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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#100526: Apr 14th 2019 at 6:07:34 PM

Tony Stark managed to... that doctor guy managed to rebuild Tony's heart into some kind of pacemaker in a cave - with a box of scraps - which kept Stark alive for a good long while.

Meanwhile, Coulson with all of the spies and superhero contacts in the world, can't get a fix for a similar wound/spear through the heart.

Okay, there are several problems with this: Tony Stark's heart wasn't pierced, it was just that there was a lot of shrapnel around it that could pierce it and kill him. Therefore: an electromagnet was there to hold the shrapnel in place and, later, he had the shrapnel removed. Coulson's condition was different in that Loki literally stabbed him through the heart and he died. There was no "preventing" the stabbing, because it had already happened and the tissue had already become necrotic. The only thing that had reversed the necrosis and restitched his heart was Kree blood.

Now, could he have found some more Kree blood and taken that? Yes, entirely. They even discuss this. They had plenty of access to Kree in the future dystopia they had been trapped in, but here's the thing: Coulson didn't want to come back again. He knew he was dying and had already accepted it and refused any treatment that would prevent it. He had accepted his death and moved on.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#100527: Apr 14th 2019 at 6:08:33 PM

Well...

Yinsen didn't rebuilt Tony's heart. Tony's heart was fine, minus the fact that there were tiny bits of unremovable shrapnel slowly moving towards it. What Yinsen did was essentially attach a giant magnet to Tony's chest, keeping the shrapnel from affecting it.

At the time of Coulson's death, neither Wakanda nor Dr. Strange was an option. Nobody even knew about either of those being capable of helping at the time. And also, healing magic apparently isn't a thing - self healing is, but bringing people back from the brink of death with a spell doesn't seem to be something MCU wizards can do.

As far as I know, if we're going by the movies strictly the only thing that might've saved Coulson super-science wise would've been to use a knockoff super soldier serum or something on him. And that's not a good idea.

[nja]'d

Edited by KnownUnknown on Apr 14th 2019 at 6:09:13 AM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#100528: Apr 14th 2019 at 10:00:10 PM

So, what's up with that Chinese cut of Iron Man 3? From what I heard, they added a whole subplot about a Chinese doctor. I don't know what it led to, but if it was building up to that doctor learning how to remove Tony's shrapnel, that ties into the film's ending. I'm curious if that cut made the film better, or if it was just Chinese pandering that made the film worse.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#100529: Apr 14th 2019 at 10:14:30 PM

They also did this previously in the show with Grant Ward/Hive.

Hive was specifically possessing Ward, though. It wasn't a distinct break.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#100530: Apr 14th 2019 at 10:16:19 PM

[up][up]According to this, the three scenes added for the Chinese cut only add about four minutes and aren't really essential or even good. Apparently, Chinese audiences hated them because they were little more than an advertisement:

  1. “What does Iron Man rely on to revitalize his energy?” The question pops on screen, seemingly promising some kind of major reveal. Nope, the Chinese letters for “Gu Li Duo” are the answer, which refers to a drink that’s available all over the country. Nothing more than a commercial. The character of Dr Wu (Wang Xueqi) is then seen drinking the drink.
  2. Later in the film Dr. Wu is talking on the phone in his office and behind him, Iron Man is seen on TV playing with school children. (It’s the scene pictured above in the header pic.)
  3. Towards the end of the film, Dr. Wu is performing a task with Stark and has a conversation with his assistant about it.

Edited by alliterator on Apr 14th 2019 at 10:16:52 AM

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#100531: Apr 14th 2019 at 10:26:10 PM

Though the most heart-breaking scene in Ao S isn't even a death...it is a good-bye.

Anyway, point is, that characters have died in the MCU and no, by far not everyone has come back.

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#100532: Apr 14th 2019 at 10:53:38 PM

An MCU tribute video set to Geri Halliwell's cover of It's Raining Men.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#100533: Apr 15th 2019 at 7:25:43 AM

Regarding the impact of deaths that won't stick: I get it, personally. Peter's death is heartbreaking to me too, even though I know he'll be back.

I read the comics. Nothing is permanent in comics. People complain about Status Quo Is God but that's not quite the case. It's not that there's an almighty status quo that is constantly reset. It's that nothing is ever permanent. The law of the land isn't immovable permanents; it's ever-flowing change.

Like. We might have a period of time where Bucky is Iron Man. But then Tony stark gets the suit back, so status quo reasserts itself, right? Well, not really, because Spider-Man's changed his thing to fighting the Kree in space in the Spider-Man & Captain Marvel ongoing, so the dynamic they had before Tony retired isn't coming back. Pepper isn't there to greet Tony because she's the new Venom and he actually has to fight her now. The Avengers broke up into six splinter factions, one for each Infinity Gem. Stark Industries is now a subsidiary of Doomtech, a new corporate entity from Latveria, and run by the Mandarin.

But sure. Tony's wearing the suit again. NOTHING EVER CHANGES IN COMICS WAAAAH.

The comic universe is ever-changing, ever-evolving. Nothing is permanent, nothing lasts forever, every plot point dies in 2-5 years when the title changes hands, if it's not already changed by one of the dozens of writers writing one of the dozens of comics happening alongside yours all the time. Fans talk about the illusion of change but change is not the illusion. Permanency is the illusion.

To really get emotionally invested in comics, you just kinda have to accept that what matters in a story is not how it affects the greater universe or whether or not it will last. It's strictly how it impacts this story, the one you are reading right now. And strictly within the realms of "Nothing but Infinity War matters to Infinity War", Peter's death is a devastating tear-wrenching gut-punch of a blow.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Apr 15th 2019 at 8:28:36 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
#100534: Apr 15th 2019 at 7:39:54 AM

Something funnny is that the world of comics is very similar to ours.

One would think that the existence of superheroes for decades would make a huge difference with our world, but not.

For example, Reed Richards can invent a machine to travel between universes, but the streets of New York remain the same.

I think that he Status Quo Is God is dictated by the fact that the fictional world, should not be too different from the real world.

Edited by JoLuRo075 on Apr 15th 2019 at 8:00:54 AM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#100535: Apr 15th 2019 at 7:56:14 AM

That’s dumb and I demand mars colonies in my comics

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#100536: Apr 15th 2019 at 8:13:21 AM

That’s dumb and I demand mars colonies in my comics
There were actually Mars colonies in Marvel comics, but I believe they were destroyed by some aliens or something. That's the other thing about Marvel's Earth: aliens tend to be so afraid that humanity will spread across the universe that they pretty much try to contain us here on Earth. Heck, they once even made Earth a prison planet for other species.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#100537: Apr 15th 2019 at 8:17:39 AM

Which is funny considering how puny Earthlings are said to be compared to nearly every other species in the universe.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#100538: Apr 15th 2019 at 8:22:05 AM

Personally, I wouldn't mind Peter coming back if they at least saved announcing his next movie until after he is already brought back to live. Or at least held back from releasing the trailer before Endgame was in theaters.

I mean, after I first watched the Away From Home trailer, I remember looking back to that scene and thinking "well, that was a waste of my time".

All I ask is to keep the illusion alive. Kayfabe, y'know? Feige should hire someone from the WWE to be in charge of advertisent .

JoLuRo075 Since: Jan, 2019
#100539: Apr 15th 2019 at 8:23:26 AM

[up][up]Puny earthlings is something inconsistent.

The average Asgardians are supposed to be much stronger than a super soldier, but in the Siege event, even the "Peak humans" treated them like cannon fodder.

So an Asgardian warrior can vary between being weaker than a Peak Human to be much stronger than Spiderman, depending on the writer.

In fact in the same movies, assuming that Proxima helped in the asgardian massacre. It means that they were massacred by a woman who is weaker than a super soldier.

Edited by JoLuRo075 on Apr 15th 2019 at 8:45:44 AM

LordVatek Not really a lord of anything Since: Sep, 2014
Not really a lord of anything
#100540: Apr 15th 2019 at 8:26:49 AM

[up][up]I don't think Feige actually has any say in when Sony releases their trailers.

This song needs more love.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#100541: Apr 15th 2019 at 8:28:24 AM

I don’t believe the Far From Home trailer confirms whether or not it’s set before or after Infinity War

Unless you went and looked for interview confirmation outside of the trailer the illusion remains alive

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#100543: Apr 15th 2019 at 8:48:36 AM

Go ahead Anti SJW's!

Try and say something about that picture!

JUST FUCKING TRY IT!!!!!

...cute picture by the way.

One Strip! One Strip!
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#100544: Apr 15th 2019 at 8:49:17 AM

careful you'll summon one and then you'll be sorry

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#100545: Apr 15th 2019 at 8:53:51 AM

"Disney tries to manipulate public opinion by exploiting little girl"

"Brie Larson so unpopular that she needs boost from little girl."

Sorry, but those people really ARE that crazy.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#100546: Apr 15th 2019 at 8:54:14 AM

If I summon one, then I myself shall slay in with my bare hands out of penance.

But yeah, I should just chill out I guess. But we don't really need to worry about that here I don't think.

One Strip! One Strip!
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#100547: Apr 15th 2019 at 8:55:57 AM

I remember a galactic meeting of some kind in the comics where all the major races came together to agree to making Earth a cosmic no-fly zone. The logic was that humans are genetically unstable creatures whose biology mutates wildly at the slightest provocation, and are no better politically or technologically. They are a danger to themselves and others, and should be left to self-destruct under their own means.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Apr 15th 2019 at 9:56:29 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#100548: Apr 15th 2019 at 8:59:02 AM

Yeah.

That sounds right. Though most of those races who have beef are the ones who tried to invade for one random reason or another. They're probably just salty.

One Strip! One Strip!
Nightwire Since: Feb, 2010
#100549: Apr 15th 2019 at 9:02:53 AM

humans are genetically unstable creatures whose biology mutates wildly at the slightest provocation

That's pretty dang funny.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#100550: Apr 15th 2019 at 9:03:45 AM

thats why i have three arms suddenly

have a listen and have a link to my discord server

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