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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#95901: Jan 29th 2019 at 3:27:13 PM

In the X-Men Evolution cartoon, the machine that gave Cap his powers causes cellular degeneration on normal humans but makes the biological clock of mutant go backwards.

They could use the overall concept to justify why Magneto didn't seem to age if they so wish.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#95902: Jan 29th 2019 at 3:28:24 PM

> No, its fundamentally tied to a campaign of ethnic cleansing against a defenceless people. The holocaust is just one example in history of this.

The holocaust is the Prime example,the one above all others that are considered,it's not just one example in history

Edited by Ultimatum on Jan 29th 2019 at 11:29:19 AM

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#95903: Jan 29th 2019 at 3:29:13 PM

Well, if it is to change his background, how about Rwanda? Or is that just too recent?

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#95904: Jan 29th 2019 at 3:34:37 PM

Better yet just make him a Posthumous Character.

That solves all the questions.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#95905: Jan 29th 2019 at 3:35:22 PM

I'd want an MCU version of the X-Men to hold off on using Magneto. The guy's been used so extensively in the Fox movies, almost as much of Wolverine, that we could do with a lengthy break from him (much like how the MCU Spider-Man films are avoiding mentions of Uncle Ben or the Osborn clan). So, when starting off, his backstory would be a non-issue.

And when we're several movies in, and ready to finally introduce him, you could just have him frozen like Cap, or a victim of Genoshan genocide rather than the Holocaust.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#95906: Jan 29th 2019 at 3:39:15 PM

As pointed out already, Evolution tied in Magneto's age to the machine that gave made Cap a super soldier. In that series, Cap had to be frozen because the process turned out to be deadly to normal humans, but not mutants.

So since we've seen that the research for the Rebirth project still exists (in the form of Blonsky, and I believe the Hydra solders who Zemo killed in Civil War) it's not out of the question for Mags to learn about it and discover that he can use the process to slow down his aging.

This would require him to actually be older chronologically than Charles but still the same physical age however.

I've brought this up before in the Xmen thread: it's true that Mags is reaching a point when him having been alive during the holocaust makes him way too damn old to truly be such a big player, so you have to jump through some hoops.

But I do think that his backstory is too vital to his character and motivations to remove. Hell, the fact that he's someone who lived through that war (when the number of people from that time still alive has gotten smaller and smaller) might make him more significant to be honest.

It might create an interesting sense of isolation from him, that only people who have lived through similar experiences (human or mutant) can grasp.

One Strip! One Strip!
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#95907: Jan 29th 2019 at 3:39:45 PM

Thats gonna make it real awkward when the characters continue to age normally as the franchise wears on.
No, it won't: Thor is an immortal Norse god from a race of immortal Norse gods that regularly live for over six thousand years. His father was over half a million years old. And yet Chris Hemsworth has kept aging regularly and nobody has said a word. It's almost like we know that actors are separate from their characters.

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#95908: Jan 29th 2019 at 3:40:04 PM

Magneto in the comics has been de-aged numerous times to avoid that problem.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#95909: Jan 29th 2019 at 3:43:53 PM

[up][up][up]I really like that idea. Have Magneto's fear and hatred not just be in response to thinking a genocide will happen again, but add another layer by having him be one of the few people left who lived through the Holocaust and remembers what it was like, so he's also terrified that humanity will repeat the mistakes of the past by not learning from them.

HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#95910: Jan 29th 2019 at 3:55:25 PM

It does make for an interesting new angle for the character: even the biggest tragedies in human history just turn into another test subject given enough time, but for Magneto that might as well have happened yesterday, and he knows that with people forgetting all that, his own people are next in line to be the next victims.

It also adds a good link with Wolverine: they're the only ones that lived so long and seen so much tragedy, yet one chooses violence while the other sticks with Xavier's idealism, even if he knows force is sometimes necessary.

Should make for some interesting dialogues, if nothing else.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#95911: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:05:36 PM

Although this may result in Charles and Eric no longer being equals, because the former can no longer emphasize with the latter's pain since he wasn't alive during that time...then again, his powers would allow him to experience Eric's pain in a way no one else could, so maybe I'd be wrong in that case.

One Strip! One Strip!
HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#95912: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:11:09 PM

One thing I wish Marvel would keep from Charles character that Fox introduced is the idea that he is infinitely compassionate because he can sense people's pain literally as if it was his own, while the comics was more of a Manipulative Bastard and an ephebophile.

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#95913: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:15:05 PM

We’ve had this discussion before re: Magneto. I’ll repeat what I said before: while Magneto is a hit or miss character, depending on the writer, I VEHEMENTLY oppose erasing his Jewish heritage. For f***’s sake, they just did a study showing a ton of people think the holocaust was exaggerated; anti-Semitic hate crimes have skyrocketed, and for better or worse, Magneto is one of the few prominent Jewish superheroes/villains.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#95914: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:15:13 PM

I'm gonna invert your wish right there?

Not only because I like the idea of Charles being very compassionate, but also because Marvel piled so many skeletons into his closet that it completely wrecked him from my standing.

The thing with him crushing on Jean in particular, should not only die in a fire, but in all the fires, past, present and future.

One Strip! One Strip!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#95915: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:16:14 PM

I am tired of Xavier having all these dark secrets.

He’s supposed to be the opposite of Magneto, not another fucking version of him.

[up][up] Huh shame about the crimes. Way too many people hate Jews for some bizarre reason.

Then again, racism is itself a nonsensical concept.

Edited by slimcoder on Jan 29th 2019 at 4:17:21 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
AyyItsMidnight Look, just be decent to one another ok? Since: Oct, 2018
Look, just be decent to one another ok?
#95916: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:19:56 PM

I think I could do without Wolverine or Magneto for a bit when the X-Men come to the MCU, but otherwise I agree with wisewillow.

Edited by AyyItsMidnight on Jan 29th 2019 at 4:20:04 AM

Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#95917: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:23:27 PM

Yeah, I'm going to agree that him being Jewish is especially important in today's era.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#95918: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:24:29 PM

Hell they can do to make him more to accentuate his Jewish-ness.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#95919: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:25:32 PM

Agreed, Magneto NEEDS to be Jewish. Any Holocaust scene with him needs to be at least as dark, gritty, and Nazi-killing as the opening of First Class was. Maybe have Captain America save him as a kid, to fit him into the MCU more.

Edited by PushoverMediaCritic on Jan 29th 2019 at 5:26:40 AM

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#95920: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:27:01 PM

I've said it before, but to circumvent the age issue maybe have Hydra put him on ice like they did Bucky, so they could study his powers.

He could still be an old-ish man if you want, too; it'd just mean he was already old when he was sent to the camp.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#95921: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:27:08 PM

They could use Kitty Pryde for that.

One thing the MCU has done well (and a lot of people tend to forget now that we have all the big names back) is to pick small, obscure characters and teams and make them big.

Hell, there was like 20 people who had read GOTG before the movie, now its a household name; they don't need the big characters, they can just make the smaller character rise to proeminence.

So instead of constantly relying on Magneto, they can just make other Jewish characters get some time in the spotlight, give the character some rest.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#95922: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:29:13 PM

I can agree with giving Kitty Pryde more spotlight. She's one of the most prominent X-Men in the comics, even leading the team at points, but she's a minor character in the films.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#95923: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:29:44 PM

No Peter jokes though. tongue

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#95924: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:29:49 PM

Or simply have it be that he's a mutated human with mutated human powers which include not aging like normal people.

Though I'd argue that overrelying one the same Magneto plotline is something any new X-Men movie series should finally get away with just once.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Jan 29th 2019 at 4:30:49 AM

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#95925: Jan 29th 2019 at 4:31:59 PM

Sorry, but Kitty Pryde and Magneto are two entirely different tiers. Yes, Jews in the present day still have it quite bad in many aspects, but a teenage girl just does NOT have the same effect as a literal Holocaust Survivor.

EDIT: Oh I misread, it seems like you want her to take his place as a survivor. Not so sure about that.

Edited by Forenperser on Jan 29th 2019 at 1:32:41 PM

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