TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Marvel Cinematic Universe

Go To

Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Cortez from Parts Unknown (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#105801: Jul 22nd 2019 at 6:56:51 AM

[up]×5

Exactly and Darcy fit the criteria.

Anyway, yeah i hope she stuck with Jane all those years.

Edited by Cortez on Jul 22nd 2019 at 9:57:30 AM

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#105802: Jul 22nd 2019 at 7:08:54 AM

Going back to Thor 1, Darcy was amazing.

Jane was okay. She didn't really get obnoxious until The Dark World.

Selvig was "My girlfriend's dad." That was 100% his archetype. It was the beginning and end of his character.

Marvel Studios greatly misjudged the reception to this cast when they decided that the Breakout Character everyone wanted to see more of was Selvig. They even brought him into the comics!

Edited by TobiasDrake on Jul 22nd 2019 at 8:09:56 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#105803: Jul 22nd 2019 at 7:12:24 AM

They were following the Iron man formula at the time I think,which would explain a lot

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#105804: Jul 22nd 2019 at 7:14:20 AM

I've said before that Phase 3 is really when Marvel started becoming comfortable enough with their characters to take risks with the stories. Phase 1 was super-formulaic but it built enough trust with the audience to allow for that risk-taking.

A major studio actually caring about what the audience likes and wants while simultaneously messing with their formulas in an attempt to bring in new things? It's like lightning striking twice on a winning lottery ticket!

Edited by Fighteer on Jul 22nd 2019 at 10:15:53 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#105805: Jul 22nd 2019 at 7:16:45 AM

Phase 2 was kind of a mess between trying to keep to the formula and trying to experiment more.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#105806: Jul 22nd 2019 at 7:16:49 AM

Yeah I recall Darcy & co were pretty charming in Thor 1 but they ended up overdialing them for Thor 2 & it wound up annoying.

Too much comedy.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
ShadowWingLG Since: Dec, 2013
#105807: Jul 22nd 2019 at 7:38:15 AM

MCU Phase 2 was half of the creative team wanting to 'Stick to Formula' and half the team wanting to try new stuff now they had their footing and the cash to actually take some risks hence all the behind the scenes drama that caused Portman to leave. Phase 3 was shedding the last of the people refusing to take risks.

HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#105808: Jul 22nd 2019 at 7:55:23 AM

[up]Not coincidentally, Phase 3 was when the "Creative" Committee and Perlmutter lost their influence over the Studio.

Edited by HailMuffins on Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:55:41 AM

theLibrarian Since: Jul, 2009
#105809: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:22:08 AM

Aren't the Celestials people like that one person in Guardians of the Galaxy that used the Power Stone to destroy a planet?

And I forget, what was the final straw that Feigel wanted to get rid of Perlmutter or he'd quit?

Edited by theLibrarian on Jul 22nd 2019 at 1:23:33 PM

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#105810: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:39:22 AM

And I forget, what was the final straw that Feigel wanted to get rid of Perlmutter or he'd quit?
They were arguing over Captain America: Civil War and Perlmutter didn't want to pay RDJ a lot of money and eventually threatened to make sure RDJ wasn't even in the movie, so Feige went over his head to Alan Horn.

They went through a lot of drafts of Civil War — some with Spider-Man, some without Spider-Man (Tony would recruit Ant-Man instead of Spider-Man), and one version without Tony at all (Markus and McFeely said they were trying to do a version of the "Madbomb" story, but it wasn't working at all).

Edited by alliterator on Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:39:45 AM

ShadowWingLG Since: Dec, 2013
#105811: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:41:45 AM

IIRC it was his continuing inference, with Civil War being the breaking point, you can see the cracks before that in IM 3, Dark World, Ao U and Antman, where there was EPIC amounts of meddling that altered the final form of all of those films. And the borderline blackmail to get Captain Marvel and Black Panther green lit didn't help.

The story goes that Feige was getting irritated with Perlmutter's penny pinching in Civil War...to the point where they were rumors that Perlmutter wanted to FIRE RDJ from the film because he felt his salary was too high and REPLACE him going forward, finally Feige told Disney "He goes or I go!" And rather than lose Feige they moved Marvel Studios to Disney and out of Perlmutter's hands, though the latter still had control of the TV side of things.

[up][nja]

Edited by ShadowWingLG on Jul 22nd 2019 at 1:42:50 PM

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#105812: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:43:51 AM

At a certain point, a desire to cut costs actively hampers the creative process and needs to be resisted. Films that gross a billion dollars can take a few financial risks.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
GNinja The Element of Hyperbole. from The deepest, darkest corner of his mind. Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
The Element of Hyperbole.
#105813: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:45:11 AM

@Blueace. I still hate that they took the one arguably good plot development from Dark World and made it into a joke. I don't even recall them doing anything particularly interesting WITH Loki in Ragnarok. So it's not like it was sacrificed for something even better.

I think Ragnarok is my pick for the most overrated Marvel movie. I really did not get the love that it got.

Kaze ni Nare!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#105814: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:47:10 AM

Pearlmutter actually wanted to recast RDJ?! surprised

That man is a real-life Mr. Krabs. That’s insanity levels of penny-pinching. He’d might win the award at that Krabs penny-pinching competition Krabs took Spongebob that one time.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Dr.XXX The Mad Doctor Since: Aug, 2014
The Mad Doctor
#105815: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:49:03 AM

Of course, Perlmutter is known for being really frugal. Back when Marvel went Marvel nearly went bankrupt, Perlmutter caused so much trouble auditing everything he could audit and micromanaged money in a way that makes Jim Shooter look tame in comparison.

He's also a piece of work when it came to minorities and women. He replaced Terrance Howard because money and said "all black people look a like" about recasting and thought female heroes wouldn't work because Catwoman, despite the male superheroes failing in the past like Superman 4, Superman Returns, Batman and Robin, etc. yet he was willing to make heroes headlining males.

His penny pinching, as much of a pain in the ass it was, did buy time for Marvel.

Edited by Dr.XXX on Jul 22nd 2019 at 2:50:20 PM

theLibrarian Since: Jul, 2009
#105816: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:50:10 AM

Seriously. Rhodey being replaced you can get away with because the original actor was only in the first movie as a rather minor part, but replacing someone who had been Iron Man for years at that point? No.

ShadowWingLG Since: Dec, 2013
#105817: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:53:23 AM

That Perlmutter for you, his quest to cut corners is legendary. See how badly he bungled the Inhuman Series, he only gave that series to Beck because Beck had Perlmutter's favorite qualities, Cheap and Fast. Even though he was responsible for the disaster than was the First Season of Iron Fist.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#105818: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:54:03 AM

Back when Marvel went Marvel nearly went bankrupt, Perlmutter caused so much trouble auditing everything he could audit and micromanaged money in a way that makes Jim Shooter look tame in comparison.
Yeah, but that was back when they were bankrupt. At that point, Marvel had literally been selling off the furniture and nobody working there knew if they were going to have a job in a few months. Perlmutter penny-pinched into oblivion, yes, but he at least made sure the company survived.

Of course, after the company became a billion dollar money maker, it didn't need that penny pinching anymore. And yet he still did it. Heck, the director of the first two episodes of Inhumans said he was hired because he could make it "fast and cheap."

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#105819: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:54:51 AM

I think the difference is that while Jim Shooter cared about getting the company in a sound financial position he also cared about the writers and artists and did a lot for them. Of course, he came from that side of things himself.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
KusaMigeru Interesting Person #928 from Kanda Island Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Hooked on a feeling
Interesting Person #928
#105820: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:54:58 AM

[up]x7: Probably it's just that the previous two movies had left a bad taste in the mouth for many? I mean, I agree it's far from being a great movie, but maybe it's just perception.

Edited by KusaMigeru on Jul 22nd 2019 at 3:55:47 PM

... And that's called jazz!
ACW from Arlington, VA (near Washington, D.C.) Since: Jul, 2009
#105821: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:56:42 AM

Replacing RDJ would've been colossally stupid.

Wasn't Howard replaced because of a contract dispute?

I have no idea who the Eternals are, but if the MCU can make the super-obscure GOTG into great movies (the first one is one of my all-time favorite MCU films, lameness of Ronan aside; the second one, while not quite as good IMO, is still very good, and Ego's a great villain), I feel they can do the same with the Eternals.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#105822: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:56:45 AM

What? Ragnarok is my favorite Thor movie by far and my third or fourth favorite in the whole MCU. Thor is way better as a straight comedy.

Edited by Fighteer on Jul 22nd 2019 at 2:57:42 PM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
Dr.XXX The Mad Doctor Since: Aug, 2014
The Mad Doctor
#105823: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:57:01 AM

Perlmutter even cut corners during press conference. I kid you not. For a several hour long press conference to promote the first Avengers movie, he put out one bottle of water per person and a singular bag of chips. A press conference can last for like upwards of five hours. Dude, not cool.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#105824: Jul 22nd 2019 at 11:58:26 AM

[up] The story goes that the reporters had to raid the food of the nearby press conference for The Five Year Engagement.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#105825: Jul 22nd 2019 at 12:01:20 PM

Yeah, but that was back when they were bankrupt. At that point, Marvel had literally been selling off the furniture and nobody working there knew if they were going to have a job in a few months. Perlmutter penny-pinched into oblivion, yes, but he at least made sure the company survived.

Of course, after the company became a billion dollar money maker, it didn't need that penny pinching anymore. And yet he still did it. Heck, the director of the first two episodes of Inhumans said he was hired because he could make it "fast and cheap."

Exactly this. Great war-time generals don't always make good peace-time diplomats and vice versa. It's all about mindset.

Perlmutter wasn't penny-pinching because Marvel was in dire straits. He was penny-pinching because he's a penny-pincher. Which, because Marvel was in dire straits, was exactly what the company needed right then and there.

But it's been like two decades. The company's situation has changed significantly. So now it needs different leadership from a perspective more suitable to their current status. But Penny-Pinching Perlmutter is still there.

This is why monarchies are bad.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Jul 22nd 2019 at 1:02:17 PM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.

Total posts: 186,763
Top