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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#78351: Dec 25th 2017 at 8:05:54 AM

Fine,they happened

Except the Airbender film,that was all a fever dream

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#78352: Dec 25th 2017 at 8:06:40 AM

Danny Devito would be a good MCU pick, but I dunno for who.

Maybe Galactus.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#78353: Dec 25th 2017 at 8:10:02 AM

Danny Devito would make a good Tony Stark

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
wisewillow She/her Since: May, 2011
She/her
#78354: Dec 25th 2017 at 8:13:32 AM

[up][up][up]Airbender film? What Airbender film? They definitely never whitewashed the cast, screwed up the plot, and made a creepy nightmare Appa.

edited 25th Dec '17 8:13:50 AM by wisewillow

kkhohoho (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#78355: Dec 25th 2017 at 9:29:55 AM

[up]Or drained any and all talent out of the cast. No sir.

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#78356: Dec 25th 2017 at 11:24:38 AM

Or gave Yue an unusually phalic hairstyle and had her sacrifice herself to prove that she believed in her beliefs just as much as the Fire Nation believed in theirs.

Nope that did not happen and you are clearly lying if you claim otherwise so stop lying! Stop it!

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#78357: Dec 25th 2017 at 11:48:12 AM

I can't wait for live action Legend of Korra!

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#78358: Dec 25th 2017 at 1:51:02 PM

I've been doing some thinking, and I think I really like the idea someone mentioned a while back: have the X-Men live in a separate universe that basically is a stand-in for the Ultimates universe. Have the X-Men universe be edgier (already done) and maybe do crossover events between it and the main MCU. You could even reinroduce characters from the MCU in the X-Men verse and have them either be recast or have the original actor reprise their role in a different way.

Have X-Universe Peter Parker already be in his 30s, to set up for his death and introduce Miles Morales, a young mutant who coincidentally has similar powers to Peter who decides to take up the mantle of Spider-Man. Have a Spider-Verse crossover movie where X-Universe Miles teams up with MCU Peter, as well as a bunch of other alternate universe Spideys.

BigK1337 Since: Jun, 2012
#78359: Dec 25th 2017 at 11:24:23 PM

On the topic of Magneto and changing his orgin to fit in modern time line: I’m amazed nobody didn’t just suggest he grew up during the Israel-Palestinian Conflict (btw this is another idea I have for the X-Men in my revised universe). I am debating on whether to have him being from Israel (to keep his Jewish ethnicity and reason for his extensive knowledge in military combat via being a part of the army) or Palestine (to retain his origin of experiencing great tragedies from the hands of humans), all I know is this is (IMO) the best way to update the character without trying to be insulting towards another race/belief/nation as we all know of the tragedies that conflict cause and its not to far fetched that it could create actual Magnetos from the event much like World War II.

Also to continue the updating train for X-Villains, lets do some obvious real world allegories with the human groups with F.O.H. being alt right and the Purifiers as Muslim extremists. For the former, duh. For the latter its mostly cosmetic update on the concept of said group of being religious fundamentalist who take their beliefs to violent measures by commiting acts of terrorism to get their way.

Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#78360: Dec 26th 2017 at 1:39:10 AM

While the prospect is intriguing, I don't think many characters scream more for golbal outrage than "Palestinian Magneto".

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#78361: Dec 26th 2017 at 8:13:33 AM

So....next villain article is up. This time it is about Ronan.

https://swanpride3.wordpress.com/2017/12/26/marvel-musings-ronan-the-accuser/

And yes, I know that I go a little bit against general opinions with this one....

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#78362: Dec 26th 2017 at 8:16:28 AM

I think most people in the thread like Ronan for many of the reasons you lay out.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#78363: Dec 26th 2017 at 8:21:41 AM

[up] Really? Because he is so often mentioned as an example for the "bad" Marvel villains I got the impression that most people wouldn't agree with my ranking...I mean, so far he is the best ranked of the villains (though I naturally haven really gotten to the great ones yet).

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#78364: Dec 26th 2017 at 8:24:27 AM

Ronan isn't a good villain, but its a necessary evil he'd be flat for the sake of giving the protagonists time to become characters.

TommyFresh Since: Aug, 2013
#78365: Dec 26th 2017 at 8:45:28 AM

People seem to enjoy Ronan more than the other underdeveloped villains. I personally think Ronan is a serviceable villain who benefits from having a good actor really hamming it up. So he's an average yet entertaining villain. Hela's kind of in the same boat for me, although I think she's a stronger character overall.

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#78366: Dec 26th 2017 at 9:13:24 AM

[up] Well, yes. They are both Disney villains in the traditional sense. They don't need to be complex, they need a great performance and a memorable design. Honestly, the main reason why Hela has a chance to win over Ronan is because of her helmet and a compelling performance - otherwise, I think she isn't quite as well-utilized as Ronan is. But I haven't written her article yet, so who knows where I will settle with her.

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#78367: Dec 26th 2017 at 9:26:50 AM

It's a pretty thankless role, in a way, but for lack of competition at the time, Ronan was one of my favourite MCU villains. Execution (yes) counts. Ham is part of the appeal with any supervillain, I like Lee Pace and he really rises to the occasion here, as a kind of modern take on Ming the Merciless. Now if only they hadn't wasted Djimon Hounsou as a flunky.

Ronan's hamminess is apparently a case of James Gunn wanting it to be as over the top as possible, with Pace being like hey, is this too much? and Gunn saying no, MORE.

Cate Blanchett gives an excellent physical performance (and that voice), but Ronan has better dialogue, plus some very memorable, very visual scenes. He also gets to be way more powerful than his enemies, which means he's never upstaged. GOTG keeps on reducing the number of active participants in the final battle, whereas Ragnarok actually adds more threats as it branches into multiple running battles.

edited 26th Dec '17 12:26:56 PM by Unsung

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#78368: Dec 26th 2017 at 9:27:47 AM

@Magneto is from Israel or Palestine: I think Marvel would want to avoid kicking that particular hornets nest since it's an ongoing conflict. There's no way to do it without pissing off a lot of people.

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#78369: Dec 26th 2017 at 9:31:04 AM

It's honestly starting to look like Magneto is on the same level as outdated as the Mandarin.

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#78370: Dec 26th 2017 at 9:55:27 AM

[up][up][up] True. I think the best thing about Ronan is that he is genuinely threatening. Even when his is stripped of all his resources but the stone, he still comes close to getting what he wants in his fanaticism.

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#78371: Dec 26th 2017 at 10:06:06 AM

Hela probably would've worked better if they milked the deaths of the Warriors Three a lot more. I get why they didn't (the Thor movies have always had a problem with being overstuffed with cast), but they needed to twist that knife more. It feels like a bit of a disservice to those characters for them to die in seconds without anyone onscreen mourning them (other than Skurge, sort of, which was weird), and it also detracts from the display of power that Hela's meant to be showing. Nice that they gave Hogun that final charge, but it would've been better for them all to die together, after having at least one last scene with Thor, and hell, maybe Loki, too— they *were* all friends when this trilogy started, after all.

Punisher286 Since: Jan, 2016
#78372: Dec 26th 2017 at 10:56:59 AM

My problem with Ronan, is that he's far less interesting than his comic book counterpart. The latter is actually interesting, and complex. So when I see him reduced to a two-dimensional mustache-twirler, I cannot help but be underwhelmed (despite Lee Pace's performance).

Hela, well the problem with her is that her "new" backstory feels, undercooked. Like she and Thor being related doesn't end up mattering much as they don't really do anything with that dynamic. And she and Odin don't get a scene in the present either. As it stands, she could have just been a former general of Odin who wasn't related, or an ex-lover, or whatever, and it'd have had pretty much the same effect. Also her motives are pretty basic.

Even her being the "Goddess of Death" feels pretty superfluous.

In short, BOTH of them only sort of work as villains BECAUSE of the actor's performances (and cool visual designs).

SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#78373: Dec 26th 2017 at 10:57:50 AM

"Far less interesting than their comic book counterpart" could basically be added to the character page of the entire MCU. .

My various fanfics.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#78374: Dec 26th 2017 at 11:19:14 AM

Decades of continuity to build them up usually

It took Ronan years to be more than a mustache twirler

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#78375: Dec 26th 2017 at 11:22:46 AM

Ronan had an uphill fight as a character because he had to share his screentime with five heroes who each needed their own backstory and development, not just one. In that respect, a more simple-minded villain who doesn't need too much backstory, like a fanatical terrorist, is an appropriate choice, and Ronan fills that role pretty damn perfectly.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!

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