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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#110776: Oct 3rd 2019 at 2:28:12 PM

Hot Fuzz is great and one of my favorite shows of all time is Spaced, which Wright directed all the episodes. It also has some great female characters — of course, that's because every episode was co-written by Simon Pegg and Jessica Stevenson. But yeah, both Shaun of the Dead and Hot Fuzz were co-written by Pegg, who I suspect has a better understanding of writing women than Wright does. Since Ant-Man was being 100% written by Wright, it seems like he just didn't know what to do with the Wasp at all.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#110777: Oct 3rd 2019 at 2:34:46 PM

I was watching Scott Pilgrim Vs The World a few weeks ago and it stuck out to me how Scott, who spends the first half of the movie being mocked by everyone for being a pathetic creep, has somehow also dated 5 of the 7 women in the story. And the 6 and 7 are his sister and a lesbian, so, somehow every available woman can't resist him for who knows why. tongue

(Yes I've read the comic.)

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Oct 3rd 2019 at 2:36:40 AM

LordVatek Not really a lord of anything Since: Sep, 2014
Not really a lord of anything
#110778: Oct 3rd 2019 at 7:48:29 PM

So I've seen this possibility brought up in a few places and I'm kind of curious how it would end up:

What if the X-Men in the MCU were based on the House of X status quo?

Edited by LordVatek on Oct 3rd 2019 at 10:50:07 AM

This song needs more love.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#110779: Oct 3rd 2019 at 7:51:33 PM

It might be.

The entire point of House of X is to give them a new Status quo after being stuck in a rut for years.

Building up through a quasi Claremont Era, into a not quite Morrison / Bendis / Hickman Era, maybe with a bit of Bendis in there as well (or whatever the best arcs are) seems like the logical thing to me.

Thought they may go for something totally different as well, while still taking beats from all the best stuff.

Maybe they'll just go nuts and have people just be indifferent towards mutants after all the other shit that's happened.

Kinda like big deal! We were erased from existence for years! Why are you guys a big deal?!

One Strip! One Strip!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#110780: Oct 3rd 2019 at 7:53:31 PM

If they were to take the House of X approach then they'd be the ones taking the Inhumans shtick & actually being good at it. tongue

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#110781: Oct 3rd 2019 at 7:55:41 PM

Isn't House of X a reconstruction that relies on pulling together years of X-Men content and re-addressing the various ideals and trials they've faced over the years?

If you're going to do right off the bat without the mutants being a thing beforehand, you might as well just do Asteroid M instead. And even that runs into the same problem. They're both reactions to story that's been there for years, not launching off points.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Oct 3rd 2019 at 7:59:51 AM

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#110782: Oct 3rd 2019 at 7:56:16 PM

Fair enough. They'll need a few years to build to that era I think.

One Strip! One Strip!
Akirakan Since: Feb, 2015 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#110783: Oct 3rd 2019 at 7:56:27 PM

Let's see where does Hox Pox goes before making ideas.

Yes, I still think Xavier is The Maker.

Edited by Akirakan on Oct 3rd 2019 at 9:57:44 AM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#110784: Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:20:24 PM

I've seen some suggestions of starting the MCU X-Men off with the classic original team: Cyclops, Beast, Angel, Iceman, and Jean. Personally, I'd be fine with that idea, since aside from Beast, none of these characters were really done justice by the movies.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#110785: Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:21:54 PM

They wasted both Angel & his Archangel persona.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
GNinja The Element of Hyperbole. from The deepest, darkest corner of his mind. Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
The Element of Hyperbole.
#110786: Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:25:14 PM

I'm still wary of them cracking open the hideously convoluted can of worms that is the X-Men.

I'd rather they introduce the Fantastic 4 first, honestly. I feel you could do a lot with them and they'd be a lot simpler to set up. Also, you get to use Doom, a character who still hasn't been done justice in the films yet.

We've already had several great versions of Magneto.

Kaze ni Nare!
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#110787: Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:30:00 PM

I agree that the Fantastic 4 are a much higher priority than the X-Men. The X-Men have at least had some good movies. The F4 films started mediocre and only went downhill from there. Marvel's First Family deserves a shot to really strut their stuff and prove themselves because currently, they're a laughingstock.

Also, Doom is like in the top 5 Marvel villains, and none of the F4 movies even came close to capturing what makes him great.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:32:03 AM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#110788: Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:31:16 PM

Sue really needs a badass portrayal.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
GNinja The Element of Hyperbole. from The deepest, darkest corner of his mind. Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
The Element of Hyperbole.
#110789: Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:34:45 PM

I always wondered if you were to make a list of the smartest people on Earth in the Marvel universe where Doom would land.

I tend to hear that Richards is smarter than Doom, but the degree to which he's smarter than Doom seems to vary by writer.

Edited by GNinja on Oct 3rd 2019 at 3:36:53 PM

Kaze ni Nare!
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#110790: Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:35:43 PM

I could see them starting off (at least officially) with Asteroid M, on second thought, but mostly because imo the best way to introduce mutants and the related character isn't to start with the X-Men, but to filter them into the other movies bit by bit until the mutant situations wells to a head in the setting, then do an X-Men movie.

Put Mystique in Captain Marvel. Put Whirlwind in Ant-Man 3. Have, say, one of the revelations in Black Widow be that people are inexplicably being born with powers and the villain are trying to take advantage of it, have mutants become a thing Wakanda is considering - maybe even composite them with the concept of "dangerous refugees" that comes with adapting Achebe. Small bits and pieces that add up over time, like the Thanos scenes or the Nick Fury ones.

At no point in any of these situations should the mutant concept itself overtake anything from the home series, in the same way Thanos is behind Ronan, Loki and Ultron but doesn't usurp the plot from them. Instead, establish it as a running thing, then establish that it's starting to concern people. And then make it clear that violence is starting to grow, in fear of them being another threat like aliens or Ultron before them.

And then the first dedicated, official X-Men movie could be Asteroid M, maybe even composited with House of X. Magneto and Xavier are introduced as visionaries who start a haven for this new mutant population, only for the two to split on ideology, resulting in everything collapsing in ways that only make life infinitely worse for mutants in the future.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:35:55 AM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#110791: Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:36:08 PM

[up][up]Well, below RICHARDS, obviously.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:37:47 AM

LordVatek Not really a lord of anything Since: Sep, 2014
Not really a lord of anything
#110792: Oct 3rd 2019 at 8:57:05 PM

I definitely don't want them to do the original X-Men team when we could have Storm on the team instead.

Edited by LordVatek on Oct 3rd 2019 at 11:58:35 AM

This song needs more love.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#110793: Oct 3rd 2019 at 9:46:22 PM

I wouldn't mind actually.

Storm is great; I love Storm, but we've never seen the original crew together on the screen. I think that if they want to do something different from the previous series, starting with the OG crew 100% would be an interesting way to start.

Plus, back to basics has it's appeal as well.

Though I admit, there are flaws to this. I wouldn't want to wait too long for Storm and Nightcrawler, and it'd be nice to see Colossus with the team proper after kinda playing him as a joke in the Deadpool movies (though a more or less effective joke).

One Strip! One Strip!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#110794: Oct 3rd 2019 at 9:48:15 PM

Like plenty of the X-Men Storm has been horribly shafted.

Hell the Dark Phoenix's Honest Trailer acknowledging just how underused the character is was just brutal.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#110795: Oct 3rd 2019 at 10:14:29 PM

So yeah, if I was putting the X-Men in the MCU, this is how I would do it. A television season of the original first Class of X-Men that segues into a movie that introduces the Claremont era mutants that seques into a second season which segues into a second movie, et cetera. Eventually, you would get spin-off shows and movies, too.

I definitely wouldn't start off with House of X, because the entire point of HOX (and POX) is to deconstruct the X-Men and reconstruct them in a different way. It takes Xavier's Dream of human and mutant integration and says, "The dream was a lie. Mankind will never willingly accept us, therefore we must force them to accept us." For that to work, we need to see the dream first and then it's failures.

Edited by alliterator on Oct 3rd 2019 at 10:18:31 AM

chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#110796: Oct 3rd 2019 at 10:14:35 PM

I think even the actress who played Storm in Apocalypse and Dark Phoenix called out how little she actually got to do in the movies. In her own words regarding Storm entering the MCU, she said:

"I would and I wouldn't (like it), because Storm barely has anything to say as it is. I don't know about you all (other actors) but like we never talk. So it would be really nice if we weren't piled into yet another jam packed cast, in which you only see me in the back of the shot like f***ing sasquatch."

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#110797: Oct 3rd 2019 at 10:19:35 PM

Really I trust Marvel to handle larger casts than Fox.

The Guardian films have more than five characters per film & they each usually get at least one good moment.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#110798: Oct 4th 2019 at 12:03:08 AM

Sue really needs a badass portrayal.

Currently, Sue is starring in her own miniseries by Mark Waid which retcons her into being a CIA agent on the side. It's pretty good and could make for an interesting take. Though personally, I'd prefer if they continued the tradition of making her a scientist like the previous movies did (yes I know they weren't very good but the thought counts). And the MCU is lacking in female geniuses anyway.

GNinja The Element of Hyperbole. from The deepest, darkest corner of his mind. Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
The Element of Hyperbole.
#110799: Oct 4th 2019 at 12:05:32 AM

[up] Wait, isn't the current smartest person on the planet in the MCU a woman?

I'm not saying there shouldn't be more btw, but that's still a pretty impressive feather in the cap.

Edited by GNinja on Oct 4th 2019 at 7:07:07 PM

Kaze ni Nare!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#110800: Oct 4th 2019 at 12:07:37 AM

I mean the "whole smartest person on the planet" is just one big pissing contest, its more about stroking ones ego.

Plus its not exactly quantifiable since all the super scientists are in heavily specialized fields of science.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."

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