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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#89476: Sep 22nd 2018 at 4:15:59 PM

It's somewhat justified by how much of the X-Men movies take place in the actual past and are all about that Professor/Magneto friendship/rivalry/bromance. The two of them are pretty much The Dividual — in the comics, too, and not just as Onslaught. When one dies, the other recedes into the background. When Xavier steps away from the school that bears his name, Magneto fades away as well. They're yin and yang, Harman and Kun Lan.

Out of, what, ten XCU movies at this point? Magneto's the main villain in say, 2.75 of them (X-Men, DOFP, his Hijacked by Ganon moment in First Class and as a Horseman in Apocalypse). I think he's iconic enough for that, and the fact that he's almost as much ally as enemy is what gives it a different dynamic from Luthor, outside of Smallville.

Edited by Unsung on Sep 22nd 2018 at 5:43:33 AM

ExplosiveLion Since: Mar, 2016 Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
#89477: Sep 22nd 2018 at 4:33:25 PM

Cash Money idea: Make Magneto and Professor X Wanda's twins

Wanda + Vision's body: Eric.

Wanda + Vision's mind: Xavier.

Edited by ExplosiveLion on Sep 22nd 2018 at 6:37:38 AM

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#89478: Sep 22nd 2018 at 4:39:48 PM

That seems a bit too wacky to be something the mainline MCU would actually do with such recognizable characters, but I'll admit I kind of like that idea for, say, Exiles.

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#89479: Sep 22nd 2018 at 5:04:55 PM

I this point I cant care about Magneto, I find him even more overexpose than Loki(since being honest, Loki have just four movies, five if you count Infinitie war).

I want another X villian.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#89480: Sep 22nd 2018 at 5:30:35 PM

If I had the reins, to do something different from the Fox films, I'd sorta M'baku him. Introduce him as a secondary antagonist who's going down a dark path, but gets steered away from it before he goes full villain and never looks back.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Soble Since: Dec, 2013
#89481: Sep 22nd 2018 at 5:52:30 PM

Part of the problem with X-Men media is that pretty much every adaptation tries to present Magneto as the ultimate archnemesis of the X-Men. The great antithesis, the ultimate evil, the number one bad guy, the adversary to end all adversaries, the final challenge, the baddest guy of all bad guys who must be thwarted at all costs.

The Green Goblin to their Spider-Man. The Lex Luthor to their Superman. The Joker to their Batman.

...why shouldn't Magneto be all of that?

His goals are blatantly meant to contrast Xavier's; the entire franchise is built around their philosophical conflict. Xavier is the MLK to Magneto's Malcolm X.

If these characters can't be integrated without taking that into account then why integrate them at all? You might as well grab two mutant characters with strange abilities and just make them the minions of... wait a minute...

Edited by Soble on Sep 22nd 2018 at 6:00:25 AM

I'M MR. MEESEEKS, LOOK AT ME!
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#89482: Sep 22nd 2018 at 6:01:06 PM

Which is a fundamental misunderstanding of Malcolm X, but I digress.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#89483: Sep 22nd 2018 at 6:01:07 PM

The franchise has long since moved on from Magneto vs Prof. X.

As its been mentioned several times already, Magento has been a good guy longer than he has been a bad guy at this point.

Its like how Spider-Man media keeps going back to when he was in high-school. Sure it was a memorable part of his life but Spider-Man hasn't been a teenager for decades now.

Or how Batman keeps reusing the fucking Joker.

Edited by slimcoder on Sep 22nd 2018 at 6:07:54 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#89484: Sep 22nd 2018 at 6:08:37 PM

What I'm saying is I'd like to see him backgrounded, made a part of the MCU's weird history rather than a foreground character — him and Xavier both. And Wolverine. Give more face time to Cyclops, Storm, Beast, Nightcrawler, Kitty Pryde. And Beak.

They did cover a lot of the big names in the X-Men's rogues gallery, though. Stryker, twice. Juggernaut, also twice (although not as Xavier's half-brother). The Hellfire Club. Dark Phoenix. Apocalypse. Silver Samurai. The Reavers. Who's left? Legion's got the Shadow King handled, The Gifted has the Stepford Cuckoos, the Fenris Twins, and Polaris. Dark Phoenix is going to have Nightbird, I think, and I thought Mister Sinister was supposed to be in The New Mutants, but I guess no one really knows anymore. Quentin Quire? Cassandra Nova? Cortez?

You know what I'd like to see? More of Peter Dinklage as Bolivar Trask. Maybe with some aspects of Henry Peter Gyrich.

Edited by Unsung on Sep 24th 2018 at 4:10:32 AM

ExplosiveLion Since: Mar, 2016 Relationship Status: Armed with the Power of Love
#89485: Sep 22nd 2018 at 6:15:08 PM

One thing's for sure. I seriously don't want Cyclops anymore. The X-men movies totally ruined the character for me.

LordVatek Not really a lord of anything Since: Sep, 2014
Not really a lord of anything
#89486: Sep 22nd 2018 at 6:15:46 PM

Or how Batman keeps reusing the fucking Joker.

I uh... I read this part wrong...

._.

Edited by LordVatek on Sep 22nd 2018 at 9:15:16 AM

This song needs more love.
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#89487: Sep 22nd 2018 at 6:20:05 PM

> One thing's for sure. I seriously don't want Cyclops anymore. The X-men movies totally ruined the character for me.

I remember watching last stand being like "They did NOT just kill off Cyclops,which they did,by having him walk into Jean or something

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#89488: Sep 22nd 2018 at 6:20:25 PM

[up][up]I guess we're getting an adaptation of this comic then.

Edited by Anomalocaris20 on Sep 22nd 2018 at 9:23:00 AM

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#89489: Sep 22nd 2018 at 6:52:30 PM

..why shouldn't Magneto be all of that? [...] Xavier is the MLK to Magneto's Malcolm X.

Malcolm X himself eventually changed from full black separatist to more hopeful for racial co-union through religion.

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#89490: Sep 22nd 2018 at 9:28:54 PM

He also didn't go around blowing up missile bases and killing Russian submarine crews. Though that would've made the last act of the Malcolm X movie even more interesting.

Edited by comicwriter on Sep 22nd 2018 at 9:28:30 AM

RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#89491: Sep 22nd 2018 at 10:13:41 PM

In the comics, has Xavier ever had a mutant nemesis who's the opposite of Magneto? Someone who, instead of being a militant mutant supremacist, is full-on The Quisling, selling out mutantkind as a whole so long as it means a privileged position for themself?

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#89492: Sep 22nd 2018 at 10:34:02 PM

If you actually read up on MLK and Malcolm X, you’ll notice they’re both been slanted badly by history. MLK was far more radical/less forgiving than he’s typically portrayed. Meanwhile, Malcom X wasn’t as violent as he’s typically portrayed. So the Magneto and Xavier comparison isn’t actually very good.

ViperMagnum357 Since: Mar, 2012
#89493: Sep 22nd 2018 at 10:57:41 PM

[up][up]Not exactly-the closest I can think of off hand would be Graydon Creed, the purely human son of 2 powerful mutants who goes on to hate all mutants, his parents most of all; and is usually one of the leaders or key allies of any anti-mutant group in the comics.

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#89494: Sep 22nd 2018 at 11:05:01 PM

There have been a number of mutant villains who willingly ally themselves with bigoted humans either for cash or the promise of safety. The 90s cartoon also had a bit in the Bad Future where there were mutant bounty hunters/enforcers who were tasked with rounding up runaway mutants for the concentration camps. It's actually how Bishop is introduced before his Heel–Face Turn.

EDIT: And they don't quite fit that definition, but there was a team called Freedom Force, which was made up of incarcerated mutant criminals who agreed to work for the U.S. government in exchange for leniency. So they were on the wrong side and working for the humans, but it was mostly out of self preservation rather than any actual ill-will towards their fellow mutants.

Edited by comicwriter on Sep 22nd 2018 at 11:08:46 AM

ViperMagnum357 Since: Mar, 2012
#89495: Sep 22nd 2018 at 11:12:47 PM

[up]Bishop, that was the one I was thinking of! I knew the name was church-ish (Bishop, Creed...) I remembered there were a lot of mutants who hunted other mutants for rewards or because they were coerced/enslaved, but I am not sure any of them fit The Quisling per se.

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#89496: Sep 23rd 2018 at 12:13:04 AM

Genosha had its Magistrates, before Magneto took over the country.

...Cameron Hodge? Angel's college roommate, not a mutant, but he started out as the business manager for the original X-Factor, was later revealed to be in league with anti-mutant terrorists, and is implied (I think) to have been jealous of Angel all along. Then he got his head cut off and came back as a giant Genoshan cyborg who eventually became a herald of the Phalanx.

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#89497: Sep 23rd 2018 at 8:06:03 AM

So first off I'd keep the X-Men as an entirely separate universe that occasionally crosses over with the main MCU. Anyway if I were rebooting the X-Men I'd probably establish that there were different stages in his life. At first he was friends with Charles and helped recruit and train young mutants. Over time he became disillusioned and resented Charles idealism towards Mutant-Human relations.

Following some incident he decides to go full Mutant separatist and wants to establish a haven for them away from normal society. During this period he's not actively trying to wipe out humans but he's not against fighting them if they get in his way. Eventually this ends with Charles and the original X-Men class stopping him before he goes off the deep end into all out human genocide.

By the time of the movies there's a new group of Mutants and Magneto is more of a background character. He still doesn't think relations will ever improve but he's not going to actively kill humans unless they attack him or his companions. He also helps the X-Men if needed although he leans towards being an Anti-Hero or Sour Supporter of the group.

Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#89499: Sep 23rd 2018 at 1:07:52 PM

[up][up] Magneto can work as a lore character rather than being the Big Bad once again.

Just Makima.
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#89500: Sep 23rd 2018 at 2:08:47 PM

[up][up]That is some fantastic editing. [lol]


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