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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

jakobitis Doctor of Doctorates from Somewhere, somewhen Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Doctor of Doctorates
#103551: Jun 10th 2019 at 12:39:41 PM

[up][up][up] not really the Russos who dropped the ball on the Guardians, that's more on the writers. Any Guardian who isn't Rocket or Nebula got screwed over by only reappearing just in time for the final battle and the aftermath.

"These 'no-nonsense' solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex world of jet-powered apes and time travel."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#103552: Jun 10th 2019 at 12:47:40 PM

Part of it was that Endgame was for the Avengers who had run out their three movies already. That’s why most of the people snapped were newer heroes who still had movies forthcoming

The Guardians still had a movie coming up, rather than worry about stepping on its toes too much, it’s easoer to sideline them so they’re in stasis for their third movie

Same for Black Panther and Spider-Man

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Merseyuser1 Since: Sep, 2011
#103553: Jun 10th 2019 at 2:49:48 PM

I haven't yet seen Avengers Endgame, so I've had to skip some pages.

Anyway, I'm about to start The Punisher (2017) soon, and it is a part of the MCU, even though it's self-contained?

Are these considered more Expanded Universe (like Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. is) or not, having seen YMMV.Marvel Cinematic Universe where it claims the Netflix shows are Fanon Discontinuity?

What will this mean for the upcoming Loki series, whenever it airs? Expanded Universe or Fanon Discontinuity?

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#103554: Jun 10th 2019 at 2:50:05 PM

Star-Lord felt a little off in Infinity War and Endgame.

Stuff like him trying to compete with Thor, spending his final moments with Gamora arguing about going left or right, losing his cool and thwacking Thanos out of his coma, ect. all felt like stuff from pre-GOTG Star-Lord, not the more matured version from the end of Vol. 2.

He's my only real major characterization criticism, though.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#103555: Jun 10th 2019 at 2:53:20 PM

Wasn't Gunn himself brought on board as a Guardians consultant?

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#103556: Jun 10th 2019 at 3:10:36 PM

Are these considered more Expanded Universe (like Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. is)
Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. is part of the MCU, not the Expanded Universe. Same with all of the Netflix shows, Runaways, Cloak and Dagger, and, of course, Agent Carter.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#103557: Jun 10th 2019 at 3:17:10 PM

Avengers: Endgame is a mere 57 million away from surpassing Avatar. Go see Endgame again/for the first time. Help that happen. Avatar doesn't deserve its spot as the top-grossing movie of all time, and Endgame is the only movie that has ever even come close to beating it.

Endgame's a great movie with a ton of rewatch value, and I'm saying that as someone who watched it twice and was floored the second time by how deep the writing is and how many in-jokes and references are packed into the script. If nothing else, watch it again to catch all of the characters in the big army scene at the end.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#103558: Jun 10th 2019 at 7:03:14 PM

I still couldn't find Kraglin.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
GNinja The Element of Hyperbole. from The deepest, darkest corner of his mind. Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
The Element of Hyperbole.
#103559: Jun 10th 2019 at 7:16:05 PM

I'm not sure it'll ever happen now, but I really want to see the proper Mandarin in an MCU movie.

Gimmicky rings and all. I live for that shit. (Though my friend did just make me realize that he might be considered a rehash of Thanos with the Gauntlet)

Edited by GNinja on Jun 10th 2019 at 2:25:35 PM

Kaze ni Nare!
AyyItsMidnight Look, just be decent to one another ok? Since: Oct, 2018
Look, just be decent to one another ok?
#103560: Jun 10th 2019 at 7:21:19 PM

I'm quite mixed on how the "Thanos dualogy" handled the Guardians as well. I feel quite strongly about them so it's little surprise that they brought about plenty of the absolute best and worst moments in both movies (loved Rocket's talk with Thor in IW, hated Gamora's death). At least going into Endgame I didn't have much expectation for most of them sans Rocket, Gamora and Nebula (the latter of which was probably my favorite part of that movie).

Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#103561: Jun 10th 2019 at 7:35:15 PM

I'm probably never gonna forgive Quill.

It's unfair, but I'll never trust him again, no matter how many more times he saves the universe.

Cause he failed when it mattered...not with Gamora. He came through there, or at least tried to.

So yeah, Quill, every single entry on my shit list.

One Strip! One Strip!
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#103562: Jun 10th 2019 at 7:36:35 PM

You mean no matter how many more times he guards the galaxy.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#103563: Jun 10th 2019 at 7:38:32 PM

Then again Quill's always been kind of an idiot in general so he doesn't deserve forgiveness anyway. tongue

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#103564: Jun 10th 2019 at 7:43:01 PM

Quill is a lovable idiot, but I take comfort in the fact that it was all part of that one-in-14-million chance.

Edited by Fighteer on Jun 10th 2019 at 10:43:11 AM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
LordVatek Not really a lord of anything Since: Sep, 2014
Not really a lord of anything
#103565: Jun 10th 2019 at 7:54:38 PM

They showed footage from the Avengers game.

They also confirmed Hank Pym is in the game and that narrator is most likely Kamala Khan.

Edited by LordVatek on Jun 10th 2019 at 10:54:53 AM

This song needs more love.
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#103566: Jun 10th 2019 at 7:56:29 PM

There were actually more than one victory outcomes amongst those 14 million. Doctor Strange just deliberately chose the one where Tony Stark dies too, out of spite for Tony talking shit at him. tongue

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#103567: Jun 10th 2019 at 8:27:31 PM

I'd be fine if the Mandarin were more like the Mandarin from Iron Man: Armored Adventures.

Disgusted, but not surprised
chasemaddigan I'm Sad Frogerson. Since: Oct, 2011
I'm Sad Frogerson.
#103568: Jun 10th 2019 at 8:33:00 PM

@GNinja: Well, Kevin Feige confirmed that they're planning on bringing the real Mandarin for a future film, so you may get your shot there.

I am a bit disappointed we didn't get to see a proper confrontation between Drax and Thanos. Aside from Drax blowing their cover on Knowhere due to his need for vengeance, we didn't get to see him really laying into Thanos for the loss of his family. I know there were a lot of characters and plot points to juggle, so I'm a bit lenient about certain characters being relegated to smaller roles. But the first Guardians film set-up that Drax had shifted his quest for revenge from Ronan to Thanos during the ending. Drax could've offered some insight to how his people suffered after Thanos slaughtered half the population, and given him motivation to not lose the new family he had made with his team.

Edited by chasemaddigan on Jun 10th 2019 at 11:36:42 AM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#103569: Jun 10th 2019 at 8:35:41 PM

The rule of comics is that Drax only gets revenge on Thanos when it screws things up for everyone else, like in Annihilation

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#103570: Jun 10th 2019 at 8:45:16 PM

What bugs me is that Guardians 2 set up a very clear arc for Nebula about the need to turn away from unyielding revenge and to let herself be part of a family, that Infinity War and Endgame simply forgot about, or had no interest in.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Jun 10th 2019 at 8:49:54 AM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#103571: Jun 10th 2019 at 8:48:44 PM

Didn't she leave at the end of Guardians 2 to go kill Thanos?

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#103572: Jun 10th 2019 at 8:49:53 PM

Yeah, her arc wasn't about turning away from vengeance, it was about embracing Gamora as her sister.

indigoJay from The Astral Plane Since: Dec, 2018 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#103573: Jun 10th 2019 at 8:57:06 PM

[up][up][up] My favourite arc from Guardians 2 was hands down Yondu and Rocket's. I would have liked to see a bit more of the continuation of that with Rocket in Infinity War and Endgame, but obviously there was a lot to juggle.

There is no war in Ba Sing Se.
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#103574: Jun 10th 2019 at 9:01:23 PM

At the end of Guardians 2, Nebula has forgiven Gamora, but she's still too determined to find Thanos and kill him brutally all by herself. Gamora points out that there are more productive ways of combating Thanos, but Nebula runs off alone anyway. This turns out to be a massive error on Nebula's part, as her assassination attempt just gets her captured and alerts Thanos as to where the Soul Stone, also pushing him out of hiding and therefore dooming the entire universe.

The moral and narrative path for Nebula here is clear: one-track revenge is disastrous and she has to allow herself to open up to and rely on a family.

Instead, Endgame flips around her character to suggest she... feels too emotionally attached to Thanos?? When she sees him again at the Garden, she displays guilt on her face, never mind that he was torturing her just a month ago and she had openly boasted about how she would make him suffer back. Then the majority of her screentime centers around her fighting her literal past self, who is likewise attached to Thanos and would never move against him. The same past self who a few days later, had nothing in her timeline changed, would've betrayed Thanos the instant she saw the chance with Ronan.

So it feels so weird how they took Nebula from a feral ball of emotions to demure and submissive, when her arc before Endgame suggested a very different path.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Jun 10th 2019 at 9:02:22 AM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#103575: Jun 10th 2019 at 9:04:12 PM

It’s a character beat echoed with Gamora

She killed him, she thought, and then cried over him despite how much she hated him

Emotions are complicated

As for Nebula, shortly before/during Gotg 1, she still desperately wanted Thanos’ approval but seeing him favor Gamora again even after Gamora betrayed him was the last straw apparently

Emotions are complicated

Edited by Bocaj on Jun 10th 2019 at 12:05:35 PM

Forever liveblogging the Avengers

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