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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

fredhot16 Don't want to leave but cannot pretend from Baton Rogue, Louisiana. Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: Too sexy for my shirt
Don't want to leave but cannot pretend
#110701: Oct 1st 2019 at 10:47:35 AM

[up]Why wasn't he an actual ant? That was the one thing I wanted.

Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#110702: Oct 1st 2019 at 10:48:31 AM

I prefer Giant man

Edited by Ultimatum on Oct 1st 2019 at 5:49:10 PM

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#110703: Oct 1st 2019 at 10:48:56 AM

"Burning up in the atmosphere" means a huge firestorm that incinerates everything for thousands of miles, and creates monster storms that batter the rest of the planet.
I'm sorry, what? That's not what "burning up in the atmosphere" means at all. Where are you getting your information? When a meteor burns up in the atmosphere, it means that the meteor burns up due to the friction from hitting the atmosphere — but the atmosphere itself doesn't light on fire. In fact, nothing else catches on fire other than the meteor itself. So: no "huge firestorms" or "monster storms." That's not how that works at all.

Meteors hit the Earth all the time, but most are too small to do any impact. Most, in fact, burn up on entry. The only ones that do impact the Earth and cause damage are the ones that are huge — generally, miles across.

All that energy has to go somewhere.
Yes: the energy — specifically, the friction due to the speed of the fall — is what causes the meteor to burn up. That burning is where the energy goes.

Then again, Civil War showed that you could be miles out of the city and still be killed by falling debris. So...
I assume that Zemo's family died when the city was being lifted in the first place and the debris from the edges of the city fell on them (since they were "miles from the city").

Edited by alliterator on Oct 1st 2019 at 10:53:02 AM

AyyItsMidnight Look, just be decent to one another ok? Since: Oct, 2018
Look, just be decent to one another ok?
#110704: Oct 1st 2019 at 10:50:40 AM

Well, it's a cute decently enjoyable little side movie that's something of a breather after Age of Ultron, but it's not too much of a standout. It also features one of the few good MCU dads with Scott Lang. I mean, he's in the same universe as Odin, Ego, Thanos, and to a lesser extent T'Chaka, so it's not hard for him to claim that distinction. @Andrei

Edited by AyyItsMidnight on Oct 1st 2019 at 10:51:25 AM

Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#110705: Oct 1st 2019 at 10:51:17 AM

Scott is the best dad in the MCU.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#110706: Oct 1st 2019 at 10:54:47 AM

Ant-Man has some structural problems caused by the new director trying to work with what Edgar Wright made before he left but its somewhat made up by the sequel.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#110707: Oct 1st 2019 at 11:06:34 AM

Ant-Man is lucky with all the behind the scenes issues that it got made at all,seemed like all we heard for awhile were problems with making the film,thankfully despite this they made a great film and even better sequel

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#110708: Oct 1st 2019 at 11:10:48 AM

I think Ant-Man is an underrated film, although I admit it does have it's flaws.

I remember all the problems that happened during production, particularly Edgar Wright leaving a few weeks before shooting was supposed to start. That combined with how Ant-Man wasn't exactly the most popular hero, and I thought it was going to be the first bomb in the MCU. I was very happy to be proven wrong.

Of course, Wright's film is always going to be one of the great What If's in the MCU, since he's one of the most visually distinctive directors working today. I've heard a few thing weren't in his early draft that would've changed the film (no Falcon, no Luis rambles, Hope had a smaller role, Jan wasn't even the Wasp in this version, etc). I think the film we got was the best possible version given the circumstances.

At the very least, he probably had the free time to work on Baby Driver, so hey. Win/Win.

Edited by chasemaddigan on Oct 1st 2019 at 2:12:08 PM

JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
#110709: Oct 1st 2019 at 11:14:35 AM

I hope to see Cassie Lang as a superhero, in a movie or series of Young Avengers.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#110710: Oct 1st 2019 at 11:17:40 AM

Me too, I hope the next Ant-Man movie is "Ant-Man and the Wasp and Stature".

eligram Since: Sep, 2009 Relationship Status: In denial
#110711: Oct 1st 2019 at 11:26:19 AM

Also Hank Pym is Crazy Awesome, and it may do a better job at making you care about an ant than A Bug's Life.

Also, the scene I can't stop gushing about tongue.

alanh Since: May, 2010
#110712: Oct 1st 2019 at 11:39:03 AM

Individual meteors do heat up the atmosphere. The streak behind meteors is the incandescent air. They're small (sand or pebbles) so the heating is small.

The Tunguska Event flattened 2000 km^2 and never even hit the ground, disintegrating in the air. It's believed to have been a body at most 190m in diameter. Anything that big pretty much has to break up. The aerodyamic forces acting on it are stronger than the forces holding the rock together.

The city in AoU is at least a couple km across.

So yeah, even if it detonates in the air like the Tunguska object did, it's really bad. Not an extintion level event, but at a bare minimum as bad as Krakatoa which could be heard 5000km away and altered the world's weather for years.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#110713: Oct 1st 2019 at 11:53:31 AM

Ant-Man is good but its sequel is one of my favorite MCU films out of all of them. It's just... a perfect low-stakes action-filled romp.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#110714: Oct 1st 2019 at 12:13:42 PM

Edgar Wright's departure isn't what screwed up Ant-Man. His script is. He wrote the film to be about the relationship between fathers and their daughters, but exclusively from the perspective of the fathers. The film's central theme is "Wow, daughters, amirite?"

The subsequent creative team did their best to make the Daughter Lamps into an actual presence in the film. They did not succeed. There was only so much they could do without scrapping the script entirely.

The second film, not born of Wright's script was a vast improvement.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#110715: Oct 1st 2019 at 12:18:47 PM

Cassie: "Maybe you need a partner, dad"
Scott: "You think I should make up with Hope?"
Cassie: "Oh, you thought I meant Hope. Yeah. Sure. Thats fine."

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#110716: Oct 1st 2019 at 12:22:14 PM

I love Ant Man for subverting the typical "Dad doesn't get along with step-dad" cliche.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#110717: Oct 1st 2019 at 12:56:33 PM

The city in AoU is at least a couple km across.

So yeah, even if it detonates in the air like the Tunguska object did, it's really bad. Not an extinction level event, but at a bare minimum as bad as Krakatoa which could be heard 5000km away and altered the world's weather for years.

But it's not "detonating" in the air; it's not exploding, it's being broken up into pieces by an outside force. And Stark pretty much knew what he was doing, so he wasn't going to leave any big pieces to impact the Earth. Again: most of Sokovia was probably dust when it fell to Earth. As for any climate shift, well, they would have taken care of that, too. Since none happened.

Edited by alliterator on Oct 1st 2019 at 12:59:13 PM

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#110718: Oct 1st 2019 at 1:02:06 PM

This is also a movie where a flying robot was built from a purple guy's glowstick and went evil after browsing the Internet for a minute. tongue

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#110719: Oct 1st 2019 at 1:06:25 PM

Honestly, that "drop a city and it erases humanity" idea is dumb. Terminal velocity for something that mass and shape is maybe a kilometer per second when it falls straight down from a few kilometers of altitude. It's not even out of the atmosphere and has no orbital velocity. Meteors come in at no less than escape velocity (11+ km/sec) and usually at an angle to the ground.

Sure, it'd make a huge boom and anyone within a few hundred kilometers would have a really bad day, but it's nothing world-ending. Breaking it up into bits minimizes the direct impact, but now you're dropping a few gigatons of loose sand/dirt/rock/metal on the ground instead of one big chunk. Take a handful of dirt and drop it on the ground, but multiply by a billion. Very little of it would vaporize in the atmosphere because it can't gain enough speed before reaching terminal velocity. There'd be relatively little impact damage but a massive dust plume stretching for hundreds of kilometers.

In fact, literally vaporizing all that material would be a much worse catastrophe than letting it hit the ground. The energy required would be like exploding hundreds of nukes ... airborne nukes, at that. You wouldn't set the global atmosphere on fire but it would be a catastrophe on an unimaginable scale.

Breaking it up into chunks without vaporizing it is probably the best option out of a very bad set.

Edited by Fighteer on Oct 1st 2019 at 4:10:46 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Blueace Surrounded by weirdoes from The End Of the World Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Surrounded by weirdoes
#110720: Oct 1st 2019 at 1:06:52 PM

Just thank it didn't spend there another minute.

Wake me up at your own risk.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#110721: Oct 1st 2019 at 1:25:09 PM

[up][up][up] Heh the latter is the most realistic thing about the movie.

Edited by slimcoder on Oct 1st 2019 at 1:25:19 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#110722: Oct 1st 2019 at 1:37:01 PM

The energy required would be like exploding hundreds of nukes ... airborne nukes, at that.
It actually didn't look like it required that much energy to break the city apart. Perhaps it was because it was only being held together by a vibranium engine and vibranium has special properties.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#110723: Oct 1st 2019 at 1:38:18 PM

Vaporizing the city means turning all of its material to vapor: that is, heating it until it boils. We use that term way too casually.

Breaking it apart is actually quite easy. Something that large has no mechanical stability. Without a force holding it together, it would come apart on its own anyway.

Edited by Fighteer on Oct 1st 2019 at 4:40:30 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#110724: Oct 1st 2019 at 1:58:14 PM

Vaporizing the city means turning all of its material to vapor
Well, that's just being super literal, now isn't it?

Yeah, I don't think the Avengers vaporized the city — it looks, instead, like they shot the city into pieces that were small enough to make no impact. In fact, I believe they shot the city right as the engine stopped, meaning they shot it as it fell, possibly reducing the impact even less?

Hey, you know what would have been good in that situation? EDITH drones.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#110725: Oct 1st 2019 at 2:04:01 PM

Or Ultron just hijacks those and now he's got even more death bots.

And arguably deadlier ones. tongue


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