Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules
still apply.
- This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
- While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread
. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
- Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.
If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.
Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM
I'm reminded of that episode of The Amazing World of Gumball where the adults ban video-games so kids can read all the "classic & history books" because its more wholesome for children only for Gumball and co to prove that all those beloved classics are just as inappropriate as the video-games they are trying to ban.
"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."Also a reminder that Shakespeare wasn't considered "high art" during his day, either. His plays were for the lower classes and he often filled them with puns and sex jokes. In fact, the name of Much Ado About Nothing is, itself, a sex joke.
Again I'm reminded of The Castle of Cagliostro which back then was just another entry in a pre-existing franchise and Miyazaki's novice debut.
Part of it has something to do with the fact that often the work that is done for a payoff is also put through a lot of editing. Since the creator is mostly just doing it to pay the bills, they aren't going to be that emotionally invested in every single facet of the work.
The trope page description for Magnum Opus Dissonance has a pretty good explanation of it.
All of the above aside, this trope isn't necessarily as black and white as it sounds. As some of the examples below demonstrate, the opus can, in fact, have its own substantial fanbase and perfectly respectable sales and reviews...but it just ends up Overshadowed by Awesome compared to the other works. Some fans may even agree with the author and prefer the opus to the author's other creations.
Edited by M84 on Oct 24th 2019 at 2:59:08 AM
Disgusted, but not surprisedHey, another parallel. It's kind of stunning how much of Silver Age Marvel was rather propagandist. Like the sheer amount of Iron Man's Rogues Gallery that were Chinese or Russian communist stereotypes.
![]()
Well, Iron Man was envisioned to be the Anti-Hero that people of the sixties hated. A rich, womanizing war profiteer and capitalist who got himself into an armored suit. And a capitalist superhero's Rogues Gallery would naturally either have rival capitalists (like the Iron Monger and Justin Hammer) or communist stereotypes (like the Crimson Dynamo, Black Widow and the Mandarin).
Sadly, that also meant that Iron Man's Rogues Gallery got outdated after the Cold War, unable to maintain a timeless nature that Spider-Man and Batman's Rogues Gallery got to enjoy.
Edited by Shadao on Oct 24th 2019 at 2:09:11 AM
It's worth noting that the capitalist enemies didn't come until quite a while later. Hammer and Stane didn't make their first appearances until nearly twenty years after the character of Iron Man was first introduced.
When they started, Iron Man and the Silver Age Captain America were rather similar to - say - 60's Star Trek: the heroes portrayed more "virtuous" American values, and the villains were analogues or representatives of cultures, governments and ideologies considered adversarial by (then) contemporary America.
The first Iron Man movie kind of updates this by having Tony's primary mission be to fly around blowing up terrorists, which is a level of topicality that literally every other Marvel movie since has tried to avoid.
Edited by KnownUnknown on Oct 24th 2019 at 2:22:06 AM
The first Iron Man movie started out with him fighting against terrorists only to switch midway to fighting Iron Monger.
The second movie moved away from terrorists and dealt with Hammer and Whiplash.
The third movie seemed to go back to fighting terrorists, but the real villain turned out to be another corporate rival.
Disgusted, but not surprisedIn the comics, the Tony/Pepper romance isn't a thing. Pepper actually married Happy. She and Tony are close friends, but it's never really been more than that.
Tony's love interest in the comics is "anbody who is female and nearby". He and Hawkeye are the Avengers' two most notoriously horny bachelors - though it's worth noting that Clint at least did settle down and get married for a time.
Edited by TobiasDrake on Oct 24th 2019 at 6:24:51 AM
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Yeah, I wouldn't really call marrying Mockingbird "settling down." In fact, they had pretty much just met one another and then hit it off when they impulsively decided to get married.
Once Gamora sprained Tony’s pelvis and was also disappointed by the get together
Forever liveblogging the AvengersI also agree. After all the shit he pulled in the comics' Civil War, getting to crush Tony's pelvis and then talk shit about his poor sexual prowess would be a blast.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.As I understand it, they divorced and then Happy died. Out of curiosity, was that around the same time the first Iron Man came out?
This song needs more love.

Michaelangelo famously took a job to paint the ceiling of the Sistine Chapel and proceeded to cover it in dicks, because trolling hasn't actually changed much.
When the Master of Ceremonies complained about all the penises hanging out everywhere, Michaelangelo added him to the painting as a demon with jackass ears, then painted a snake biting him in the dick.
The resulting work is considered one of the greatest masterpieces of the Renaissance era.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.