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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#107851: Aug 24th 2019 at 6:47:50 PM

[up][up][up]There's only one What If? show. Wandavision is said to be canon and will lead into the Doctor Strange sequel.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#107854: Aug 24th 2019 at 8:11:45 PM

The expected backlash to Ms. Marvel has begun, with everyone calling the head writer a racist.

Disappointed but not surprised. The second the show was announced people were expecting a racist backlash.

Edited by Beatman1 on Aug 24th 2019 at 11:13:15 AM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#107855: Aug 24th 2019 at 8:13:09 PM

Huh what words are they twisting this time?

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#107856: Aug 24th 2019 at 8:22:13 PM

[up]Tweets from the head writer about she apparently hates white people.

On a more positive note, Dan Slott offers advice on casting for She-Hulk.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#107857: Aug 24th 2019 at 8:51:44 PM

It's crazy that we've actually gotten to the point in society where racists can get away with calling the people they're racist against "racist", just because they're vocal about how racists are bad people. It's so ridiculously backwards.

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#107858: Aug 24th 2019 at 9:06:02 PM

[up]it remind of article saying kind of the blame of Is relativism Being hijack by idiots who try to make doubt everything in order to spread their bullshit.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#107859: Aug 24th 2019 at 9:09:26 PM

An encounter I had with a troll today says a lot about their modus-operand.

Just regurgitate the same lines over & over again when called out. They repeat the same shit a lot.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
MedusaStone Since: Jan, 2015
#107860: Aug 24th 2019 at 10:40:10 PM

Kind of reminds me of something I heard a comedian say once:"we can't become so tolerant that we tolerate intolerance".

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#107861: Aug 24th 2019 at 11:11:43 PM

It’s generally how that works. Keep repeating the same stuff and ignoring the facts until people start listening to you over those facts, and/or long enough such that you outlast those countering you with those facts and move on, leaving you as the only voice on the subject.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#107862: Aug 25th 2019 at 12:41:07 AM

Which is pretty much Gaslighting.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#107863: Aug 25th 2019 at 12:43:23 AM

That... has literally nothing to do with gaslighting.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Shadao Dorzma Forever! Artwork by Kris Dobbins. (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Dorzma Forever! Artwork by Kris Dobbins.
#107864: Aug 25th 2019 at 1:25:02 AM

Eventually, the cries of "reverse-racism" will become hollow and fall deaf on ears because, ironically, over saturating the "complaints" doesn't make it true; it just becomes annoying like a Crying Wolf.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#107865: Aug 25th 2019 at 1:42:24 AM

[up][up]Repeating the same lies over and over again until it makes people doubt reality?

That's gaslighting in a nutshell.

Disgusted, but not surprised
AyyItsMidnight Look, just be decent to one another ok? Since: Oct, 2018
Look, just be decent to one another ok?
#107867: Aug 25th 2019 at 2:40:32 AM

A few things on my mind here.

First off, even with some alt-rightish dickweed circles, these movies and shows with more diversity than before are still gonna make the mad dosh and be successful, because, well, it's the MCU and MCU works basically have a license to do so. Captain Marvel, even with the shit it was getting, still made a LOT of money, and plenty of people wanted a Black Widow movie for a while, so that's got that going for it as well. So the backlash won't do those idiots much good, methinks.

Secondly, sans Black Panther and Captain Marvel we've already had an entire damn cinematic saga of movies led and directed by cishet white dudes! You've already gotten so many of them! They're not going anywhere, they'll always be there for you to come back to, you've had enough already. I love this universe and franchise dearly, but it's long overdue for some damn change.

Edited by AyyItsMidnight on Aug 25th 2019 at 2:40:48 AM

Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#107868: Aug 25th 2019 at 3:11:55 AM

Huh back on the idea of bringing in the Ultimates & portraying them as evil versions of the Avengers, Ultimate Captain America could be portrayed not only as a jingoistic jar-head warmonger but also an alt-right shit-head.

Could lead to some intense stuff especially if Captain Falcon punches his lights out though I don't think I'd ever want Chris Evans doing such a role.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#107869: Aug 25th 2019 at 3:12:58 AM

You could just have someone else playing U.S. Agent, who pretty much is "Captain America but if he were a xenophobic alt-right shithead".

Disgusted, but not surprised
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#107870: Aug 25th 2019 at 3:14:13 AM

True, true we also U.S. Agent for such a portrayal.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
megaeliz Since: Mar, 2017
#107871: Aug 25th 2019 at 4:33:12 AM

I believe Disney Proposed a 30/70 split in Sony's favor.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#107872: Aug 25th 2019 at 7:35:46 AM

Eventually, the cries of "reverse-racism" will become hollow and fall deaf on ears because, ironically, over saturating the "complaints" doesn't make it true; it just becomes annoying like a Crying Wolf.

That's not a bug, it's a feature. By diminishing the meaning of "racism", the Alt-Right hopes to achieve that exact Crying Wolf effect, whereby the very concept of racism begins to fall on deaf ears no matter who's saying it. Their goal is to devalue the very idea of racism; they want to muddy the conversation so much that moderates just get tired of hearing it.

Kinda like how some people wouldn't give the Trump-Russia thing the time of day 'cause "New President, new conspiracy. Just like 9/11 truthers and birtherism." The Alt-Right wants to achieve that effect with racism accuastions.

Huh back on the idea of bringing in the Ultimates & portraying them as evil versions of the Avengers, Ultimate Captain America could be portrayed not only as a jingoistic jar-head warmonger but also an alt-right shit-head.

Could lead to some intense stuff especially if Captain Falcon punches his lights out though I don't think I'd ever want Chris Evans doing such a role.

If they were going to do that, I'd prefer they use William Burnside aka 50's Cap. I know the comics used U.S. Agent as an obstacle for Sam's Cap, but they also had a whole shpeal where he was being misled 'cause of white privilege. If you want a jingoistic asshole, you go Burnside.

Burnside was the product of the Red Scare. In the wake of WWII, Marvel spent like a decade having Captain America hunt down Communists. Then, after the country woke up to how awful that whole debacle had been, Marvel had a bit of a situation on their hands with the character.

Their solution: Communist-punchin' jingoist Captain America was a replacement douchebag brought in after the real Captain America mysteriously disappeared. Steve had really been frozen in a block of ice all this time, and had nothing to do with all that Communist-punching nonsense.

If you want Sam and Bucky to fight an Alt-Right quasi-Nazi white supremacist asshole trying to claim the name of Captain America for himself, Burnside is just the asshole you're looking for.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Aug 25th 2019 at 8:38:02 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#107873: Aug 25th 2019 at 7:37:40 AM

Except Burnside might actually be considered sympathetic in today's environment, given the hostility towards the Kremlin these days.

Disgusted, but not surprised
Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#107874: Aug 25th 2019 at 8:09:41 AM

[up] No one really liked the Kremlin when the Burnside retcon happened either.

It's just that the red scare had subsided enough that punching someone just for having vaguely communist views was no longer appropriate for Captain America.

chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#107875: Aug 25th 2019 at 8:13:22 AM

I mean, if we were to do a modernized take on a communist-hating Captain America, wouldn't he be ranting against China? Russia's technically no longer communist anymore.


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