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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Galadriel Since: Feb, 2015
#88301: Aug 8th 2018 at 3:14:55 PM

Honestly, I wasn't especially impressed with either of the GOTG films, so I don't mind if they throw out Gunn's script. His style (and Quill's personality) was always rather too dudebro-ish for my tastes.

If the rumour about them throwing out the script is just a rumour, Marvel is fine; and if they are throwing out the script, they're still fine. It's not as if Marvel has a shortage of other movies they could move forward to take the place of GOTG 3.

Edited by Galadriel on Aug 8th 2018 at 6:22:33 AM

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#88302: Aug 8th 2018 at 4:13:48 PM

Same. Honestly I think it's pointless to work ourselves up in a frenzy over this until more concrete information comes out.

Rabbitearsblog Movie and TV Goddess from United States Since: Jan, 2014 Relationship Status: You cannot grasp the true form
Movie and TV Goddess
#88303: Aug 8th 2018 at 4:20:50 PM

[up]

Besides, if GOTG 3 ended up doing badly, then it's not completely bad for Marvel since they still can make money off of Avengers 4 or any other movie that is coming out in the near future. Also, it's not really the end of the world if they changed the script to the movie to fit another director's vision. I would rather have the script be rewritten in a way that would satisfy the current director than to have the new director try to follow a script that wasn't written for them. Just look at Justice League (2017) as a bad example of a new director taking the script from a previous director.

I love animation, TV, movies, YOU NAME IT!
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#88304: Aug 8th 2018 at 4:28:18 PM

You can't really compare this because when Whedon took over the movie was already well into production and to a large part shot. You can't even compare this with the Ant-man situation, because there Reed took over the last minute and had to meet a very specific release date.

A change of directors early on in the game is not that unusual and is in itself a neutral feature.

Mario1995 The Dishonorable from Atlanta Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
The Dishonorable
#88305: Aug 8th 2018 at 4:29:22 PM

That, and Justice League was a big money loser for WB once the reviews and box office gross came out.

"The devil's got all the good gear. What's God got? The Inspiral Carpets and nuns. Fuck that." - Liam Gallagher
XJTordecai Watch the seventh wave Since: Jun, 2013
Watch the seventh wave
#88306: Aug 8th 2018 at 7:35:07 PM

Well I just got back from Ant-Man and the Wasp. Great stuff. Scott Lang is a really damn good dad, which is refreshing after...y'know. Hope was great, Luis was a joy, and Ghost was a very, VERY pleasant surprise of an antagonist. She's pretty high on my MCU villain rankings, let's just say. I don't have that much to say, it was a fun ride that I think improves on what the first movie brought to the table and lands probably in the upper half of the franchise. Damn I still need to see more of these.

On my wave, passing oooooooon
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#88307: Aug 8th 2018 at 7:45:07 PM

I don’t know I found Ghost rather ...... okay I guess for an antagonist or character.

Like she’s sympathetic or pitiable but...... that’s it honestly.

Great costume though. [tup]

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
HarpieSiren Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: I've been dreaming of True Love's Kiss
#88308: Aug 8th 2018 at 7:49:03 PM

I recently started doing a rewatch of the MCU (one film a week for 20 weeks) and I watched The Incredible Hulk for the first time...

And geez, that was very much a Just Here for Godzilla sort of a thing. The first half of the film was very dour and boring, but at least the Hulk fights were cool?

Banner/Hulk is my favorite character in the MCU, but a lot of that is because I very much like what Mark Ruffalo brings to the character, and if he hadn't been recast I'm not sure I'd have the same opinion of him.

Galadriel Since: Feb, 2015
#88309: Aug 8th 2018 at 8:38:53 PM

I enjoyed Ant-Man and the Wasp a lot - and more than I expected to. It's a good example of how a movie can be compelling without especially high stakes. There's no cosmic, global, national, or even citywide thread - really, not much danger to anyone but the main characters. And even with Scott, Hope and Hank, the villain's main goal is to steal their stuff in order to survive - not to kill them.

I found it far more engaging than Ant-Man, and in some ways more than Thor: Ragnarok, because the movie and the characters committed to those stakes despite them being fairly low. When a movie's constantly undercutting its tension and emotive moments and saying "Hey, don't take this seriously", it's hard to feel much interest even in large-scale threats. Comparatively lower stakes can get the audience more invested so long as the movie genuinely gives us a reason to care about them, while still allowing the film to be lighthearted and fun.

Regarding the villain: I liked Ghost, and honestly she's very much an Anti-Villain. Her goal is to survive and be relieved of her continual horrible pain. She doesn't do anything especially terrible, and the one time she is desperate enough to cross a line, she lets an ally talk her out of it. And in the end, the heroes give her the help she needs and she stops being a villain. I wish we had more comic book plots like that, where the hero can stop the villain by way of actually addressing the thing that's driving them to villainy.

Still, I do have to say: this is not the MCU's first female-led (or co-led) movie. That's still to come in Captain Marvel. The film is still very much told through Scott's eyes; it's his acquaintances (Luis et al) and Hank's (the university professor) who are pulled into the plot, not Hope's; it's his emotional growth that we see, far more than hers. It may be her and Hank's goal that drives the plot, but the story is still more Scott's (and Hank's) than hers. And of course she gets dusted at the end, while Scott survives to get the big role in Avengers 4, though Marvel could just as easily have done it the other way around if they'd wanted to.

Edited by Galadriel on Aug 8th 2018 at 11:48:50 AM

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#88310: Aug 8th 2018 at 8:54:14 PM

One thing I wasn't clear on, the corrupt FBI agent; did Ghost kill him, or just subdue him? I forget if the film was explicit about his fate.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#88311: Aug 8th 2018 at 9:03:05 PM

I have to say though I found the solution to Ghosts issues kinda a cop-out.

Janet comes in & she “miraculously” has the solution to all her worries that instantly calmed her down from her very homicidal behavior.

I didn’t like that.

Edited by slimcoder on Aug 8th 2018 at 9:06:24 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#88312: Aug 8th 2018 at 9:05:52 PM

[up][up]It was hard to me to see, but it looked to me like she reached into his chest and attacked his heart, though it looks like the trope page says she snapped his neck. She does say at the end "I've killed people."

[up]Kinda the same. I expected there'd be a slower solution for Ghost that Janet would help on over the following weeks, though I guess the credits does imply she's not fully 100% cured yet.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#88313: Aug 8th 2018 at 9:22:11 PM

Its not so much a copout considering the cure that she and Foster were working on involved the quantum energy that Jan had absorbed. It just turns out that if they had cooled their heels, Jan could have willingly shared it instead of it having to be ripped out.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Luigisan98 A wandering user from Venezuelan Muscat Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
A wandering user
#88314: Aug 9th 2018 at 1:32:54 AM

I think James Gunn may still have a future with Marvel and even Disney in spite of his firing.

http://www.ign.com/articles/2018/08/08/james-gunn-might-still-have-a-future-with-disney-and-marvel

The only good fanboy, is a redeemed fanboy.
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#88315: Aug 9th 2018 at 1:39:56 AM

"When a movie's constantly undercutting its tension and emotive moments and saying "Hey, don't take this seriously", it's hard to feel much interest even in large-scale threats."

I feel Marvel is trying to abandon this aproach of comedy the more it move out, some have it like Doctor Strange or Ragnarok but in general they are taking themselves a little bit more seriously.

A little bit.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
GAP Formerly G.G. from Who Knows? Since: May, 2011 Relationship Status: In love with love
Formerly G.G.
#88316: Aug 9th 2018 at 1:42:00 AM

[up] That is all we ask....

"Mai waifu."
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#88317: Aug 9th 2018 at 2:08:14 AM

I mean Black Panther & Infintiy War all have a lot of serious moments without any awkward comedy moments so they have already been long doing that.

Edited by slimcoder on Aug 9th 2018 at 2:08:38 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#88318: Aug 9th 2018 at 2:13:45 AM

[up]Infinity war dosent really count since a) it have Thannos(one of marvel biggest villian) and b) it is one of the most hyped movie ever, so they have to be serious about it.

Black panther on the other hand is a origin movie and this one tend to be waaaaaay less serious and more goofy, often playing the whole "no serious, lol" but instead it have very little comedy in it(what, three, four moments?), which is very refreshing for marvel to do.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#88319: Aug 9th 2018 at 2:14:52 AM

Uh Black Panther isn’t an origin movie.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Luigisan98 A wandering user from Venezuelan Muscat Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
A wandering user
#88320: Aug 9th 2018 at 11:58:00 AM

And now Marvel Comics is reportedly trying to bring James Gunn back now...

WHERE'S THE TRUTH?!

http://comicbook.com/marvel/2018/08/09/marvel-disney-james-gunn-guardians-of-the-galaxy-3-rehired/

The only good fanboy, is a redeemed fanboy.
HarpieSiren Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: I've been dreaming of True Love's Kiss
#88321: Aug 9th 2018 at 12:03:21 PM

Round and round the rumor mill goes, where it stops nobody knows.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#88322: Aug 9th 2018 at 12:06:00 PM

The truth?

You can't handle the truth!

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#88323: Aug 9th 2018 at 12:18:43 PM

I tell you want I can't handle:

All these different damn rumours.

...you know, while I said re-hiring him would be a mistake since he did write that stuff, the massive outpouring of support despite what he wrote from people who've worked with him (like the actual cast, and people who are friends with him) as opposed to the ostracization that most would get when they made a mistake like that makes me think Disney is willing to take him back because he's got a lot of good word backing him.

The fact that, while he hasn't out right apologized, he's made it clear he does regret what he said, and also that it was years ago and he's clearly changed (and has multiple people willing to vouch for that change) does seem to be playing a role in it as well.

Gunn is a lucky man... if this is true that is.

And even if not, he's still lucky to have so many good friends supporting him despite his mistake.

Not many get that.

One Strip! One Strip!
Luigisan98 A wandering user from Venezuelan Muscat Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
A wandering user
#88324: Aug 9th 2018 at 12:23:57 PM

[up] These people know that Humanity is just that. Human. Neither they're ones defined by good or bad, it all depends on what we do after all.

The only good fanboy, is a redeemed fanboy.
Mario1995 The Dishonorable from Atlanta Since: Nov, 2010 Relationship Status: Chocolate!
The Dishonorable
#88325: Aug 9th 2018 at 1:37:41 PM

I read that article and it seems that there's a nasty battle going on between Marvel Studios and Disney Studios management over Gunn, and it could have a significant effect not just on Marvel, but the entire Disney Studios going forward.

Marvel didn't sign off on Gunn's firing and wants him back, but Disney is holding firm because they want to protect their brand's "wholesome" image.

There's no scenario in which both Kevin Feige and Alan Horn will stay at Disney once this is settled. One of them will have to go.

BTW, a reporter at THR believes that someone at Deadline just took his story yesterday and re-arranged it as a scoop. If so, that reporter should be terminated for plagiarism.

Edited by Mario1995 on Aug 9th 2018 at 4:40:26 AM

"The devil's got all the good gear. What's God got? The Inspiral Carpets and nuns. Fuck that." - Liam Gallagher

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