benefit of hindsight, I think it would have been more thematically consistent if instead of terrorisms Killian or whoever was faking alien attacks to cover up his crimes. It ties into Tony's PTSD and the recent events of Avengers.

But: you lose all of the cutting social commentary.

Edited by Bocaj on Nov 10th 2019 at 11:59:42 AM

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#112257: Nov 10th 2019 at 9:18:52 AM

[up][up]"or" is an important word. Winter Soldier was about how you can't trust security apparatuses, even those wrapped in the trappings of security, like they were hugging a flag or things like that. Instead, to choose to do what's right on your own where you can. Though, Natasha's speech at the end about how "You need us" kind of undercuts that. (and then the next two films were about how "you need us to save you from us"...)

[up]I don't think it really pulled off any effective social commentary as is. Fake alien attacks might've been better, now that you mention it.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Nov 10th 2019 at 11:21:41 AM

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#112258: Nov 10th 2019 at 9:42:41 AM

Killian is one of the worst MCU villains full stop. Once he's unveiled as the Mandarin the film completely loses all momentum and everything that was potentially good about the movie falls apart.

Ant-Man is the definition of a middle-of-the-road Marvel movie. It's competent and enjoyable but I don't think it will be remembered years down the line.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#112259: Nov 10th 2019 at 9:46:47 AM

The only thing I like about Killian himself is his power set, which is a welcome break from the usual “mirror of the hero” mold. Aside from that, utterly boring. Maya Hansen deserved her due.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Nov 10th 2019 at 9:47:22 AM

AyyItsMidnight Look, just be decent to one another ok? Since: Oct, 2018
Look, just be decent to one another ok?
#112260: Nov 10th 2019 at 9:55:40 AM

Finally finished up Punisher season 2 after repeatedly picking it up and putting it down. Solid enough continuation with good performances and action, though the very last shot felt a bit silly for some reason.

Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)
TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#112261: Nov 10th 2019 at 9:58:42 AM

Zazie Beetz (Domino in Deadpool 2) wants to be MCU!Storm.

On one hand, it might mean losing Domino.

On the other hand, we have two cases of actors (Gemma Chan and Mahershala Ali) playing more than just one character in the MCU (or three if we count Alfre Woodard) so the earlier point might be moot and she can be both?

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Nov 10th 2019 at 1:13:44 PM

fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#112262: Nov 10th 2019 at 10:01:07 AM

[up]Why would this mean losing Domino? Actors can't work for multiple studios or companies?

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#112263: Nov 10th 2019 at 10:02:35 AM

Disney bought Fox. Domino would theoretically be part of the MCU now if they moved forward with Deadpool.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#112264: Nov 10th 2019 at 10:09:44 AM

O.K, but what's with the "losing" part? She can't be MCU!Storm and Domino at the same time, it's one or the other?

Edited by fredhot16 on Nov 10th 2019 at 10:10:27 AM

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#112265: Nov 10th 2019 at 10:11:13 AM

Perhaps the belief that she couldn't be both of them at once.

Though considering the Deadpool franchise's silliness, they wouldn't miss the opportunity to point it out I imagine.

One Strip! One Strip!
TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#112266: Nov 10th 2019 at 10:14:23 AM

[up]x4: Fixed my last post. Sorry for the confusion.

fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#112267: Nov 10th 2019 at 10:18:27 AM

Would they be in different movies? Because if she's going to be both, then, well, if they want to avoid weirdness or whatever, Domino and Storm simply can't be in the same movie. I'm sure they can come up with a reason for that.

Doesn't seem to be a case where we might not have Domino the character anymore. Simpler fix, she'd be played by a different actress, Hulk style.

Edited by fredhot16 on Nov 10th 2019 at 10:21:48 AM

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#112268: Nov 10th 2019 at 10:31:10 AM

Zazie Beetz is a great actress and a standout in Deadpool 2, but given Storm’s frequent issues with colorism in both film and comics, I think another actress should have the part.

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#112269: Nov 10th 2019 at 10:35:23 AM

I would like a more comic-like look for Domino. She is my favorite C-Lister.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#112270: Nov 10th 2019 at 11:43:19 AM

found Ant Man 1 preferable to the sequel, and Yellowjacket was a good antagonist. The sequel felt a bit disjointed in vision and not really interesting to rewatch, while I've already rewatched the first in whole or in part a couple times.

I kind of agree. I still think the sequel is better done in many ways, but whereas I will occasionally rewatch the entire Ant-Man film, I tend to just jump around to parts I like for the second instead of watching it in whole. Usually the scenes with Luis and Jimmy, Ghost, and the chase.

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#112271: Nov 10th 2019 at 12:07:56 PM

if I remenber well Cross figure out something was wrong when he saw the newspaper about how a convit just escape and deduce it was Hank, showing how bad the plan was because it was dead the moment it start.

Killian.....I will said acting was is the trouble, because the idea of someone creating a racist boogeyman is kinda overused(see batman nola trilogy) but cleaver, is just the actor did create a menacing mandarin, but again I feel there is not way to used the mandarin as villain against Tony.

Also Killian did suspect tony was alive and use is extremist goons to track him down, control the Iron patriot, have a mole inside the white house and nearly murder him, Tony was the underdog the entire time.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#112272: Nov 10th 2019 at 12:28:18 PM

I accidentally clicked the first page from 2011 and this got a chuckle out of me.

To me the Avengers film feels like a bad idea. Can anyone name a movie with that many main characters that manages to give all of them depth and show relationships between the (aside from the novel-based epic of Lord of the Rings)? It's likely to be another X-Men 3.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#112273: Nov 10th 2019 at 12:36:52 PM

Yeah, it's interesting how old opinions have aged. Some age like fine wine and others age like milk. I remember intense arguments over whether or not the Masters of Evil would be the villains of Avengers 2. I don't know if it was this thread or another one, but I remember some people were very convinced for years that Marvel was building up the Masters of Evil to be the franchise's big Myth Arc.

I also remember, myself, holding the opinion that no Avengers film would ever adapt Civil War because it was 1) patently unfilmable as a premise and 2) not very well received. In my defense, I wasn't technically wrong; it wasn't an Avengers film.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Nov 10th 2019 at 1:37:49 PM

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Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#112274: Nov 10th 2019 at 12:40:40 PM

I for one am very glad that most of the MCU guys are doing pragmatic adaptations of storylines.

They cut out all the stupid stuff that most comics have and put them into a more believable context.

Edited by Forenperser on Nov 10th 2019 at 9:55:26 PM

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#112275: Nov 10th 2019 at 12:43:42 PM

Hindsight and oversight are quite the allies for these movies.

Wake me up at your own risk.

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