TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Marvel Cinematic Universe

Go To

Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#101026: Apr 22nd 2019 at 3:08:49 PM

My having a criticism you don’t doesn’t mean I’m “searching,” it simply means I have a criticism you don’t. If you disagree, it suffices to simply say so.

But if you’re going to accuse me of being blinded by hatred of Whedon to the point where I’m inventing reasons to dislike him, I’m going to straight out say you’re barking up the wrong tree. Believe it or not, people can have criticisms of things you enjoy without ulterior motives.

I dislike the writing and directing of Ultron because I feel it has problems, that’s the beginning and ending of it. I can assure you I’m not somehow trying to exercise a grudge.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Apr 22nd 2019 at 3:14:41 AM

TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#101027: Apr 22nd 2019 at 3:11:58 PM

Geez, the fact that Endgame is coming in a few days has going through some mental final boss bingewatch...

I can't stop thinking the Thanos fight(s?) will be some hybrid of Goku vs. Beerus and Asura vs. Chakravatin, if they were bigger than 1 on 1.

Actually, Ant-Man and the Wasp got me thinking what if the Avengers take their Thanos fight into the Quantum Realm?

(I need to see Endgame right now...)

Edited by TargetmasterJoe on Apr 22nd 2019 at 6:14:03 AM

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#101028: Apr 22nd 2019 at 3:12:56 PM

I still think he was far better utilized in Avengers 1 and Civil War, though. Neither movie felt they needed to be self deprecating in order to justify his presence, he was just there because he’s a major character and he deserved to be there.

I gotta be honest, I really didn't think much of his appearance in the first Avengers. I had a hard time caring about him because Jeremy Renner has such little charisma, combined with the fact that he mostly seemed to exist for Natasha's sake than because he was a good character. It doesn't help that he spends a good amount of the film brainwashed too.

Edited by Draghinazzo on Apr 22nd 2019 at 6:14:29 AM

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#101029: Apr 22nd 2019 at 3:15:29 PM

I was actually surprised Hawkeye never had his own film like Ironman,Hulk,Thor,then again he's probably not a big enough name to headline his own movie,was probably a similar deal with Black Widow

Edited by Ultimatum on Apr 22nd 2019 at 10:17:04 AM

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#101030: Apr 22nd 2019 at 3:17:24 PM

[up][up]I never thought much of Avengers in general.

I mean, yeah, the third act is fun and all, I guess, but the movie is such a drag to watch.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#101031: Apr 22nd 2019 at 3:21:56 PM

[up][up] Probably. Feigns did note around Phase 2 that he didn’t believe characters below a certain power threshold should headline their own movies. That’s starting to change, but it was a standard for a while there.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Apr 22nd 2019 at 3:39:43 AM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#101032: Apr 22nd 2019 at 3:33:37 PM

I’m of similar mind to Handsome Rob about Hawkeye’s speech

Edited by Bocaj on Apr 22nd 2019 at 6:37:19 AM

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#101034: Apr 22nd 2019 at 3:45:50 PM

GOOD LORD

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#101035: Apr 22nd 2019 at 3:46:23 PM

[up][up][up] Thanks Bocaj.

My having a criticism you don’t doesn’t mean I’m “searching,” it simply means I have a criticism you don’t. If you disagree, it suffices to simply say so.

But if you’re going to accuse me of being blinded by hatred of Whedon to the point where I’m inventing reasons to dislike him, I’m going to straight out say you’re barking up the wrong tree. Believe it or not, people can have criticisms of things you enjoy without ulterior motives.

I dislike the writing and directing of Ultron because I feel it has problems, that’s the beginning and ending of it. I can assure you I’m not somehow trying to exercise a grudge.

Fair enough. I'm still getting familiar with people's issues towards Joss, so it just seems like after he did some stuff people didn't like, they started combing through his past efforts to tear that down as well (which feels like a thing with any writer / director / whatever who becomes a Fallen Creator: suddenly, even the stuff that was seen as good becomes awful because they did it).

That's not to say there's not some legitimate problems; just that it seems to me that suddenly everything they've done must be turned to shit. Kinda like how after Mighty No. 9 bombed, people suddenly started combing through Kenji Inafune's history and finding out that he wasn't the most awesome dude in existence, and using it to heap further shit on him.

Again, that doesn't mean there aren't good reasons, but I suppose for me (someone who's made it clear he still likes AOU) it might be harder to see the problems others have.

Edited by HandsomeRob on Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:48:55 AM

One Strip! One Strip!
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#101036: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:00:31 PM

I never thought much of Avengers in general.

I mean, yeah, the third act is fun and all, I guess, but the movie is such a drag to watch.

I kind of agree, honestly. Back when it came out I actively disliked it because the film hinges very specifically on the idea that these characters all coming together is a big enough draw by itself. The problem was I didn't think most of the phase 1 films were very good barring Iron Man 1 at the time, so I didn't think Marvel had given me a reason to care about a crossover between them. I watched it and was just really bored the whole time, none of the character dynamics did anything for me and the "awesomeness" of it just fell completely flat.

With some retrospect and a somewhat more positive opinion on most of the phase 1 movies (especially thor), I can appreciate it a bit more, especially for its third act, but it's a not a special or meaningful film to me by any means. It's a better constructed movie than Ultron for sure but that isn't saying a lot.

HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#101037: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:08:09 PM

I still prefer Ultron if only because there's actual stuff going on.

Way too much stuff, granted, but the first movie doesn't seem to have anything beyond being a crossover, with the entire movie being all the characters dicking about until the climax happens.

The fact that Loki was reduced to a complete joke of a villain doesn't really help.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#101038: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:15:57 PM

You can't thwart stage one means that Loki still managed to masterfully play all of the Avengers and spymaster Nick Fury and got away to open the space portal and summon an alien invasion.

I wouldn't call that a complete joke.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
OmegaRadiance Since: Jun, 2011
#101039: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:19:45 PM

He was only a joke at the end when Hulk made him cry by smashing the puny God.

Every accusation by the GOP is ALWAYS a confession.
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#101040: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:23:58 PM

I wouldn’t say Avengers 1’s story is just “spinning wheels until the climax”. While the “investigate Macguffin” plot is simple, there’s a lot of tension in the characters’ interactions centered around “can these heroes reconcile their egos and become a mighty team”. Then the third act action is based around them proving to each other that they can.

Age of Ultron has much more plot objectives but very little of it matters thematically. The driving question of “can the heroes overcome their personal demons to be what the world needs” is never confirmed, just abruptly put aside.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#101041: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:24:03 PM

I’ll admit I’m a little surprised at the glowing defense of Whedon’s “I have a bow and arrow lol I shouldn’t actually be here” approach to Hawkeye in Ultron, especially given the usual response to his other in-jokey habits in that movie, but okay. To each their own.
It's not that he "shouldn't be here," it's just that fighting a bunch of homicidal robots with a bow and arrow makes little sense...but he still does it because it's what he knows best. And he does it and makes a difference, too.

There's a great moment in Avengers: No Road Home, where the Hulk, Hawkeye, and Rocket are facing off against Nyx, the Goddess of Night. Hulk tells Hawkeye that, well, Clint is clearly outmatched here, so he can just take a breather and let the Hulk fight a freaking Goddess, especially since Clint doesn't have his bow and arrows anymore. In response, Clint breaks off a tree branch, tells Rocket to build him a new bow and arrow because he isn't going anywhere. That's who Hawkeye is: someone who will face down literal Gods with a bow and arrow.

Also, I wonder why people think making Ultron funny made him less scary? Because he was scary to me, especially as he grew more and more unhinged.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#101042: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:26:16 PM

Ultron wasn’t scary to me because he couldn’t deal any harm to the heroes until Quicksilver’s abrupt death. Basically all his weapons were useless, even when he hit the heroes directly.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:26:43 AM

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#101043: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:28:58 PM

Far cry from the guy who regularly engages entire Avengers teams all on his own.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#101044: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:29:30 PM

Ultron just has way too many bad character beats, plot decisions, and things that just don't WORK. I feel like it was trying to be a more "substantial" film than the first, but it didn't do a very good job of it. I didn't hate it when I first saw it...until the creation of Vision, and then the whole film just falls apart as whatever arc Tony might have had just gets destroyed when he gets rewarded for doing the same stupid shit that started this whole mess. Awful character writing.

Ultron wasn’t scary to me because he couldn’t deal any harm to the heroes until Quicksilver’s abrupt death. Basically all his weapons were useless, even when he hit the heroes directly.

It's kind of a shame honestly, because his introduction is actually pretty chilling and effective. The rest of the film just fails to live up to it.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#101045: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:29:45 PM

Ultron wasn’t scary to me because he couldn’t deal any harm to the heroes until Quicksilver’s abrupt death.
You could say the same thing about Loki.

HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#101047: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:48:09 PM

[up][up]No, Loki actually killed a bunch of people when he showed up, made Hawkeye his puppet, and tossed Captain America around effortlessly. Ultron’s onscreen bodycount is... two doctors and Quicksilver by accident.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:54:06 AM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#101048: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:54:13 PM

He's responsible for the Hulk's rampage, via delegation.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#101049: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:57:35 PM

Not counting deaths by proxy, only personal deadliness. With 4000 more bodies than Loki, Ultron shouldn’t need the help. Besides, the claim here in the past was that Hulk (somehow) didn’t kill anyone.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:58:44 AM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#101050: Apr 22nd 2019 at 4:58:29 PM

That is a comics thing, not a movie thing.

Edited by Bocaj on Apr 22nd 2019 at 8:02:11 AM

Forever liveblogging the Avengers

Total posts: 186,763
Top