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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#110726: Oct 1st 2019 at 2:04:06 PM

As soon as the vibranium engine stopped applying a cohesive force to the city, it would begin to disintegrate on its own through simple mechanical stress without any help from the Avengers. As I said, it is too large to have structural integrity.

However, that still leaves building-size objects hitting the ground at terminal velocity. That's really bad. Breaking them apart would help, a little. Maybe.

It's probably not worth pointing out the energy requirement to mechanically destroy a city, even if you aren't literally vaporizing it... Sci-Fi Writers Have No Sense of Scale.

Edited by Fighteer on Oct 1st 2019 at 5:07:40 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#110727: Oct 1st 2019 at 2:09:16 PM

It's probably not worth pointing out the energy requirement
Hey, hey, Tony's entire thing is clean energy! So he was probably using Arc Reactor energy, which, as we all know, is totally fictional and therefore totally safe.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#110728: Oct 1st 2019 at 2:21:18 PM

Edith probably didn't exist at all at the time.

It feels like something that would be made after the Ultron project went bad.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#110729: Oct 1st 2019 at 8:11:10 PM

So apparently all the Marvel shows on Disney+ are getting budgets of up to $25 million an episode. Meanwhile the four Netflix Marvel shows had a collective budget of $200 million between them.

Red Ronin. You have the cash, make someone fight Red Ronin.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#110730: Oct 1st 2019 at 8:27:20 PM

Jesus Christ. I thought they were going to have a budget of $100 million a season (which would be six to eight episodes, so that's $12 to $16 million an episode), but that's $200 million for eight episodes ($150 million if they only make six), which is a lot of money. I guess when they said that these shows would be similar to the movies, that's what they meant.

To give a hint about how much money this is, Agents of SHIELD generally has a budget of about $3 million an episode (the only exception was the pilot, which was $8-12 million, but that's the pilot). And that budget was slashed for Season 5, too.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#110731: Oct 1st 2019 at 8:33:03 PM

Not to mention the Mandalorian, their big launch show for Disney+, only had a budget of 100$ million in comparison.

This is bonkers. I guess all we need to worry about is the writing: the special effects and visuals are going to be something else no matter what.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Oct 1st 2019 at 8:33:17 AM

Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#110732: Oct 1st 2019 at 8:34:02 PM

Huh, guess that explains the lack of costumes for stuff like Iron Fist or Luke Cage.

Just Makima.
chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#110733: Oct 1st 2019 at 8:37:38 PM

Wait, SHIELD's budget was slashed in the fifth season?

But that was the one where they went into space... in the future!

And yes, I know a lot of that was set in narrow corridors as a cost-saving maneuver, I just find the premise at odds with what budget cuts usually do.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#110734: Oct 1st 2019 at 8:40:20 PM

wild mass guessThe first episode of "Falcon and Winter Soldier" will be a high budget reenactment of the entire final battle of Endgame from their point of view.

In the following 7 episodes, they sit on a couch and riff commercials.wild mass guess

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#110735: Oct 1st 2019 at 8:41:27 PM

So that's the real reason why we never saw a live dragon in Iron Fist or how we never got any historical flashbacks whenever Sigourney Weaver's character recalled her immortal adventures.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#110736: Oct 1st 2019 at 8:46:23 PM

[up][up]So essentially Beavis and Butthead...

I’d be down for an episode.

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#110737: Oct 1st 2019 at 8:49:07 PM

I thought it was pretty clear the prior TV stuff was made relatively on the cheap. Compared to the movies. That's why in those early days when people kept asking when were Iron Man and the Hulk gonna show up in AOS, I knew it wasn't gonna happen. Even once you get past RDJ's massive paycheck, 5 minutes of Iron Man would probably take their effects budget for the whole season.

Edited by comicwriter on Oct 1st 2019 at 8:49:49 AM

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#110738: Oct 1st 2019 at 8:49:13 PM

Wait, SHIELD's budget was slashed in the fifth season?

But that was the one where they went into space... in the future!

Yep, after Season 4, it was reported that AOS had been renewed for Season 5, but with a reduced budget. However, Season 4 had already ended with the "Coulson in space" tease, so they pretty much had to do that. In fact, AOS's continued use of their low budget is a thing of amazement — they do things with less money that a lot of movies with more money struggle at. For example: the Ghost Rider in Season 4 looks amazing, even when you compare it to the movie version. But it cost so much that they were only able to use the transforming CGI about once an episode and then, after eight episodes, put Ghost Rider in Offscreensville (aka "Hell") for the rest of the season until the Season Finale.

This is a very cool VFX breakdown of Season 4:

And here's a breakdown of Season 5's VFX:

Edited by alliterator on Oct 1st 2019 at 8:55:36 AM

KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#110739: Oct 2nd 2019 at 1:49:51 AM

Something sounds severely off, Game of Thrones was averaging 15 million an episode and the most expensive tv episodes period tended to be rooted in the pilots due to shouldering all the cost of casting, set construction and Stock Footage effects that will be used for the rest of the show, and even those top out around 25 million.

So dumping 25 million per episode for each series sounds like the worst idea in a long history of bad ideas.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#110740: Oct 2nd 2019 at 2:01:54 AM

Yeah, thinking it over, I'm thinking that the report is wrong. Looking over the article again, it says:

Spinning out of a Variety report that suggested Marvel Studios could end up taking over Marvel Television and have all shows at one studio, insiders suggested Disney would end up spending anywhere from $12 million to $25 million per episode.
So, 1) it's from "insiders," so we don't know how reliable it is and 2) it's "anywhere from $12 million to $25 million," which is completely different from saying every episode is $25 million.

(Plus, there is no way that Marvel Television is going to be "taken over" by Marvel Studios.)

Furthermore, looking at the Variety article, this is what it actually states:

All of the shows that Marvel Studios is producing are expected to be six to eight episodes in length with budgets comparable to a Marvel film project, which typically run between $100 and $150 million.
So it doesn't even say the individual episode budget, only that each show will have a budget "comparable to a Marvel film project." Which means that we could have an eight episode show where the budget for each episode is $12.5 million or a six episode show where each episode cost $16 million or whatever. There is nothing definitive here.

Which means the article is, let's say it now: cliiiiick baaaaaait.

Edited by alliterator on Oct 2nd 2019 at 2:02:12 AM

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#110741: Oct 2nd 2019 at 2:25:29 AM

Given Netflix’s financial troubles, one can only speculate on if Disney will be able to gain a streaming audience large enough to sustain that level of budget for all its shows. It’s a tall order in uncharted territory.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Oct 2nd 2019 at 2:27:11 AM

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#110742: Oct 2nd 2019 at 5:52:34 AM

Pretty sure Disney's partly responsible for those financial troubles. Netflix is bleeding shareholders as we get closer to the Disney+ launch.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#110743: Oct 2nd 2019 at 5:55:32 AM

I could very easily see Disney giving them the Hulu treatment,buying a significant portion of their shares until they practically own them

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#110744: Oct 2nd 2019 at 6:56:09 AM

They said “up to” for a reason on the cost.

And I still want Red Ronin fighting something. I honestly don’t care who’s fighting it. It could be Shang Chi hijacking it to fight Fin Fang Foom for all I care...and holy hell I want that now.

[up]They’d probably just drive in into bankruptcy and buy individual licenses at that point. Like a fire sale.

Edited by Beatman1 on Oct 2nd 2019 at 9:57:07 AM

ShadowWingLG Since: Dec, 2013
#110745: Oct 2nd 2019 at 8:12:07 AM

Another Nod to the Ao S FX crews, not only did they pull off Ghost Rider well, but they had to render FOUR DIFFERENT GHOST RIDERS (Robbie, Johnny, Mack and Coulson) in that season, and all 4 were distinctive/different they didn't apply the same trick to all four holders of the Spirit they made each 'holder' different which couldn't have been good for the budget.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#110746: Oct 2nd 2019 at 8:16:24 AM

[up] Also, one of the subtle differences is Johnny's Ghost Rider skull has a bullet hole in it, a nod to an event in the comics when Johnny was shot in the head with a holy bullet.

TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#110747: Oct 2nd 2019 at 8:08:20 PM

Cross-posting from the Spider-Man: Far From Home thread:

According to Hollywood Reporter, Tom Holland himself saved the Spider-Man deal and got Disney and Sony to talk again.

I guess Stan Lee was right:

"One person can make a difference."

'Nuff said. [awesome][awesome][awesome]

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#110748: Oct 2nd 2019 at 8:08:54 PM

A superhero indeed.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#110749: Oct 2nd 2019 at 8:24:31 PM

Good ol Spider-Man! *Vulture grin*

Just Makima.
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#110750: Oct 2nd 2019 at 8:25:00 PM

I couldn't resist making this.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!

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