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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#86101: May 5th 2018 at 4:38:07 PM

Hot take: I'd sooner watch Justice League than Age of Ultron.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#86102: May 5th 2018 at 4:39:44 PM

Yeah, TIR is very mediocre, but it’s still a passable movie. Same with Ultron, which is very much a textbook flashy but meh action flick that doesn’t treat its characters well.

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#86103: May 5th 2018 at 4:42:25 PM

Huh so Jusice League is 3 hours long and Ultron is 2 hours

I'd rather watch Ultron then waste three hours of batman vs superman

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#86104: May 5th 2018 at 4:43:08 PM

Justice League was only an hour and a half though?

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#86105: May 5th 2018 at 4:43:39 PM

Ironically part of AOU's flaws is that it's not long enough

THANKS JOSS WHEDON

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#86106: May 5th 2018 at 4:44:20 PM

god damn it I meant batman vs superman

stupid brain

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#86107: May 5th 2018 at 4:50:14 PM

Oh yeah, I saw Thor: Ragnarok recently. I really like the action, comedy, drama, message, and the Planet Hulk parts, but it feels inconsistent.

I wouldn't say the humor undercuts the drama, but the movie definitely undercuts itself. It's trying to be too many things at once, which makes those things not land as hard as they would if the movie had a clearer identity. I think the script definitely could've used one or two rewrites to streamline it better. Overall, it's really good, but it holds itself back from being great by trying to do too much.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#86108: May 5th 2018 at 4:50:46 PM

I'm standing by that I'd sooner watch Justice League than Age of Ultron and frankly I really don't think it says a lot about the MCU that their worst films are "serviceable". A lot of films can be considered serviceable, they're still not good, and I'd hardly consider Age of Ultron or The Incredible Hulk or even Iron Man 3 as falling under "good".

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#86109: May 5th 2018 at 4:51:22 PM

I wouldn't particularly call Age of Ultron or The Incredible Hulk decent by any measure of the word.

I would. TIH is basically a dumb but serviceable action movie, and Age of Ultron, while easily the weakest Avengers movie, isn't really terrible. If they'd cut most of the extraneous subplots and did a better job with Ultron's writing, it would've been a solid sequel.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#86110: May 5th 2018 at 4:54:49 PM

Decent would imply competent, and Age of Ultron is incompetent. It fucks up on a basic three act structure, that's not a sign of decency.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#86111: May 5th 2018 at 4:56:08 PM

[up][up]But the movie didnt, so it is terrible.

And yeah, servicable dosent mean good, at best it just past the checkbook to make it OK and that it.

"I'm standing by that I'd sooner watch Justice League than Age of Ultron "

For me Ao U is the Bv S of marvel: to many thing at ones, kinda nonsensical villian and too much of the author to enjoy.

At least Sydner is not a shitback like Wheedon.

edited 5th May '18 4:59:01 PM by unknowing

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#86112: May 5th 2018 at 4:56:52 PM

...shit, Snyder is actually a more decent human being than Joss fucking Whedon.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#86113: May 5th 2018 at 4:58:02 PM

Eh. There are a lot of good movies that don't follow the three act structure, so that doesn't really mean anything to me.

But the movie didnt, so it is terrible.

Nope.

At least Sydner is not a shitback like Wheedon.

Unless in extremely serious cases (like Polanski or Mel Gibson), the director's personal life doesn't really influence how I view their work. So again, that means nothing to me.

edited 5th May '18 4:59:22 PM by comicwriter

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#86114: May 5th 2018 at 4:58:43 PM

It's interesting to read Whedon's remarks on writing Age of Ultron and see how Infinity War is a huge opposite from it.

    Spoilers for Infinity War inside 
Age of Ultron specifically avoids making any Call-Back jokes, has too many individualized subplots, and refuses to end on a cliffhanger.

Infinity War has lots of Call-Back jokes (mostly in the sense of "this thing from past movies sounds really weird out of context"), cuts nearly all the subplots to one central theme, and ends in a massive cliffhanger spanning across the entire universe.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#86115: May 5th 2018 at 4:59:11 PM

[up][up]

Alright but Age of Ultron isn't a good movie and just saying "nope" isn't even a proper defense.

And uh, Whedon's personal life blatantly taints his work given his abuse of his former feminist credentials to cheat on his ex-wife. Makes all of the supposed feminism of his earlier works look fake.

edited 5th May '18 5:00:41 PM by AdricDePsycho

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#86116: May 5th 2018 at 5:00:00 PM

I thought Hulk was OK if boring.

That's what I used to think but I tried watching it again and it's much worse on rewatch. All of the characters except Tim Roth's are very poorly established and impossible to care about. It's barely even mediocre, the action scenes aren't even that good.

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#86117: May 5th 2018 at 5:00:04 PM

[up][up]Because I don't care.

[up][up][up]It also manages to do a solo Thor subplot much more effectively.

edited 5th May '18 5:00:16 PM by comicwriter

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#86118: May 5th 2018 at 5:01:16 PM

Then why bloody say anything if there's no care being held in this conversation?

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Cortez from Parts Unknown (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#86119: May 5th 2018 at 5:02:10 PM

Actually, it is. It's all subjective after all.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#86120: May 5th 2018 at 5:02:45 PM

Actually what is?

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#86121: May 5th 2018 at 5:03:01 PM

[up][up][up]The same reason anyone posts anything on the internet, I assume.

edited 5th May '18 5:03:09 PM by comicwriter

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#86122: May 5th 2018 at 5:03:18 PM

He means he doesn't care about Whedon,he likes the film regardless of Whedon,I'm much the same way,I'm not a fan of Whedon either but Ultron is entertaining..kinda

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#86123: May 5th 2018 at 5:05:32 PM

For me Ultron fails to be entrain because it just fall into the whole "force comedy" a lot of people complain about marvel.

In fact, Ao U pretty much contain the whole set of issues that have plague Marvel from start: the humor underminding serious scenes, too much snappy remarks, too much focus on the heroes being awsome at the expense of the story.etc.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#86124: May 5th 2018 at 5:06:35 PM

Eh. There are a lot of good movies that don't follow the three act structure, so that doesn't really mean anything to me.

There's plenty of good reason to break the three act structure, but when one does so they need to replace it with something better.

Age of Ultron's big break is moving the Darkest Hour from the end of the 2nd Act, to the start of it. It works briefly in making the heroes feel more emotionally challenged than they ever have before, but then results in there being no increase in darkness or stakes in the transition to the 3rd act. The discovery of the Ultron body in the Cradle, Widow's kidnapping, the Maximoff's defecting, they don't succeed in making anything feel darker than it already was. So the stakes mellow out rather than increase.

Keep in mind, Avengers 1 did a great job with its Darkest Hour, it being Coulson's death and Loki's escape.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#86125: May 5th 2018 at 5:07:10 PM

Age of Ultron is barely entertaining and it bangs in shitty joke after shitty joke over and over again to obnoxious levels, plus the screwing up of the three act structure ruins the flow. Saying "other films do it too" doesn't even prove anything. What other films do it? Are they actually good at it? That doesn't even mean Age of Ultron did a good job of it when it's one of the biggest flaws in the film.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?

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