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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#89851: Sep 30th 2018 at 10:28:16 AM

Eventually, yes, but the deal won't be through next year and then they have to be careful to introduce the Fantastic Four first.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#89852: Sep 30th 2018 at 10:37:37 AM

I don't know, they might be able to introduce Doom before the FF.

Punisher286 Since: Jan, 2016
#89853: Sep 30th 2018 at 10:39:02 AM

Especially since Doom hasn't been a solely FF villain in a long time now. He's more of a "Marvel Universe" threat these days.

Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#89854: Sep 30th 2018 at 11:01:45 AM

Isn't Doom's thing that he has a whole nation of his own that supplies his super tech? How many times can we pull a "secret high-tech nation that nobody's ever heard of" reveal in the MCU without people no longer taking it seriously?

Edited by Fighteer on Sep 30th 2018 at 2:04:01 PM

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#89855: Sep 30th 2018 at 11:03:24 AM

Make it a recent thing?

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
JRads47 Since: Nov, 2014
#89856: Sep 30th 2018 at 11:06:20 AM

He could be some guy who helps rebuild Sokovia, and climbs his way into power. Eventually he becomes leader and renames Sokovia into Latveria.

RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#89857: Sep 30th 2018 at 11:07:45 AM

In Latveria's case, I think they only have super-tech because Doom invented all of it. The nation's there more to supply resources and manpower.

ViperMagnum357 Since: Mar, 2012
#89858: Sep 30th 2018 at 11:08:02 AM

[up][up][up]Not Exactly-Doom's schtick is that he is one of the very few entities not intrinsically tied to the universe that can freely combine powerful magic and advanced technology; with a final result roughly comparable to the work of Tony Stark, Reed Richards, Hank Pym, and the like. Latveria is what happens when a technologically savvy Sorcerous Overlord makes good on their conquest of a nation that was such a craphole the population welcomed their conqueror with open arms; and providing what would otherwise be a transient supervillain with the resources of an advanced nation and corresponding official recognition/diplomatic immunity for most purposes.

Edited by ViperMagnum357 on Sep 30th 2018 at 2:07:54 PM

Punisher286 Since: Jan, 2016
#89859: Sep 30th 2018 at 11:12:34 AM

Yeah Doom's two big edges over guys like Stark, Reed Richards, Pym, Banner, etc is that he successfully combined science AND sorcery. And he rules over a country so not only can he use it's resources as he sees fit, but its also hard to stop him because he has sovereign immunity as well.

And it makes him different as a baddie than what we've seen in the MCU thus far.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#89860: Sep 30th 2018 at 11:15:26 AM

Basically: imagine if Tony Stark, Doctor Strange, and King T'Challa were the same dude. That's Doom.

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unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#89861: Sep 30th 2018 at 11:16:59 AM

Just a thing " I mean, he's not like Batman "

Tony stark is pretty batman like and even more in civil war, childhood trauma?,check, cynical? check, controling? check, give him a cave and a spear and he is batman.

And doom....a this point I like to see interaction between wakanda and latveria since as people point how, doom is a shadow architype of T´challa.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#89862: Sep 30th 2018 at 11:17:43 AM

He also has a habit of yelling out "RICHAAAAARDS!"

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Punisher286 Since: Jan, 2016
#89863: Sep 30th 2018 at 11:23:34 AM

Heck Doom's debut episode in the Avengers: EMH animated show had him:

-Send his minions to attack Avengers Mansion and the Baxter Building.

-Kidnap Sue Storm and Wasp and take them to Latveria.

-The remaining Avengers (minus Thor and Ant Man) and FF go to stop him.

-He kicks all of their asses singlehandedly.

-He just, lets Sue and Wasp go and doesn't feel the need to explain why he took them in the first place.

-He tells the hero's that they're trespassing on his territory and to GTFO basically, and they do.

-It turns out that the reason for it all was because he'd already realized that the Skrulls were starting to replace people and suspected that either Wasp, Sue, or both had been replaced and was running test to find out which one it was.

-Etc.

It was an awesome episode and a great showcase of why Doom works as a villain. Also he's often depicted as having a certain code of ethics, albeit a skewed one, which makes him even more interesting.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#89864: Sep 30th 2018 at 11:28:32 AM

He could be some guy who helps rebuild Sokovia, and climbs his way into power. Eventually he becomes leader and renames Sokovia into Latvia.

I was thinking the same thing actually. The entire debacle with Sokovia has provided the perfect opening for the creation of Doom.

One Strip! One Strip!
LordVatek Not really a lord of anything Since: Sep, 2014
Not really a lord of anything
#89865: Sep 30th 2018 at 12:00:04 PM

I'm conflicted about whether Doom should be introduced gradually or if they should just go "Boom here's this Darth Vader-looking dude." I think either could work.

This song needs more love.
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#89866: Sep 30th 2018 at 12:03:05 PM

But the thing with Doom is, while he is a master in all kinds of things, he is not the BEST in all these fields.

Dr Strange is a better sorcerer, Richards a better scientist.

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Punisher286 Since: Jan, 2016
#89867: Sep 30th 2018 at 12:11:06 PM

Yes, which offends his enormous ego and sense of self-importance and helps drive his villainy (although it's not the sole cause/motivator TBF).

Also Doom has some interesting nuance to his character as well. He's not so unreasonable that he won't temporarily tem up with the hero's against a bigger threat. He's a man of his word (although you should read the fine print on that one), he's capable of respecting others (he and Loki respected each other during Dark Reign), and in some of the comics he has respect for T'Challa and Storm (it's even implied that he might be attracted to the latter). And he hates bigotry (which is part of why I hated how Reginald Hudlin wrote him in his Black Panther run).

He's just a cool character all-around. Also if they can just introduce Red Skull right off of the bat in TFA and make it work, then they can do the same for Doom imo.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#89868: Sep 30th 2018 at 12:11:11 PM

Yeah. It's been pointed out on this very wiki that as good as Doom is, he's only second best at both Science and Sorcery...though he's a better armourer than Stark apparently, since they went toe to toe once and Doom did win...because his suit had a longer lasting battery (this is pre-arc reactor from the MCU, so not a shock there).

One Strip! One Strip!
Punisher286 Since: Jan, 2016
#89869: Sep 30th 2018 at 12:17:24 PM

Doom's also a better strategist that all of the Avengers except for MAYBE T'Challa as well. I'd say Cap, but Doom thinks on a bigger/longer scale than Cap does most of the time.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#89870: Sep 30th 2018 at 12:27:13 PM

Yeah, I'd like Doom to step onto the stage fully-formed and ready to go. He's one of those characters who's less interesting when you try to connect their backstory to the plot. There are basically two versions of Doom:

  • Doom the Megalomaniacal Dictator. Ruler of Latveria. Master of Science and Sorcery. Armed with his brilliant mind, Doom believes very firmly in saving the world and helping all mankind to achieve greatness, but his vision of the future is fundamentally flawed because his path to getting there consists of taking over the world and dragging humanity kicking and screaming towards his ideal. His egotism is his greatest weakness.
  • Doom the Petty Manbaby. One time in college, his face blew up and Reed Richards was nearby. Doom has dedicated his life to getting revenge on Reed, while screaming about "ACCURSED RICHARDS" at the top of his lungs.

Doom is a phenomenal character whenever he's not a Fantastic Four villain. To this end, I'd prefer his backstory be covered quickly and be unrelated to the actual story. Maybe after he's made his first appearance, have Captain America read off some stuff about how he was horribly scarred in a college accident and that's why he wears the mask. And then that's it. We're fighting Doom Today, not Doom Yesterday.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Sep 30th 2018 at 1:32:26 PM

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PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#89871: Sep 30th 2018 at 12:43:20 PM

I think I've only ever seen Doom the Petty Manbaby, so I just kind of have to take others at their word that Doom is actually a supreme badass and Master of All. Like, I can totally understand why that version of Doom is amazing, and I totally believe that version of Doom exists, I've just never seen that version of Doom. He's always been just a generic evil mad scientist in a castle plotting against RICHARDS to me.

Punisher286 Since: Jan, 2016
#89872: Sep 30th 2018 at 1:03:29 PM

Doom the badass has basically been his default characterization for the last 10-15 years in comics at least, and most of the other media as well. Heck in the Secret Wars even from a few years back, he literally REWROTE REALITY ITSELF to make the Universe what he wanted it to be, and became basically a god in the process. And now, he's kind of an anti-hero in the comics currently.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#89874: Sep 30th 2018 at 1:25:01 PM

Doom is currently one of Iron Man’s successors along with Riri.

And he’s doing a damn good job of it even if he’s hamaperec by Brian Micheal Bendis’ slow as molasses writing.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
ExplosiveLion Since: Mar, 2016 Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
#89875: Sep 30th 2018 at 2:12:22 PM

@Tobias

I mean if Ultron's origin was changed I don't see how Doom's origin cannot change as well.

He could be an Iron Man fanboy who goes batshit insane in his self-righteous quest.


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