TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Marvel Cinematic Universe

Go To

Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#82551: Mar 15th 2018 at 7:28:12 PM

Tony only built the turbines used to hold them in the sky. By definition, a killswitch would have dropped them into the Potomac.

But it would have done so with all of their weapons still armed and ready to fire at whatever's in their immediate vicinity if Hydra decides they want to go out spitefully. So I'm not quite sure this would strictly be an improvement over the original scenario.

edited 15th Mar '18 7:31:10 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
LordVatek Not really a lord of anything Since: Sep, 2014
Not really a lord of anything
#82552: Mar 15th 2018 at 8:01:44 PM

Thanos is Danny Rand.

What did Thanos ever do to deserve that kind of disrespect?

This song needs more love.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#82554: Mar 15th 2018 at 8:13:01 PM

He didn't do it himself quickly enough.

He's too much of a rich punk.

One Strip! One Strip!
AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#82555: Mar 15th 2018 at 8:17:40 PM

[up][up][up]

Well shit, you've got me there.

Anyways, me and a few tropers went back and rewatched the first Iron Man together, to kinda get readied for Infinity War. I didn't notice until now but god damn the pacing is absolutely tight. Every detail in there is important and necessary, the pacing is gorgeous, the editing and score are gorgeous, and you know, gonna be honest, Stane is seriously underrated as a villain. He gets lumped into the same league as other lesser MCU villains but while he's certainly not top tier, he ain't bottom tier either. I forgot how damn menacing and tense some of his scenes were. Stane is kind of basic, sure, but he's how you make a good basic villain. His motivation is greed but he stands as a symbol of the military-industrial complex and he's just so damn vile. That's something that's kind of missing from the sequels, the villains there don't fully tie into any of the themes. And damn he's creepy. Seriously, that bit where he comes in while Pepper is finding those files on the computer and he starts talking to her, that's about as tense as Vulture and Peter in the car from Spider-Man: Homecoming.

Props to Jeff Bridged and props to Faran Tahir as well for taking a character who would've in any other movie been a one note terrorist and made him actually have some genuine character to him, short as his time in the movie was. I'd heard he'd improvised a good deal of his lines to keep the character from being too much of an awful stereotype, and he actually sells his scenes effectively. Like damn, this guy needs to be cast more, holy shit.

That being said, I did notice some minor quibbles. There's one moment after Tony is rescued and gives a press conference about shutting down the weapons division where he goes up to Rhodey while he's lecturing some cadets, and he makes a quite blatantly transphobic joke about Rhodey sleeping with a trans woman and saying "What was his name, was it Ivan?". Yeah, 2008 and all, but ugh...Speaking of Rhodey, I still demand a special edition replacing Terrence Howard with Don Cheadle in every scene. Cheadle is a much better Rhodey and I'm still mad at how underused he is in the MCU.

But still, my criticisms are minor. I think I rate this film a lot higher than I did previously. It's seriously so good.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#82556: Mar 15th 2018 at 8:49:01 PM

Stane is also one of the big reasons why Iron Man 1 is better than its sequels by a good margin.

Sure, he may not have the complexity of Loki or Killmonger but he is very well-integrated into the narrative of the film and Tony's larger character arc. Tony's character development in the first film is centered on him becoming aware of how immoral his profession is and trying to find some purpose in his life by using his technological know-how to do something good and stop his company from supplying terrorists with weapons.

This puts him directly at odds with Stane, who is not only a symbol of the immorality and greed of the military-industrial complex, but also someone who Tony trusts and relies upon and so it has an impact when he not only betrays Tony, but was responsible for the events that turned him into Iron Man to begin with.

Also, Jeff Bridges' acting is seriously impressive given the relative simplicity of the material he's working with. He's extremely convincing and dominates every scene he's in.

Vanko and Killian suck balls compared to him. Vanko certainly had the building blocks of a good character, a good actor behind him, and a solid way to implement him to further Tony's character but in the end he feels like nothing more than a superfluous bad guy for Tony to fight after he resolves his daddy issues and stops self-destructing.

Killian we've gone on about before numerous times but beyond the whole mandarin thing and how underwhelming he is, he also feels completely disconnected from what's going on with Tony's story.

In addition, watching the film again I think a big part of the reason why Pepper continues to be an above-average love interest is two things. First, Paltrow and RDJ's interactions feel very spontaneous and authentic (moreso than many other romances of this nature), and secondly, Pepper actually saves Tony multiple times in multiple ways in the film. She keeps the old reactor without which Tony would have died, she gets the information that nails Stane as a murderer and terrorist backer, informs Coulson and by extension the government to have Stane arrested, and she assists Tony in taking out Stane in the final confrontation. The other films certainly mishandled her character a great deal but in Iron Man 1 she is easily one of the best superhero love interests around. That this was all from a film in 2008 is honestly kind of impressive since the standards were so much lower back then.

edited 15th Mar '18 9:01:06 PM by Draghinazzo

ComicFan Since: Sep, 2016
#82557: Mar 15th 2018 at 9:35:18 PM

Black Panther might pass The Last Jedi and The Avengers[1]

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#82558: Mar 15th 2018 at 9:36:19 PM

Oh please oh please oh please.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#82559: Mar 15th 2018 at 9:37:16 PM

[up][up][up]

Gonna quote Draghinazzo from when we were watching the movie but Pepper saved Tony's bacon ass several times over in several of the movies. There's numerous complaints to be levied for how she's handled in the movies but damn it Tony would be dead several times over if not for her.

edited 15th Mar '18 9:37:23 PM by AdricDePsycho

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#82560: Mar 15th 2018 at 9:53:03 PM

Pepper deserves to be an Avenger because she's killed more supervillains than Tony.

edited 15th Mar '18 10:00:40 PM by Tuckerscreator

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#82561: Mar 15th 2018 at 9:54:02 PM

They will call her Assault Pepper and she will have her Extremis powers and will not explode.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#82562: Mar 15th 2018 at 9:54:18 PM

I always thought Iron Man 1 dragged in the middle.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#82563: Mar 15th 2018 at 9:54:56 PM

Yeah, Tony hasn't killed any of the main villains of the movies he's been in, has he?

Pepper killed Stane and Killian, Vision killed Ultron, nobody killed Loki, Zemo, or Toomes, and Vanko was killed by... Vanko.

[up][up]Can she have an attack called Pepper Spray?

edited 15th Mar '18 9:55:19 PM by Anomalocaris20

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#82564: Mar 15th 2018 at 9:55:42 PM

Hell yes she can

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#82565: Mar 15th 2018 at 10:03:55 PM

[up][up][up]

Hardly. Maybe with the bits after Tony attacks the terrorists in Yinsen's hometown but the second act is fairly tight. I've heard more complaints about the third act, really, which I guess I can see since it's where it goes kinda more cartoonish but for the most part it's still fairly tight.

Also, can't believe I didn't notice this until now but the scene of Stane chasing after Pepper after he gets into the Iron Monger suit is kind of reminiscent of part of the Hulk chasing Black Widow in the first Avengers. Probably coincidental but slight resemblance.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#82566: Mar 15th 2018 at 10:06:39 PM

I remember seeing a neat clothing blog about MCU costuming that pointed out that Coulson's suit in this film is too big for him, giving him mild Obstructive Bureaucrat tones, while following films and shows that made him more heroic give him sharper suits.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#82567: Mar 15th 2018 at 10:10:58 PM

It's just kind of boring between Tony breaking out and Stane getting in the Iron Monger suit. There's some funny parts, and some shots of Tony killing terrorists are cool, but aside from that, it's a snooze-fest. I cannot take a businessman seriously as a villain in Iron Man until he can actually threaten Iron Man. Same problem Thor had, though at least Thor had a decent fight against Shield agents.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#82568: Mar 15th 2018 at 10:12:34 PM

I'd hardly call it a snoozefest. It's all stuff that's relevant to the plot for the most part, give or take some small padding. It's the saggiest, sure, but snoozefest is stretching it.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#82569: Mar 15th 2018 at 10:14:10 PM

He was a threat to Iron Man the whole time though, just not in the obvious physical way. He almost had him killed by terrorists and in the end and without Pepper saving the old reactor he would have died.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#82570: Mar 15th 2018 at 10:16:00 PM

Something else I'd realized is that Iron Man seems a bit weaker in this movie compared to the others? During the fight with Iron Monger, Tony's struggling to lift a car up. Unless I missed something there.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#82571: Mar 15th 2018 at 10:18:38 PM

[up]I think that can be easily justified with the argument that Tony's armors have gotten more powerful with time.

I was speaking a bit hyperbolically. It's not a snoozefest, I just came into the movie expecting mecha fights and I didn't get any until the climax.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#82572: Mar 15th 2018 at 10:20:08 PM

I wouldn't exactly call that a wrong set of expectations but I think that's kind of missing the point.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#82573: Mar 15th 2018 at 10:21:49 PM

Pepper killed Stane and Killian, Vision killed Ultron, nobody killed Loki, Zemo, or Toomes, and Vanko was killed by... Vanko.

Tony is the one who kills Vanko. The energy blast he and Rhodes generates is what did Vanko in not the self destruct.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#82574: Mar 15th 2018 at 10:23:29 PM

So Tony and Rhodes plus Vanko filling in that last bit (he was probably knocking on death's door by that point but he made sure to amp it up to "fucking dead as shit").

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#82575: Mar 15th 2018 at 10:24:36 PM

Wasn't Tony operating on low power when he was fighting Ironmonger? Because he was using the old reactor?

Forever liveblogging the Avengers

Total posts: 186,763
Top