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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#106926: Aug 16th 2019 at 9:18:35 AM

[up][up]Well, Nova is probably a giant crater on the ground, and during the "Thanos Imperative-War of Kings-Annihilation" cosmic Marvel period, Nova was the only one out there in space.

One could use that setup to bring him in, like say, the destruction Thanos wrought awakened an entity living inside the planet and chose this random Latin looking Human Alien as its host.

Edited by HailMuffins on Aug 16th 2019 at 1:19:50 PM

Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#106927: Aug 16th 2019 at 5:50:33 PM

I really don't want it to establish a new Black Widow.

Fans have been fighting for years to get this film made because they identified with Nat. It would be a final insult to injury for Marvel to go, "We're finally making a Black Widow film series! But it's still not the Widow you actually wanted, because f*ck you."

I'd honestly rather it just be a single one-and-done prequel than for Marvel, in yet another act of tone-deafness, to write the specific Black Widow character fans fell in love with out of her own film series.

People didn't spend years fighting for this movie to exist because they just wanted a movie to exist that has the words "Black Widow" in the title. They did it for Nat.

To be clear, I do think that the movie should be a Natasha movie first and foremost.

I see a puzzle presented in the question of "How does the Black Widow movie tie in to what is happening in the modern story?", after all every flashback movie the MCU has done has tied into the movies that followed it in some fashion. This is exactly the kind of puzzle I find absolutely irresistible.

When I come across such a puzzle, I find the general solutions and then try to figure out the best possible version of all general solutions. I actually very rarely have a strong opinion as to which general solution I prefer.

Basically I care little for the question whether we get a successor to Natasha or Natasha survives into the modern story, but I care a great deal as to how the successor is established or the circumstances of Natasha's survival. Those are the questions that interest me.

In the case of establishing a successor, I would say the best possible version is the movie is still very much Natasha's story. Her successor is involved in the events of the movie, but as a supporting character. When we see the next Black Widow in the "modern" story, it's very much in the context of showing how Natasha is having a positive impact on the world even beyond her own death.

Weirdguy149 Former King from Lumiose City Since: Jul, 2014 Relationship Status: I'd jump in front of a train for ya!
Former King
#106928: Aug 16th 2019 at 6:26:48 PM

I'd honestly like the final scene of Black Widow to be her falling in slow motion while a female cover of "My Way" starts playing. When she hits the ground, hard cut to the credits where the impact of her death is shown. At the end would be the stinger at her grave, where Yelena vows to take on the role of Black Widow.

The legend has returned.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#106929: Aug 16th 2019 at 6:36:49 PM

I'd prefer it if Natasha's hand just busts out of her grave instead.

One Strip! One Strip!
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#106930: Aug 16th 2019 at 6:59:52 PM

“HAH SOUL STONE”

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#106931: Aug 16th 2019 at 10:05:06 PM

I don't think Spider-Woman would've fit the first Captain Marvel movie regardless of the rights entanglement. There was enough going on without introducing another superhero with an unrelated origin (unless they wanted to have her get her powers from the Kree).

A present day sequel? Perhaps.

Edited by comicwriter on Aug 16th 2019 at 10:05:20 AM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#106932: Aug 16th 2019 at 10:24:39 PM

Jessica Drew would've worked in what was Fury's role, but then we wouldn't have the Arc Welding between Carol's story and the rest of the MCU.

Also, IIRC the deal with Spider-Woman was no codename or costumed identity, but I don't think it included powers or actually being a hero: they could have simply done her the way they Agents of SHIELD did Mockingbird (that is, as a hero suerspy without a codename). Which makes sense, given that Jessica's powers have jack all to do with Spidey's.

It also for some reason let Marvel do whatever they wanted with Julia Carpenter (again, as long they didn't specifically call her Spider-Woman), a character far more Spider-Man adjacent than Jessica Drew.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Aug 16th 2019 at 10:29:36 AM

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#106934: Aug 17th 2019 at 12:18:53 PM

[up] I don't know if having context will improve this video, but it's hard to improve absolute perfection.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#106935: Aug 17th 2019 at 12:20:38 PM

Owlkitty just really likes being in movies.

Thor's reaction is also my own when I see a cat. [lol]

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Aug 17th 2019 at 1:16:37 AM

AyyItsMidnight Look, just be decent to one another ok? Since: Oct, 2018
Look, just be decent to one another ok?
#106936: Aug 18th 2019 at 2:25:41 PM

https://musingsfromanotherstar.blogspot.com/2019/07/my-complicated-relationship-with-thor-odinson.html?m=1.

I stumbled on this blog post that provides an interesting look back at Thor over the years.Maybe a few hot takes here and there.

Edited by AyyItsMidnight on Aug 18th 2019 at 2:26:22 AM

Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#106938: Aug 19th 2019 at 2:54:40 PM

Pete and Pete

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#106939: Aug 19th 2019 at 3:29:20 PM

So I'm listening to a video my bro is watching, and it claims that Nova was part of the final battle of Endgame.

It's not really clear if it's Richard Ryder or Sam Alexander though. That being said, the five year time jump does provide an offscreen time for the Nova Corps to rebuild post Thanos spanking them and maybe creating the helmets to buff their powers.

One Strip! One Strip!
Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#106940: Aug 19th 2019 at 3:33:56 PM

I really need to review who the non A-list or B-list people were in that battle.

IIRC Strange pulled in guys from Kamar-Tag, School of Kung Fu and Wizardy. T'Challa brought in a bunch of warrior tribes from Wakanda.

Then there were a bunch of ships I'm guessing were Wakandan.

I'm almost certain that when Wasp showed up we saw some non-humans in the crowd who came from... who knows. Friends of the Guardians, I guess?

How did Strange have this many people on speed-dial?

I know that most of this can literally be explained by Strange and Wong using magic, but, now that I think about it, what the actual f-ck with that scene.

One moment they're all dead. The next Benedict Cumberbatch opens a portal to tell them all that a fight is going on. The next they're all totally down for fighting giant alien space worms and space orcs. Like ok maybe the martial arts magic school was ready for this, but the New Asgardians had just settled on Earth for five years. note 

Edited by Soble on Aug 19th 2019 at 3:43:26 AM

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#106941: Aug 19th 2019 at 3:35:29 PM

So I'm listening to a video my bro is watching, and it claims that Nova was part of the final battle of Endgame.
The Russo Brothers did an interview today where they claimed that they sneaked in Richard Rider in the final battle in Endgame. It was clearly a joke, but a lot of people took it seriously. Later, they clarified that, yes, they were joking.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#106942: Aug 19th 2019 at 3:39:13 PM

Strange and Wong also brought the Ravagers... and Howard the Duck.

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#106943: Aug 19th 2019 at 3:42:42 PM

I pointed out at the time that it'd be pretty easy (and pretty likely) for characters in the future to retroactively claim they were present at the last battle of Endgame off-screen due its sheer size and scope.

I can pretty much see antagonists in Black Panther II and Doctor Strange II using the final battle of Endgame as a jumping point ("Our brothers died for your mistake!" and so forth).

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#106944: Aug 19th 2019 at 3:46:58 PM

Ah. That's a shame.

We're all waiting for Dick RICHARD Ryder to make his debut...

....though I like Sam's costume better. I know his first appearance didn't endear him to many people, but that's a good costume.

One Strip! One Strip!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#106945: Aug 19th 2019 at 3:51:27 PM

Hey if Dick Ryder gets in the MCU Gamora could finally find a worthy romantic partner. tongue

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#106946: Aug 19th 2019 at 3:53:48 PM

Decent odds says she ends up with Adam Warlock.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#106947: Aug 19th 2019 at 3:54:47 PM

I mean, as long as Warlock isn't an asshole.

Hell, it'd be great if he was legitimately better than Quill, and not just in the low bar sense.

One Strip! One Strip!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#106948: Aug 19th 2019 at 3:57:46 PM

Considering Warlock will be born in G3 I can assume he’ll be a whimsical fantastical kinda guy who’s naïveté about the world all make sure him very charming especially to the battle-hardened cynical assassin.

Like a reversal of the typical plot where the Macguffin female who’s lack of world knowledge & childlike Wonder makes them a marvel to the male love interest.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
AyyItsMidnight Look, just be decent to one another ok? Since: Oct, 2018
Look, just be decent to one another ok?
#106949: Aug 19th 2019 at 6:12:56 PM

Welp, I've got Endgame digitally now, so I might as well see how it holds up.

Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)
Kakuzan Let memes die. Kill them, if you have to. from Knock knock, open up the door, it's real. Since: Dec, 2014 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
Let memes die. Kill them, if you have to.
#106950: Aug 19th 2019 at 6:17:55 PM

I'm rewatching right now myself. Apparently the opening scene was meant to be in Infinity War (please correct me if I'm wrong)? If true, then I think it was a wise decision to have Endgame open with it.

Edit: I say that since I'd say the scene perfectly captures the terror and confusion people felt when the Snap happened. We saw that in Infinity War, but it didn't seem like there was much time to really linger on it. The scene also helps set the tone and feels like a way to subtly remind watchers of the fallout from the previous film.

Edited by Kakuzan on Aug 19th 2019 at 9:39:52 AM

Don't catch you slippin' now.

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