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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#93226: Dec 30th 2018 at 7:35:28 PM

Cap's the only one who has a completely good trilogy. To me, Thor 1 was good, Thor 2 was whatever, and Thor 3 was pretty good, except it didn't feel like a Thor story.

Hmm... I'm just gonna keep throwing discussion points out there. What was the most fun cameo by an Avenger? We've got:

  • Hawkeye in Thor 1
  • Loki-as-Captain America in Thor 2
  • The Falcon in Ant-Man
  • Doctor Strange in Thor Ragnarok

And who had the best major supporting role in another hero's movie:

  • Black Widow in Iron Man 2
  • Hulk and Banner in Thor Ragnarok
  • Iron Man in Spider-Man Homecoming

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Dec 30th 2018 at 11:04:38 AM

SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#93227: Dec 30th 2018 at 7:42:05 PM

Hawkeye was in Thor. The only one who made a cameo in Hulk was Tony in the stinger.

My various fanfics.
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#93228: Dec 30th 2018 at 7:45:30 PM

[up][up]Ragnarok for both answers.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#93229: Dec 30th 2018 at 7:50:44 PM

Loki-as-Cap in TDW for the first one, Hulk and Banner in Ragnarok for the second.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#93230: Dec 30th 2018 at 7:51:03 PM

Not sure about the first question, but definitely Hulk in Thor for the second question.

Black Widow was awful in IM 2, and I'm of mixed and conflicted feelings about Iron Man's overall role in Spider-Man Homecoming, whereas while it's a shame Hulk legally can't get more to himself and it sucks that his arc completely derailed Thor's own story, the actual arc itself was a delight.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#93231: Dec 30th 2018 at 7:51:35 PM

Loki-Cap was the most random and hilarious cameo ever. Just so Goddamn unexpected and hilarious. [lol]

I actually squeed a little when I first saw Hawkeye in Thor.

Edited by slimcoder on Dec 30th 2018 at 7:52:30 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#93232: Dec 30th 2018 at 9:07:16 PM

[up][up][up][up][up]My bad. We knew that's what I meant, I just typed the wrong thing.

Hawkeye in Thor was special because it wasn't anywhere close to a real character introduction, but it was a clear sign to the fans that there's a lot more out there than we see. That, and the map in Iron Man 2.

That said, my favorite was definitely Falcon in Ant-Man. I'd just stepped out to use the bathroom cause I figured I wouldn't miss much in the couple seconds I'd be out of the theater, then I walk back in and see my favorite Avenger on the screen, and I'm like "WHAAAAA..." And then he's back for the Luis story at the end to make it even better.

As far as major supporting roles go, I actually would have to say Black Widow in Iron Man 2. For that same interconnectedness, and because of the three I'd remembered and listed above, she was actaully likeable. Banner was a people user, and Stark couldn't get out of his own way (though he tried), and kept his streak of being responsible for MCU villains going.

Edited by wanderlustwarrior on Dec 30th 2018 at 11:09:36 AM

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#93233: Dec 30th 2018 at 11:04:19 PM

IMO, Natasha's inclusion and portrayal in IM 2 wasn't particularly great. It's the one that most sexualizes her and portrays her for fanservice, and she's part of the SHIELD plot that greatly detracts from the movie and takes up time that could have been used to flesh out Vanko and make the script not a jumbled mess.

AyyItsMidnight Look, just be decent to one another ok? Since: Oct, 2018
Look, just be decent to one another ok?
#93234: Dec 30th 2018 at 11:10:17 PM

The jank is real with IM 2 in a lot of ways. I had some fun with it but I'm glad I didn't have to pay money to see it.

Anyway, Bruce/Hulk was one of the absolute best parts of Ragnarok which is interesting to think about since I'd never cared much for him prior. Guess that makes three or four characters Taika fixed up, depending on your view.

Self-serious autistic trans gal who loves rock/metal and animation with all her heart. (she/her)
SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#93235: Dec 30th 2018 at 11:55:06 PM

Even though I find Ragnarok just okay, Hulk is definitely the best part of the movie, and the one that feels the most like The Hulk from the comics, instead of the Godzilla-Gorilla they usually run with in the movies.

My various fanfics.
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#93236: Dec 31st 2018 at 12:40:05 AM

Call me crazy, but I don't mind the Shield plot. It actually fits better into the whole main story about Tony slowly dying than Vanco's BS does. If I have a problem with it than that there isn't MORE about Coulson trying to keep Tony in check.

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#93237: Dec 31st 2018 at 5:45:32 AM

Vanko could have been great as an Evil Counterpart for Tony, if he had more screentime.

As he is, he is still more engaging than Killian though. Most unengaging MCU villain by far for me.

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Zanthype from The Tardis Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Hoping Senpai notices me
#93238: Dec 31st 2018 at 5:50:12 AM

I think for me the least engaging villain has to be Malekith. Hell, he and Thor barely interact and whenever they do Malekith has some generic villain line. Such a waste of Christopher Eccleston, which is a huge crime in my book.

"In 900 years of time and space I've never met anyone who wasn't important."
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#93239: Dec 31st 2018 at 5:56:02 AM

Malekith might have been boring, but at least he generated some level of menance.

Killian, I just couldn't take seriously even 1 second, especially so when he became a fire-wielding super-nerd.

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Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#93240: Dec 31st 2018 at 6:02:59 AM

Vanko had plenty of screentime. It was not utilized well, though. But yeah, in the movies Malekith is still the worst villain...if you count the TV shows, he gets beaten by The Hand and what was the name of Luke Cage's brother again?

Edited by Swanpride on Dec 31st 2018 at 6:06:33 AM

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#93241: Dec 31st 2018 at 6:05:47 AM

> and what was the name of Luke Cage's brother again?

Nick Cage surly?

-badum tish-

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Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#93242: Dec 31st 2018 at 6:17:31 AM

If we count the shows in, then PRIDE, Jonah and those 2 Cloak&Dagger villains whose names I didn't even bother remembering take up top spots too.

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Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#93243: Dec 31st 2018 at 6:27:08 AM

The worst villains are probably the ones appearing in Hulk movies because they've pretty crap overall

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Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#93244: Dec 31st 2018 at 6:34:08 AM

There was only 1 Hulk movie (in the MCU). And I liked both Thunderbolt Ross and Blonsky.

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Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#93245: Dec 31st 2018 at 6:52:13 AM

In the case of Cloak and Dagger, that is acceptable, because we are dealing Roxxon and maybe a larger conspiracy here. And the show is more about the inner struggle of the characters anyway.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#93246: Dec 31st 2018 at 7:12:06 AM

I thing Yathzee put it best: when you go to space, everything seen little, seen Spider battle little guys will be like "Ok, this the same guy who was on titan and battle agains thanos....that is cool.

That is the magic of Spider-Man that the movies, due to existing in a vacuum, have never been able to adequately depict.

Spider-Man isn't the strongest hero. He's not the fastest, the smartest, or the guy with the best powers. He might not even be the funniest. But he is the very distilled essence of the superhero.

Every character has their area of expertise. Iron Man fights corporate espionage. Captain America fights Nazis, terrorists, and Nazi terrorists. Thor fights god-tier super-beings from across the Nine Realms. Dr. Strange fights extradimensional horrors. DareDevil fights crime.

But Spider-Man's "thing" is that he doesn't really have a "thing". He's defined by his inability to walk away from a bad thing that's happening. It doesn't matter what it is. He's been everywhere, he knows everyone, he's done everything, because Spider-Man is a meddler. You could be having a totally internal throwdown with your archnemesis in Times Square, but Spider-Man saw this happening, so now Spider-Man's a part of this. If it ain't his business, then he makes it his business.

This means Spider-Man can be fighting alien space wizards on Monday, battling anti-mutant terrorists on Tuesday, throwing down with the Mafia on Wednesday, stopping the release of Hell on Earth Thursday, and then walking an old lady across a street on Friday before stopping in for a cup of joe. He doesn't have a preference. He'll fight whatever evil you've got.

So. Yeah. Looking forward to Far From Home specifically because of that, "This guy was on Titan, he fought Thanos, and now he's here dealing with whatever the f*ck this is."

Iron Man/Black Widow sex tape

Y'know, it's interesting to me that people hold the sex tape against Tony - which, let's be real, there probably are sex tapes of Tony stark floating around the fictional internet - and not that time when Ultimate Stark installed a killswitch in his wife.

Ultimate Universe Tony married Natasha, but she was actually a spy infiltrating the Avengers to kill them all. As a wedding present, Tony gave Nat her own Iron Man suit, with a neural implant to help her control it. However, while he was tinkering around with her implant, he also installed a killswitch that he could use to shut down her body if she betrayed him.

That killswitch saved the day, while also being up there on the list of sickest goddamn f*cking things that Marvel heroes have ever done to women, which makes the fact that it heroically saved the day awful.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Dec 31st 2018 at 8:12:26 AM

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wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#93247: Dec 31st 2018 at 8:18:15 AM

Nick Cage named himself after Luke Cage, if you didn't already know. He's a Coppola, but wanted to earn his film career on his own merits, and chose the name of one of his favorite comic characters to do so. And I gotta say, I like how he went with a non-white hero to do so, but left it understated.

SHIELD as well as Vanko both fit in to Iron Man 2 because they were both part of his father's history coming back to roost. (also, Vanko wasn't evil, until the third act fight) The part that didn't fit was the "Demon in a Bottle" arc, which honestly they should have saved for 3.

I want to watch Cloak and Dagger eventually because they were some of the most interesting characters to me as a kid. I just might not, unless I hear a lot of good about both the quality of the show and it doing the characters justice.

Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#93248: Dec 31st 2018 at 8:23:26 AM

Cloak/Dagger was a mixed bag for me. It had many good concepts, but the execution left a lot to be desired for me.

For me, Tyrone and O'Reilly carried the season. Those 2 were truly great characters to root for. I couldn't really get into Tandy's character however, and the villains weren't great either.

Plus the constant dream sequences and the whole religious symbolism/prophecy stuff kinda turned me off (I'm a non-denominational Atheist, just for clarification, so I might not be unbiased in that regard).

That said, I still kinda enjoyed the show and the special effects were great. Season 1 was a decent foundation and I hope Season 2 will be much stronger.

Edited by Forenperser on Dec 31st 2018 at 5:28:07 PM

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wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#93249: Dec 31st 2018 at 8:30:23 AM

I'd have loved to see Ty and Tandy in the movies, mostly to see creative and visually stunning use of powers, but hey, at least they're getting a depiction.

Also, of all hero film universes, X-Men shows power in the most visually appealing way. That's one of the reasons I don't want them to join the MCU. That, plus:

  • A large mutant population and anti-mutant bias makes less sense in a world with every other type of power imaginable
  • Combining would likely mean less time for secondary characters
  • No more reboots, please
  • I may just be a Fan Hater when fans have what I see as "shallow" reasons for wanting some things to happen. See: Waluigi

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#93250: Dec 31st 2018 at 8:36:25 AM

> Nick Cage named himself after Luke Cage, if you didn't already know. He's a Coppola, but wanted to earn his film career on his own merits, and chose the name of one of his favorite comic characters to do so. And I gotta say, I like how he went with a non-white hero to do so, but left it understated.

I didn't know but now i do

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