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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#93101: Dec 27th 2018 at 3:04:39 PM

I wouldn't call him hero,he's a scoundrel who happens to do heroic things from to time,same with the rest of Guardians,they're mercenaries for gods sake!

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#93102: Dec 27th 2018 at 3:12:57 PM

Yeah, Quill was already a little tarnished. He should be, that's part of being a Guardian. The idea that people can redeem themselves is the whole point of those movies.

It shouldn't be easy, by any means, and he deserves all the flak that's coming to him for it, but it doesn't ruin him for me in the sense that he's supposed to be pretty questionable as a quote-unquote "hero". He comes pre-ruined.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#93103: Dec 27th 2018 at 4:19:44 PM

I wouldn't say those movies are about the idea that people can redeem themselves, so much as about the idea that even bad people can do good things. That's an important distinction.

You don't have to be a hero to act heroically in an ugly situation. By the end of the first film, Rocket Raccoon is still a selfish bag of dicks who thinks it's morally acceptable to steal from people and Drax cannot comprehend the idea that murder is bad. These people are awful.

But they're awful people who risked everything and fought hard to save Xandar from Ronan and the Power Gem. Because you can be a thief and a murderer and a scoundrel, and also save the world.

It's like when the Yakuza were the first on the scene to deliver relief aid and supplies to the people of Japan following the catastrophic earthquake/tsunami combo of 2011. They're still the Yakuza. But they saved a lot of lives.

Being bad guys doesn't mean you're bad to everyone all the time.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Dec 27th 2018 at 5:21:46 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#93104: Dec 27th 2018 at 4:22:41 PM

Also all of them are scoundrel in the same sense Han solo is gone: they are good rouge who said bad thing but aside of that are 100% good people, they are hero who treat a code more like a guideline.

But what Quill did IS idiotball to the max, is really hard to forgive because they already defeat thanos at that moment....

Actually, is funny because Quill plan WORK, is clear he is a very good strategeist if he could stop the mad titan, suck it Cap. tongue

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#93105: Dec 27th 2018 at 4:28:28 PM

> Being bad guys doesn't mean you're bad to everyone all the time.

Yeah but the example here is they're reciving help from the Japanese Mafia,they aren't doing it out of the goodness but opportunity,they expect something in return ie.You now owe the mob for the 'help'

Edited by Ultimatum on Dec 27th 2018 at 12:28:45 PM

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#93106: Dec 27th 2018 at 4:39:40 PM

[up][up][up]I mean, sure, okay. Semantics. really. I don't mean the characters are redeemed in full, in the sense of 'all your sins be washed away.' Just that all the bad you do doesn't make you entirely irredeemable either. Partial redemption still counts for credit. They don't have to be full-on heroes to be do heroic things and be sympathetic protagonists. They're trying, is the point.

Edited by Unsung on Dec 27th 2018 at 7:02:45 AM

HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#93107: Dec 27th 2018 at 5:29:08 PM

Man, you people have high standards tongue.

M84 Oh, bother. from Our little blue planet Since: Jun, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
Oh, bother.
#93108: Dec 27th 2018 at 5:48:23 PM

Heck, even in Infinity War Rocket was hoping any survivors from the distress call would pay them. Gamora at least chewed him out for that.

The Guardians aren't heroes. They are mercs with (differing) standards who stick by each other.

Edited by M84 on Dec 27th 2018 at 9:49:08 PM

Disgusted, but not surprised
Protagonist506 from Oregon Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
#93109: Dec 27th 2018 at 6:05:19 PM

The Guardians vary in morality among themselves (ranging from 'dickish' to 'nice'), but overall can be described as a neutral group primarily out to help themselves. Calling them bad is a huge stretch with the possible exception of Rocket, though they also aren't heroes per se.

It's a case of pragmatic neutrality if you will. As Starlord puts it, he wants to save the galaxy because he's one of the idiots living here.

Leviticus 19:34
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#93110: Dec 27th 2018 at 6:07:09 PM

I believe at one point in the comics the Guardians were commissioned as an actual legal peace-keeping force that went rather disastrous for obvious reasons.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#93111: Dec 27th 2018 at 6:07:37 PM

"What did the galaxy ever do for you? Why would you want to save it?"
"Because I'm one of the idiots who lives in it!"

I love that line.

J79 Since: Jan, 2015
#93112: Dec 27th 2018 at 9:51:45 PM

So I wonder if we'll ever get J Jonah Jameson showing up in the MCU. Of course, nobody else but JK Simmons could really pull him off (I heard rumors that Ice Cube was going to play him in Homecoming, but that turned out to be just rumors).

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#93113: Dec 27th 2018 at 11:07:14 PM

Since Far From Home takes place in Europe, I doubt we're going to see him there either.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#93114: Dec 28th 2018 at 12:43:49 AM

JK Simmons isn't the only one who can be J Jonah Jameson. I've always said that Keith David would make a great JJJ.

HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#93115: Dec 28th 2018 at 5:43:21 AM

It is true that JK Simmons is not the only actor capable of playing JJJ, but it is equally true that no one alive can play a better JJJ.

Seriously, the guy was just born for the role:

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#93116: Dec 28th 2018 at 5:50:02 AM

J.K. Simmons is a gift to all humanity, but I would actually really like to see [up][up]that.

HailMuffins Since: May, 2016 Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
#93117: Dec 28th 2018 at 6:00:38 AM

Can't say I know much about Keith David. Any notable roles I should check out?

Drakon69 The dragon archnerd from greece Since: Oct, 2018 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
The dragon archnerd
#93118: Dec 28th 2018 at 6:03:47 AM

[up]What about Bryan Cranston.

Edited by Drakon69 on Dec 28th 2018 at 4:04:05 PM

DRAGON DRAGON
Punisher286 Since: Jan, 2016
#93119: Dec 28th 2018 at 6:14:26 AM

Someone suggested Ice Cube on another site the other day and having seen some of his comedies, yeah I think that he could maybe play Jameson well.

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#93120: Dec 28th 2018 at 6:20:10 AM

[up][up][up]He's mostly a character and voice actor who you've probably seen and almost certainly heard. Very distinctive voice, and works quite a bit. Admiral Anderson from Mass Effect 3?

Wouldn't mind seeing Ice Cube's take on it, too.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#93121: Dec 28th 2018 at 8:01:32 AM

Relevant spoilers for Into The Spider-Verse.

    Spoilers 
Stan Lee voices JJ Jameson in a brief post-credits scene appearance.

Edited by Tuckerscreator on Dec 28th 2018 at 8:01:48 AM

Drakon69 The dragon archnerd from greece Since: Oct, 2018 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
The dragon archnerd
#93122: Dec 28th 2018 at 8:12:42 AM

[up]I don't think that counts as a Spoiler.

DRAGON DRAGON
J79 Since: Jan, 2015
#93123: Dec 28th 2018 at 8:50:16 AM

I wonder if they'd still keep him running a newspaper (while having characters work for newspapers is kind of dated, it's not like the newspaper industry is completely dead) or make him into a news commentator like on the Ultimate Spider-Man cartoon.

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#93124: Dec 28th 2018 at 9:46:11 AM

In the comics, it has become a running point of discussion to point out Jonah Jameson is a adamant defender of printed newspapers and one of its last true bastions in this age of modernization. I think there was a subplot somewhere about him refusing outright to launch some sort of online platform for the daily bugle (though I think he eventually relented) like most newspapers have these days.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#93125: Dec 28th 2018 at 10:37:42 AM

In the Ultimate Universe, Peter Parker was the IT guy for the Daily Bugle's website.


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