Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules
still apply.
- This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
- While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread
. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
- Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.
If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.
Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM
I kinda feel like Hela is around Thanos level. In fact I suspect she is still alive sfter Ragnarok also helps with that since not even the world ending giant could kill her.
Plus she outright destroys Mjolnir with her hands, something Thanos never shows capable of doing to the actual hammer or Stormbreaker.
Every accusation by the GOP is ALWAYS a confession.No spoilers in the post about Dormamu.
Just stating that if he ever comes back, he's gonna wreck strange so bad, Stephen will have to rename himself Dr. Normal.
I'd say Hela is stronger than Thanos because, by what Ragnarok implies, Hela is literally unbeatable and seems to grow progressively stronger the longer she stays in Asgard. The only way to defeat her is by destroying Asgard itself, which is a rough win-condition.
In terms of actual power levels, I'd figure they're pretty evenly matched, but Hela can just outlast him due the fact she's, again, basically unkillable unless you wipe out an entire Realm off the map.
If Thanos somehow works out he needs to kill Asgard to take Hela down, he presumably could by ordering a carpet bombing assault on Asgard with his fleet until Asgard ceases to exist, but that's another scenario entirely.
"All you Fascists bound to lose."Yeah, there was a reason why I advocated for not talking about Endgame at all here...so, let's see...villains…
Ego was most likely the most powerful so far...good thing that he was never interested in infinity stones.
But I am not sure if the powerless is really the important aspect about a villain. Success rate is. And on that rate, Thanos and Zemo top the list.
Edited by Swanpride on Apr 27th 2019 at 7:21:03 AM
Well, if Thanos has the Infinity Stones he quite probably can beat any other MCU villain, including Ego the Living Planet. He shatters a moon just with the Power Stone in Infinity War, could just as easily shatter Asgard itself with it and thus down Hela.
Ego would be a tougher costumer, but Ego is vulnerable to mental manipulation as Mantis often shows. The Mind Stone could help Thanos with buying time in that regard before just blowing up Ego with the Power Stone.
"All you Fascists bound to lose."Huh. If Ego turned Asgard into himself, would it still technically count as being Asgard (thereby still giving Hela her Field Power Bonus)?
More to the point, what would happen if Ego then took his human Avatar form and fought with her? She get's her strength from Asgard, and he would literally be Asgard?
Consider all your noodles baked.
One Strip! One Strip!It's an interesting thought.
From what we're told of Ego's absorption process (i.e it seems to fundamentally alter and reshape whatever he's absorbing to turn it into "him"), I'd figure him absorbing Asgard would be tantamount to "destroying" Asgard and thus killing Hela.
"All you Fascists bound to lose."Hela's strength is difficult to judge in comparison to Thanos, admittedly, because we never see them face the same challenges.
Hela fights Thor and tanks some of his best stuff, while taking damage from some of his other best stuff, but we don't know what of that Thanos would be able to tank because Thor is defeated offscreen in Infinity War. In fact, Thanos' only non-boosted feat iirc is manhandling Hulk using boxing skillz, which is a really big deal, but still. It'd be more indicative if Hulk got to fight Hela in Ragnarok, but she did not.
I think she's still a bit less powerful than Thanos, however, but that comes from assuming that Thor and Hulk are still comparable in strength and thus further assuming Thanos effortlessly beating Hulk puts him above Hela fighting Thor and beating him with effort. It's admittedly a stretch, though.
Edited by KnownUnknown on Apr 27th 2019 at 8:27:25 AM
Yeah, it's really hard to compare because we never get villain-vs-villain, except for Hela vs. Surtur, which isn't so much a battle as a sort of pre-destined climax. Well, there's Loki vs. Thanos, but that's arguable both in terms of Loki's villainy at the time and whether it's really a fight.
Thanos with the full Infinity Gauntlet is the most powerful being in the MCU, full stop. Thanos by himself... well, he's still stronger than just about any Avenger (keeping Endgame spoilers firmly in check here). During Infinity War, he only uses the Stones on Titan when pressed, taking seeming pleasure in his raw physical feats of strength and endurance. It's only on Earth that he goes ham, but that's because there's no more drama. He's marching to his victory and no longer cares about proving anything to anyone.
My gut says that Hela on Asgard could defeat unaided Thanos. Could Hela defeat Thanos outside of Asgard? There's just not enough evidence to say.
Edited by Fighteer on Apr 27th 2019 at 11:31:13 AM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"Her giant puppy could hurt Hulk, but Thor himself realized nothing he had could truly beat her. So he summoned the biggest gun possible.
Thanos hubris and lack of imagination actually keeps him from using the stones in more impressive ways in IW. Someone so small minded the idea of doubling resources is beyond him.
Every accusation by the GOP is ALWAYS a confession.I think Dormammu's the strongest by a wide margin, even stronger than Infinity Gauntlet Thanos in terms of sheer power output— though the latter could obviously force a stalemate if he came to bargain instead of fight.
Anyway, just saw Endgame for the second time. Exhausting two days.
Edited by Anomalocaris20 on Apr 27th 2019 at 12:50:51 PM
You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!Yeah, Dormammu has no patience whatsoever and Thanos is incredibly stubborn, so if Thanos pulled the same Time Stone loop shenanigan Strange did it'd absolutely let him get what he wanted out of Dormammu. I'm just saying that I don't think Thanos would ever be able to actually defeat Dormammu outside of that, even with a full Infinity Gauntlet.
I don't think the Snapture would be able to recognize Dormammu as a lifeform and dust him assuming it even reaches extradimensionally, and he's definitely not going to be dented by raw punches or energy blasts no matter how many Stones are powering them.
You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!

In terms of power level (not counting side-villains like Surtur, but counting the forces they have at their command), for strongest it probably goes Thanos w/ Gauntlet -> Dormammu -> Ego -> Thanos w/out Gauntlet -> Hela.
For least powerful (again not counting minions and side-villains, but counting their resources), it probably goes Zemo -> Vulture -> Ghost -> Iron Monger -> Killian.
If the villain has an army or an organization behind them, I put them as more "powerful" based on how effective that army or weaponry was - hence physically weaker characters like Killmonger or Pierce being above the likes of Stane (who was basically alone and was summarily defeated, if not without difficulty, once cornered).
On the flipside, Vulture has a gang but they're basically useless beyond Shocker (who is in desperate need of an upgrade) and Tinkerer (the biggest sum of whose input is Vulture's suit anyway). So I came to the conclusion that Ghost - who is basically the effectiveness of Black Widow plus deadly phasing and untraceable invisibility powers - was probably a notch above him even on her lonesome.
Also, Handsome Rob, if those are actual spoilers you should probably edit them away.
Edited by KnownUnknown on Apr 27th 2019 at 6:46:59 AM