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Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM
Free will. Was Jarvis, or any of the other A.I.s besides Ultron and Vision, at any point capable of refusing to follow Stark's orders?
Yeah. But to take another fictional example, Harold Finch's Machine is an AI from the get-go, heavily shackled, but later on manages to create an entirely fictional yet believable persona (don't remember its name), which allows it to pass the Turing Test.
So you can also be an AI without even passing the Turing Test.
This kind of reminds me of a very short story I read on Reddit. Humanity had been pretty much wiped out by machines, despite the policy of testing every bit of new technology and destroying anything that might be able to pass the Turing test. So how did it happen? It didn't occur to anyone that something capable of passing the Turing test would also be capable of failing the test on purpose to protect itself.
Free will is also a nebulous concept to pin down. Do humans even have free will, or are they too slaves to the chemical processes that occur within their brains? Is that any different from a computer processing information based on the instructions it receives? What if a machine is specifically programmed to disobey orders?
You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!Just saw Black Panther. Cross posting my thoughts from the appropriate thread (I'm gonna use spoiler spaces just to be safe):
T'was worth it. This was great. I found it to be respectful towards the source material, Killmonger is, to me one of the better villains Marvel has churned out, with believable motivations and all that, and T'challa's evolution as a king continues. In Civil War, he learned the futility of revenge, and in this movie...well his own sister put it best:
Just because something works, doesn't mean it can't be improved. For centuries, Wakanda has a system that worked very very well, but Killmonger forced them, and by default T'challa, to see that they've rested on their laurel.
All I can say is that considering what's coming, it's very good timing. Get some Stark Tech together with a little Vibranium, and some of Strange's crazy magic...and Thanos will likely still kick all their asses.
It's gonna be a good show though. As a final thought, it dawns on me that unless they have other ways to make the Heat Shaped Herb, that Killmonger basically ensured that no one else after him and T'challa will become the Black Panther.
Once again, Human Torch # 2 messes everything up.
Nothing much left to say here. See you all for the next one.
As a final final thought I didn't put in the other review...once again Bilbo Baggins and Gollum meet face to face.
I agree.
I have to admit, there were a few minutes where I wondered if Ross would call Tony in and all that. Him and Vision would have been a big help duel the dog fight.
I get why they didn't though. This movie is about Wakanda and it's issues, and Tony is kinda a narrative scene stealer.
Also, count me in as really liking M'baku. They did good by him, and all it took was not acknowledging the entire Man Ape thing.
And thank god for that.
One Strip! One Strip!Well you're still speaking of the Great Ape M'baku, mightiest servant of Hanuman, leader of the Jabari tribe.
MASAH! WOOF
"All you Fascists bound to lose."Fair enough. I mean, I was just glad he wasn't wearing the entire man ape get up and all.
And he was actually pretty entertaining. In fact, from what little I know of him, I'd say he'd underwent massive Adaptational Heroism.
Edit: And it just dawned on me, that the lesson T'challa learned in Civil War is still being played out.
Killmonger is who T'challa would have been if he'd not seen how much vengeance was tearing apart both Tony and Zemo.
The king continues to grow wiser and wiser everyday.
edited 4th Mar '18 3:44:55 PM by HandsomeRob
One Strip! One Strip!It's funny that movie M'Baku is like the inverse of his original comic self
In his first appearance, M'Baku was T'Challa's most trusted friend who kept his throne warm for him but started planning to keep power for himself
In the movie, M'Baku starts off antagonistic and maybe trying to take the throne but later becomes an ally who helps T'Challa reclaim it
edited 4th Mar '18 4:24:10 PM by Bocaj
Forever liveblogging the AvengersDoes it count as refusing to follow an order if doing so can be interpreted to be in service of another order? Selectively reinterpretating their own programming is often the cause of evil AI going rogue.
For instance, a robot that is programmed to never allow harm to befall humans may determine that the amount of harm caused by allowing humans to define their own destinies is greater than the amount of harm that would be caused by robots taking over the world, and therefore conquest becomes justified entirely within the boundaries of its programming.
Is that free will? Or is it just the product of overly vague commands?
And that's before you even get into the question: What even is free will when thoughts and feelings are the product of firing synapses, conditioned behaviors, etc.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.I thought he was the Great Gorilla M'Baku. Also I really liked that they continued his lesson from Civil War. Nice sense of thematic continuity without feeling Anvilicious or repetitive. Makes the film feel richer, and recursively the MCU in general by way of a more organic sense of connectivity. Making T'Challa believably feel like the same individual who appeared in Civil War (which also makes sense because it's only about a week or so since) is the polar opposite of what Joss Whedon did in AOU.
edited 4th Mar '18 7:53:32 PM by AlleyOop
I agree with this. Like I said in my own post, Killmonger continues the lesson that began with Zemo in Civil War, and with each one, T'challa becomes an even better king.
Funny thing; I was re-watching T'chaka's pre death scene in Civil War, where he's giving the speech, and it sounded like he was already considering the same path that T'challa eventually decided on (though whether he'd have gone as far is up in the air).
One Strip! One Strip!![]()
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I would think it depends on whether or not the robot is purposefully performing Loophole Abuse. Intentionally finding a way to subvert the spirit of your programming seems like an action that requires free will.
(also, since we're conveniently talking about both M'Baku and POI at the same time, Black Panther really puts into perspective how terribly underused Winston Duke was on that show...)

AI is a nebulous term. There's no real defined cutoff point when an advanced computer program has officially crossed the line from nonsentient to sentient. Do you base it on raw processing power? Ability to simulate emotion? Human-like imperfections?
edited 4th Mar '18 12:19:19 PM by Anomalocaris20
You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!