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Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM
See, the problem with Cap is I conflate the two. 616 Cap also isn’t a racist that hates the French. Also Chavez is a Jerkass in everything I’ve seen her in.
Edited by Beatman1 on Feb 27th 2019 at 3:30:03 PM
I have no problem with a movie, book, etc, not being "for me". Most aren't, most forms of entertainment are marketed to someone other than a person with my specific interests, which is true of probably everyone everywhere. Who cares, even a little?
Seriously, my actual problem is that I don't feel like the decision of which movie we'll watch together resulting in any discussion about politics. If you're not sick to death of it yet, wait another few decades and you will be, and then you too will just go to the nice "safe" movies that don't waste the rest of your day with bickering that you listen to even if you stay out of it.
Problem is, when you aren't affected by these problems directly you can just choose to ignore them for a while.
People who are affected don't got that choice: a black man who ignores all the news and discussions of hate crimes in America is still at risk of being shot to death by a cop because he fell asleep in a drive-in. (that actually happened, mind)
That's why these discussion need to keep going regardless of how "sick" of them everyone is: the problem, simply, hasn't been solved yet.
Edited by HailMuffins on Feb 27th 2019 at 5:38:16 PM
Nobody cared about the Captain America films being political, and all of them were, and the reason they didn't care is because Chris Evans is a white man. He's also very outspoken and liberal on twitter, but no-one complained because he's a white man. It's nothing but sexism and/or racism, that's all it is.
Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Feb 27th 2019 at 1:41:25 PM
I just want to point out that there is no such thing as a "political neutral" film. Everything is political, even if the specifics are "thing bad." Captain Marvel is specifically going to be feminist, because that's who the character is — she was originally conceived as a feminist character and when she became a superhero, that was only increased (hell, she was a writer for Woman magazine). The movie is also specifically influenced by writer Kelly Sue DeConnick's run on Captain Marvel that was very feminist (her first story arc was about female pilots who wanted to go to space, but were refused
).
So saying that Brie Larson shouldn't make things political when things are already political is silly.
In any case, most of the people who objected to her comments were bad faith actors, people who didn't care what she said because they were going to oppose her and the movie no matter what. Just look at what happened with Mad Max Fury Road
or the all female screening of Wonder Woman.
Edited by alliterator on Feb 27th 2019 at 12:51:35 PM
Well, there you have it. I'm self-centered for not wanting to pay money to hear more politics. Why even try to provide another view, the only thing that matters to single issue wonks is their pet issue.
As for there being no neutral movies - I'm not exactly asking for a high bar here. I'm asking for something that doesn't enrage (irrationally, I will admit) people that I know and care about. In the end, it doesn't matter to me that they're wrong about some things, because they matter more to me than some empty political gesture.
Edited by lvthn13 on Feb 27th 2019 at 12:47:06 PM
I will say that I don’t think Larson’s appeal for more reviewers of color is an attempt to deflect criticism of her film. On the contrary, I think she’s requesting for more, from said marginalized reviewers specifically.
Captain Marvel will likely be a good film, but ultimately a movie about how cool a white woman character is. Unless the trailers are really hiding something, men and women of color characters in the film are going to only occupy supporting roles, nearly all without any superpowers. Larson saying she wants to hear more from people who her own film places in a supplemental position only is an invitation for them to go into detail about how they feel this movie placing them in “Number 2 but no higher for now”. Some of their criticism may be mixed or harsh. And Larson and Marvel will be hearing it because they’re the ones who moved said critics to the front seats.
So that’s interesting to me because it tells me Larson is trying to get Marvel and herself to hear more closely what their film does well or poorly in relation to characters of color, so they can have a better idea of what would work in future films. And that’s why film criticism is supposed to do.
Edited by Tuckerscreator on Feb 27th 2019 at 12:48:14 PM
Where have I said that *I* have a problem with Brie Larson or her politics?
Chris Evans didn't stir up a media shitstorm. That's all I ask! I'm well aware that he's liberal as hell, that's fine. If some of my family knew, they probably wouldn't like the Captain America movies as much, but that's not my problem.
Chris Evans didn't stir up a media shitstorm because internet trolls don't go nuts when a white man expresses liberal views. This is not in any way Brie Larson's fault, other than daring to speak her mind to men. And I think you exaggerate the "shitstorm" — literally nobody had a problem with what she said except said trolls.
Edited by Fighteer on Feb 27th 2019 at 3:58:53 PM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"You aren't paying money to hear politics. You're paying money to watch a film. Everything the actors, creatives, and executives say behind the scenes comes for free.
I very, very strongly doubt that the actual movie will have any political hot takes. I doubt that the extent of its feminism will break new ground. I don't even expect it to make a more controversial statement than, "Girls can be heroes too, okay!" which really shouldn't bother anyone because gender politics are not a zero-sum game.
Yep, so if anyone decides not to see the film because they're "sick of the political environment around it", just know that you've let the trolls win.
If one's "friends and family" are going to have a problem with one seeing a film because they are outraged that it has a feminist message, I think one may need to pick better friends.
Edited by Fighteer on Feb 27th 2019 at 4:05:07 AM
"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"Edited by alliterator on Feb 27th 2019 at 1:04:09 AM
Well, I can't answer everyone. In the end I will do what I do, all I wanted to do is share the view of an old guy who spends money based on what provides the least irritation. I don't expect everyone to really care.
Lunch is about over, so I leave with this: when I say "neutral" entertainment, isn't really not so complicated. Modern Family meets the standard, despite obviously having very liberal leanings. My straight-ticket Republican, church-every-Sunday mom loves Modern Family. It doesn't shove anything down her throat and the actors don't make public statements that piss her off.
Modern Family is the reason my mom can now know that some of her family members are gay or bisexual, because it said something without beating her to death with it. The conversations that came from it are good ones, not arguments.
It's true, Captain Marvel probably will not have (much) politics in the movie itself, and Larson's comments only trickled out so far. My comment has been that if this is a sign of things to come, then I will likely bail sooner or later, whenever it hits critical mass that conversations become unavoidable, or some agenda becomes too anvilicious. That's all!
PS - Fighteer, it's a little presumptuous to imply that I need to get better relatives, isn't it?
Edited by lvthn13 on Feb 27th 2019 at 1:07:26 AM
... so you’re blaming Larson for “stirring up a shitstorm” because sexists are freaking out at her making a relatively mild request for more diverse interviewers?
Modern Family is very milquetoast, I’ll give you that. You might recommend One Day at a Time or Brooklyn 99; they’re not “anvilicious” and they’re both very funny.
Edited by wisewillow on Feb 27th 2019 at 4:06:20 AM
Yeah what evidence do we have to suggest that Captain Marvel is going to have any kind of big political statements besides "having a female superhero"? Larson responding to sexist reactions against the film or requesting a more diverse pool of journalists does not necessarily imply the film's content will be full of hot takes.
Edited by Draghinazzo on Feb 27th 2019 at 5:08:35 AM

@Figtheer: The problem is, a write can't make a review with nay perspective other than their own, that's what it means when people say "Art is Subjective".
If a reader decides to disregard its review based on what bias the critic has shown, then fair enough, I ignore Yatzhee almost all the time he talks about JRP Gs, but that doesn't make his perspective any less relevant, because the more diverse views are brought to the table, the more rich the debate will be.
As Roger Ebert said: the job of the critic is not to evaluate the movie, but merely to show the reader whether that movie will be of interest to them.
And that, I feel, is the root of the problem here: people still look to reviews and critics as a way to validate their opinions rather than a third-party stating theirs.
That's why I agree with the point Larson was trying to make: there needs to be more diverse voices.
Edited by HailMuffins on Feb 27th 2019 at 5:30:50 PM