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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#80076: Feb 8th 2018 at 10:48:22 AM

Can we get some examples? I saw a Dutch review that gave the film 8/10, saying it was good but wasn’t perfect.

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#80077: Feb 8th 2018 at 10:49:22 AM

Gi TS was subject to such a gigantic shitstorm of pointless, manufactured controversy that it being critically assassinated was unavoidable.

Yes, because controversial movies are never ever well reviewed.

GKG Since: Nov, 2012
#80078: Feb 8th 2018 at 10:49:49 AM

I can provide a few French reviews:

https://www.journaldugeek.com/critique/critique-black-panther-veut-enfin-faire-murir-marvel-universe/ (to sum it up: it's a good Marvel, but the usual Marvel flaws are there, and it's got inconsistent pacing).

http://www.commeaucinema.com/showbiz/black-panther-le-meilleur-film-marvel-decouvrez-notre-avis,363577 (basically the same thing).

https://freakingeek.com/black-panther-de-ryan-coogler-critique-cine/ (same).

https://www.cineserie.com/critiques/cine/black-panther-un-film-de-super-heros-moins-original-quil-ny-parait-1314840/ (same).

Basically, they all seem to think that it's a good Marvel film, with the usual Marvel strenghts and flaws but without really doing anything new with the formula. It's got a strong cast and well-rounded characters, but it's not the life-changing experience some claim it to be, and the political message isn't all that deep or meaningful.

Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#80079: Feb 8th 2018 at 10:56:01 AM

[up]Ok, that sounds right. They don’t hate it, it seems, but it still has some of those flaws. It’s not a life-changing experience but it isn’t Dawn of Justice. I get that. It still seems to trend positive though.

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#80080: Feb 8th 2018 at 10:56:12 AM

To be clear: the 99% score on Rotten Tomatoes doesn't mean that all the reviewers think it's a 99/100 film. It means that 99% of reviewers think it's above 50%. The actual average rating is 8.4/10, which seems more in line with what you're saying. It's a good, even great, but flawed movie.

NoName999 Since: May, 2011
#80081: Feb 8th 2018 at 10:58:58 AM

But guys, GKG is right?

The critics are just ess-jay-double-u's. They won't dare bash a superhero movie starring a black person. I mean Catwoman and Steel were both praised to high Heaven by critics!!!!

[up]Shhh let him keep pedaling this alt right conspiracy. I want to see someone get banned once he eventually drops whatever pretenses he has. [lol]

edited 8th Feb '18 11:01:04 AM by NoName999

RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#80082: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:00:31 AM
Thumped: for switching the discussion from the topic to a person. Doesn't take many of this kind of thump to bring a suspension. Stay on the topic, not the people in the discussion.
"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
GKG Since: Nov, 2012
#80083: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:01:43 AM
Thumped: This post has been thumped with the mod stick. This means knock it off.
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#80084: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:03:30 AM

[up][up]Well there was the Oscar winning Suicide Squad!tongue

RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#80085: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:03:54 AM

Ooh, first mention of "identity politics!"

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#80086: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:04:47 AM
Thumped: for switching the discussion from the topic to a person. Doesn't take many of this kind of thump to bring a suspension. Stay on the topic, not the people in the discussion.
Luigisan98 A wandering user from Venezuelan Muscat Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
A wandering user
#80087: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:06:38 AM

GKG...would you kindly shut up with that rhethoric of yours? It's not the truth at all in an universal way and there's no WAY in hell in pretending yourself to be the only one using its head when it's the other way around.

So in any case, whatever comes out of your mouth, it's better if you could try to a brick wall because of how 100% pure crap it absolutely is.

The only good fanboy, is a redeemed fanboy.
GKG Since: Nov, 2012
#80088: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:07:43 AM

[up]Why should I? Does it make you uncomfortable?

Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#80089: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:07:51 AM

Whatever the merits of GKG's argument, he didn't suddenly make it massively personal guys. Can we all just stay away from the Ad Hominem cheap shots?

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
Eagal Since: Apr, 2012
#80090: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:08:52 AM

I feel this line of discussion is far too divisive. Instead let's discuss whether T'Challa is a Gary Stu.

Luigisan98 A wandering user from Venezuelan Muscat Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: I <3 love!
A wandering user
#80091: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:08:58 AM

[up][up] We could if he shuts up for once.

edited 8th Feb '18 11:09:11 AM by Luigisan98

The only good fanboy, is a redeemed fanboy.
Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#80092: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:10:57 AM

[up][up] That... doesn't sound like it would be less divisive...

How about... what sort of out there films would anyone like to see for the MCU? Like, really obscure characters you'd like to see get their own movie?

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
RBluefish Since: Nov, 2013
#80093: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:11:20 AM

Remember when people were losing their marbles over not recasting Iron Fist as an Asian guy? And then getting on Finn Jones' case when someone attacked him on Twitter and he engaged them respectfully?

*leans back in leather chair and lights a pipe* Oh, I remember it all too well.

Remember when Asian-Americans made vocal criticisms of the way a certain outdated character archetype was going to be portrayed in a major upcoming piece of media, and suggested a way to fix the problems while remaining true to the overall story?

And an Asian woman provided criticism of the way Finn Jones's rhetoric compared to his actions (which apparently constitutes an "attack") and he quit Twitter over it because apparently he wasn't up for a debate?

"We'll take the next chance, and the next, until we win, or the chances are spent."
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#80094: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:12:50 AM

[up][up] I think it's a joke about the stupid Rey debates in the Star Wars threads.

Eagal Since: Apr, 2012
#80095: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:13:48 AM

I was being ironic, yes. But as far as comparatively obscure Marvel characters that should get a movie...Idunno. Bishop?

wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#80096: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:14:29 AM

[up][up][up][up][up]I want a Ms. Marvel Netflix show. An optimistic, cheesy, sincere high school show about the hard work of being a good person and a hero. Kamala Khan is a precious sweetheart.

[up][up][up] Yes to all of that; great summary.

edited 8th Feb '18 11:16:52 AM by wisewillow

Sigilbreaker26 Serial Procrastinator Since: Nov, 2017
Serial Procrastinator
#80097: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:14:51 AM

Like, what I'd find interesting would be a standalone Nova film, as sort of a cop film IN SPACE. I think that would be pretty interesting. We've had two guardians of the galaxy films, but I think a full-on cop film would be pretty cool.

Khamala Khan isn't a bad idea either, I've heard pretty good stuff about her.

edited 8th Feb '18 11:15:33 AM by Sigilbreaker26

"And when the last law was down and the Devil turned round on you, where would you hide, the laws all being flat?"
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#80098: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:17:15 AM

And then getting on Finn Jones' case when someone attacked him on Twitter and he engaged them respectfully?

I believe there were multiple incidents of Finn Jones on twitter, but the one I remember most vividly is basically the opposite of what you're describing. Some person criticized Finn Jones for trying to include himself in the diversity conversation (in about the most polite way you could do so) when he's starring in a show that promotes a dated and cringey story archetype and then he got extremely defensive and basically quit twitter over it.

To be blunt, by this point you've made it pretty transparent what your reasons for making this argument are, and I should probably tell you that you're not going to get a lot of traction here (in case that wasn't already obvious). When you claimed the whole world lost its marbles over "identity politics", you basically lost any claim to credibility you might have otherwise had.

You can keep beating on this drum if you want, but nobody is going to take it seriously. And for the record, it has very little to do with whether you think Black Panther is as good as the reviews are saying.

edited 8th Feb '18 11:25:54 AM by Draghinazzo

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#80099: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:18:34 AM

I actually wasn't aware you were making fun of Star Wars there, since T'Challa HAS been accused of being a Gary Stu in the past in the comics.

NoName999 Since: May, 2011
#80100: Feb 8th 2018 at 11:21:50 AM

Whatever the merits of GKG's argument, he didn't suddenly make it massively personal guys. Can we all just stay away from the Ad Hominem cheap shots?

Someone claiming there's a conspiracy to inflate the scores of a movie, is a personal slight to me as a human being with critical thinking skills.

I mean, it also doesn't help that he's parroting alt right talking points.

edited 8th Feb '18 11:30:48 AM by NoName999


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