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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#89726: Sep 28th 2018 at 6:57:09 AM

[up]Of course I think that is the point: is easy to work with her because is just backstory, if we dont see, we dont feel it.

Look bucky, his backstory never care until he kill howard stark, that change everything.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Ikedatakeshi Baby dango from singapore Since: Nov, 2015 Relationship Status: Singularity
Baby dango
#89727: Sep 28th 2018 at 7:01:35 AM

I mean, Gamora was forcibly abducted and adopted, listening to the words of a mad alien dude who keep saying he saved her planet.

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#89728: Sep 28th 2018 at 7:01:35 AM

Furthermore, the idea that the Hulk didn't kill anybody in Johannesburg undercuts Bruce's decision to leave at the end of Age of Ultron. If no one died during that rampage/fight, what was Bruce feeling so guilty about?

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#89729: Sep 28th 2018 at 7:01:46 AM

Alliterator, this insistence on keeping up an argument until you've gotten everybody to agree with you
I don't need everyone to agree with me, I was just pointing out that Wanda is being held to a double standard in comparison to Black Widow and Gamora.

I removed your suspension with the understanding that these sorts of nit-picky arguments wouldn't keep happening, yet you went right back to them. Are you really this dense? Consider this a final, final warning.
I thought my suspension was due to the shouting matches we had gotten into? So far, I think everyone in this thread has remained calm. As for being nit-picky...isn't that kind of the point of these threads? To pick apart the movies? I mean, over in the Jessica Jones thread, we're talking about whether or not her killing of the guard was considered felony murder. But I'll drop it if you want me to. It does seem like we're going in circles.

Edited by alliterator on Sep 28th 2018 at 7:02:04 AM

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#89730: Sep 28th 2018 at 7:21:26 AM

[up]Like I said, point is the movie does threat Wanda diferent in erasing her bad deed or just taking for granted she is a good guy now in a movie focus on adressing past mistakes.

And as someone who got in thr matches with you is more about we drag the post with micro complains over and over than anything else, I have being guilty of the same so yeah.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#89731: Sep 28th 2018 at 7:30:47 AM

I think we'll have to agree to disagree then.

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#89732: Sep 28th 2018 at 7:45:42 AM

Yeah, Better than repeating the whole D Cthread fiasco them.

So about the question who started about tony forgetting Cap and Bucky....I will said no, in bucky case however, I can imagine him and Bucky having a no speak agreement or "you go your way and I go mine" were none of them really atempt to reach the other and leave like that.

With Cap....no, it not just him covering up Bucky but there other two issues: the first is that Cap is constantly pestesing him about ideals and doing the right thing over and over and pretty much chew tony out for what he did to wanda(understandably), the other point is that Howard ideiolize Cap and see him defending the murder of is parent is kinda like Steve saying they dont matter more than bucky and by extention him.

That is A LOT to unpack and I dont think he will forgive him in any way because of it.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#89733: Sep 28th 2018 at 7:54:46 AM

But again, he can't blame Stark for something Whiplash did.

You mean....just like blaming them for the deaths the Chitauri caused? Sorry, but this is just grasping at straws right now.

The 3 incidents Ross pointed out were not the only incidents whatsoever the Avengers were involved in where they were any kinds of casualties. Period.

Edited by Forenperser on Sep 28th 2018 at 5:01:39 PM

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#89734: Sep 28th 2018 at 8:43:49 AM

Guys, it's not cool to continue arguing a topic when one party to that argument has been threatened with suspension. A mod warning should always be the final word.

With regards to Gamora, I think allowances can be made for her age. There's a reason a person's criminal record is usually wiped out when they hit 18. Gamora started genociding planets when she was too young to know better and wanted to earn the affection of her father figure.

Like.

I'm not exactly comfortable with charging an 8-year-old for the genocides her father invited her to participate in.

She's old enough to know better now, of course. But she also walked away from Thanos now. So.

Edited by TobiasDrake on Sep 28th 2018 at 9:47:13 AM

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#89735: Sep 28th 2018 at 8:46:37 AM

Similar can be said for Natasha too.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Forenperser Foreign Troper from Germany Since: Mar, 2012
Foreign Troper
#89736: Sep 28th 2018 at 8:54:03 AM

[up][up]I'm sorry I honestly didn't see that. Well whatever.

I think we can all agree on the fact that almost nobody from the MCU heroes has a clean slate. Not even Cap who, despite preaching peace and love, deep down needs war and conflict to feel whole and can be pretty self-righteous at times.

Certified: 48.0% West Asian, 6.5% South Asian, 15.8% North/West European, 15.7% English, 7.4% Balkan, 6.6% Scandinavian
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#89737: Sep 28th 2018 at 8:55:38 AM

[up][up]Well even fighter(the party that warn about it) engage a little, so is less "stop taking about it" and more "Moderate yourselves"

But yeah the diferent is that Wanda join the organization while Natasha and Gamora didnt they were recrutied, is diferent kind of ball here.

But again that isnt really the original complain is the movie really adress that with wanda and I think it did not.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#89738: Sep 28th 2018 at 9:05:25 AM

Sure, but Wanda had an extremely traumatic experience as a child and then grew up as an orphan in an overall poor and war ridden country. She is pretty much a prime victim for ANY kind of cult. The moment she realized on which path she was, she and her brother turned around and did their best to minimize the damage. All this counts for something.

It is also not really important for Civil War, because no matter what she did, nothing of it falls unter the rules of the accords. That is not how laws work. We don't just introduce a new law and then start to arrest people who broke this law before it even existed. The law counts from the moment in gets implemented, NOT beforehand. Now, if either Nigeria or Sokovia want to prosecute her for her actions, there are legal channels to do so. Even Wakanda might be able to put in a request. But a process like this has nothing to do with the Accords.

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#89739: Sep 28th 2018 at 9:15:40 AM

[up]I dont know that because she kickstart ultron by messing with Stark mind and them move to join Ultron after Hydra is dead, that dosent imply loyal and more a desire to hurt stark about all else.

And it is important because Ultron is what make Tony move in the end, by all acount he too get away witha lot of shit but he got punished in a diferent way, wanda....didnt.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#89740: Sep 28th 2018 at 9:32:20 AM

Tony never got punished in an official way. In a karmic way, well, I think Wanda got her punishment alright, when Quicksilver died. Which is worse than what Tony ever had to face because of Ultron (which was what exactly? Other than guilt, naturally).

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#89741: Sep 28th 2018 at 9:39:27 AM

Fine then.

Lets punish them officially as well. As brutally as possible. No mercy and no redemption.

Put some spikes in the damn hole (I will of course, wear a spike proof suit).

As long as we end this, because I am sick of the Wanda argument. Drag her and every single character who's messed up out into the street and make them pay until we're all satisfied.

Jar-Jar the hell out of them if you have to, but end it.

One Strip! One Strip!
Fighteer Lost in Space from The Time Vortex (Time Abyss) Relationship Status: TV Tropes ruined my love life
Lost in Space
#89742: Sep 28th 2018 at 9:40:15 AM

[up] This. The argument over who did and did not get their due karma is totally fruitless. Might as well end it by brutally executing everyone.

"It's Occam's Shuriken! If the answer is elusive, never rule out ninjas!"
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#89743: Sep 28th 2018 at 9:49:25 AM

Execution party! I call guillotine!

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#89744: Sep 28th 2018 at 9:51:34 AM

[up][up]

See Fighteer gets it.

That way, everyone is unhappy.

Nope. No potholes. Figure it out for yourself if I'm serious or not.

Edit: Now [up] gets it too. everyone suffers, as it should be.

Edited by HandsomeRob on Sep 28th 2018 at 10:51:22 AM

One Strip! One Strip!
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#89745: Sep 28th 2018 at 9:55:11 AM

I could just snap my fingers, and all that karmic strife would be gone. I call that... mercy.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#89746: Sep 28th 2018 at 9:57:22 AM

No.

No quick stuff.

The point is they suffer until we are all satisfied.

I'm telling you, we Jar-Jar every single one of them. Make them pay forever. Because...eh, just because.

One Strip! One Strip!
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#89747: Sep 28th 2018 at 10:05:20 AM

Well, Bucky and Wanda who hurt tony are dead and he isnt, maybe maw was right and thanos did fix the cosmic balancetongue

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#89748: Sep 28th 2018 at 10:07:28 AM

On a different note...which characters do you want to come back and which do you want/expect to die in Avengers 4 (and I can't believe that we still don't know the title).

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#89749: Sep 28th 2018 at 10:12:58 AM

I expect almost everyone to come back....expect loki, is death as graphic enough to be left like that.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#89750: Sep 28th 2018 at 10:16:02 AM

Everyone who died in Infinity War is coming back. That said, they might die again (for example, I expect either Loki or Heimdall or both to be brought back, but then sacrifice themselves again in another way).

Specifics depend on how they undo the snap, though. For example, I've been hoping they do the thing from the comics and have Nebula get the gauntlet, but then mash it with House of M: so that Nebula kills Thanos but tries to make a perfect universe for everyone, but tragically creates a flawed world that has to be undone because she's not the most stable person herself. If something like that happens, loads of characters might come back - Uncle Ben, Yinsen, Odin and Frigga - but the heroes will have to sacrifice all of them in order to set things right.

If they strictly do time travel without any other kind of resurrection involved, to that level probably won't happen simply because there isn't enough time to establish all of them.

As for deaths, Cap almost certainly. The only reason I think Tony also is because he already tried the "retires" thing and it has never kept him from jumping into the fight. Not Thor. Not Hawkeye. Maybe Widow, though I don't think it's too likely. Not Hulk. Not Rocket.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Sep 28th 2018 at 10:16:08 AM


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