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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#78251: Dec 22nd 2017 at 1:08:18 PM

[up]Don't forget Ego, Ego was great.

Personally, I want them to do the Fantastic 4 and Dr. Doom justice before even touching the X-Men.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#78252: Dec 22nd 2017 at 1:12:12 PM

If you do use Magneto, I suggest Genosha as the villains

Movie can end with Magneto overthrowing the human government and the X Men divided about how they should feel about it

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#78253: Dec 22nd 2017 at 1:17:33 PM

I mean, I like that idea, but I can't help feel that it would invite comparisons to certain...divisive issues.

Particularly since Magneto's Jewish.

I mean, it wouldn't be a one-to-one thing, obviously, but still, I can see people saying stuff like that, and I can see it getting ugly.

edited 22nd Dec '17 1:18:25 PM by KarkatTheDalek

Oh God! Natural light!
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#78254: Dec 22nd 2017 at 1:19:24 PM

Dammit real life

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#78255: Dec 22nd 2017 at 2:44:33 PM

Do a good Hellfire Club. Imagine being like a sub group from HYDRA who is trying to continue where they left off in controlling society.

Just Makima.
Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#78256: Dec 22nd 2017 at 5:12:19 PM

When your track record for creating main villains is dubious, I'd say trying to go for the ensemble cast of villains is not the wisest move.

The Hellfire Club are a bunch of mustache-twirling assholes, there's not much depth to be found in them, unless you plan on making Emma Frost a mainstay of your universe and you use them to introduce her - but if your plan is to have Emma make a Heel–Face Turn down the line you are limited in what she is allowed to do or go with.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#78257: Dec 22nd 2017 at 5:15:05 PM

She murdered a horse to gaslight a young woman into becoming an assassin in the comics and still did a heel face turn

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
kkhohoho (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#78258: Dec 22nd 2017 at 5:15:36 PM

[up][up]I'd say they're worth keeping around for a movie or two, at least if you want to do a proper Dark Pheonix Saga movie. Other than that, what else can you do with them?

[up]Most people don't know about the horse. Hell, I completely forgot about the horse until you brought it up. When people bring up reasons for why Emma shouldn't have been redeemed, I don't think that's the first thing to come to mind.

edited 22nd Dec '17 5:17:40 PM by kkhohoho

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#78259: Dec 22nd 2017 at 5:19:56 PM

Bringing up weird trivia is what powers me

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#78260: Dec 22nd 2017 at 5:28:35 PM

I don't mean that Emma Frost is consistently written in the comics, but the MCU doesn't have the latitude for retcons or forgiveness comic books have due to their format.

Besides, the Dark Phoenix movie of next year hasn't been cancelled yet, so Marvel is unlikely to immediately pick it up afterwards.

Especially as the Dark Phoenix is an opponent you can reasonably pit the Avengers again, so if they were to use it, I think it would not be in a movie with mutants only. There aren't many cosmic-level threats available, especially threats who don't look a lot like a Thanos rerun (Galactus and the other evil overlords of his ilk).

MedusaStone Since: Jan, 2015
#78261: Dec 22nd 2017 at 5:39:07 PM

I've been thinking about something. Regarding Cap 2, a lot of people seemed to think that HYDRA secretly running SHIELD was a cop-out; that it would've been better if it really 'had been SHIELD's actions and justifications becoming more and more questionable, and Steve having to make a choice. With that thought in mind, the Sokovia Accords. At some point over the course of these next two movies (Infinity War and the next one) the Accords have to be addressed and dealt with. What do think the chances are that when we really get into the Accords in detail, it'll be at least suggested that HYDRA had something to do with the drafting/implementation? Just, the Accords almost seemed tailor made to hinder the Avengers, and I don't believe for a second that HYDRA is really gone. More likely the remnants just dug even deeper into hiding and went back to what they were doing before the great D.C. clusterfuck of 2014.

edited 22nd Dec '17 5:39:25 PM by MedusaStone

Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#78262: Dec 22nd 2017 at 5:46:13 PM

I really don't think Hydra should come back. They got the exposure they deserved, and any reveal that "they were actually still there" would look like a horrible (and much weaker) ripoff of TWS.

Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#78263: Dec 22nd 2017 at 5:53:36 PM

Yeah HYDRA like SHIELD should stay dead, but you could use spliter groups. Like if Hellfire was connected that could explain how Wanda ended up in their cluches.

Just Makima.
MadSkillz Destroyer of Worlds Since: Mar, 2013 Relationship Status: I only want you gone
Destroyer of Worlds
#78264: Dec 22nd 2017 at 10:10:04 PM

One thing about introducing mutants is if they don't want to make Magneto the father of Wanda, they could take totally make him a minority of some other genocide that occurred.

Like maybe the Guatemalan genocide.

But if Captain America survives IW, it might be nice if Magneto's camp at Holocaust was actually saved by Captain America. Would be a nice moment between the two.

edited 22nd Dec '17 10:11:18 PM by MadSkillz

RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#78265: Dec 22nd 2017 at 11:28:57 PM

I think that, if you change what genocide Magneto was victimized by, you have to be very careful not to make him a race which is currently doing a major civil rights push in the U.S., otherwise he could easily be interpreted as a harsh criticism of that movement (especially if Professor X, the one always lecturing him on the right way to fight against discrimination, is still a white guy).

I think a good villain to use in an X-Men reboot movie would be Mastermind. He's a classic X-Men foe but hasn't been used in a movie yet, and his telepathy based powers could let him be a good counter to/evil opposite of Professor X. You'd need to give him some minions whose abilities are more inclined towards physical combat, but while the comics have mostly used him as a second banana in someone else's supervillain organization, it makes sense that a guy called Mastermind would have people working for him.

BigK1337 Since: Jun, 2012
#78266: Dec 22nd 2017 at 11:47:40 PM

[up] Funny that you mentioned Mastermind, in my plans for a revisioned X-Men series he is essentially The Man Behind the Man for Magneto in that he manipulated the leader of the Brotherhood through words and his mutant powers to wage war on the humans just to further the Hellfire Club’s agenda. I always found it weird that the guy who goes by the name Mastermind is playing the role of the Dragon in the Brotherhood of Evil Mutants, so why not make him a Dragon with Agendas?

Speakingnof X-Men villains yet to be used, another villain who I REALLY want to see done on screen is Mister Sinister. I am not sure if the Dark Phoenix film will actually use him after that post credit scene hinted at him, but if the MCU does do a reboot X-Men movie I want him as the first villain they deal with. I mean why not? Instead of having a mutant villain that wants to kill all humans, or a human villain that wants to kill all mutants; we have a human villain obsessed with evolution, sees mutants as the next step to said evolution, experiment on them to create the perfect being and use said knowledge to force this evolution on humans & mutants alike even if it kills them. I think a threat on both species will help establish the X-Men as protectors of all kind, and Mister Sinister is definitely a threat towards both races. Though, if they do Mister Sinister lets hope the movie doesn’t end up as a rehash of the first X-Men movie since Magneto’s plan in that also involved forced evolution.

Also Mojo; he should totally appear in Guardians of the Galaxy since he fit right in with the cast of characters.

Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#78267: Dec 22nd 2017 at 11:59:24 PM

[up] Yeah Mastermind in that role would be neat to see.

Just Makima.
eligram Since: Sep, 2009 Relationship Status: In denial
#78268: Dec 23rd 2017 at 4:32:44 AM

Oh... It just ocurred to me, Marvel can use Cyclops Space Pirate dad in a Guardians Of The Galaxy movie, and use the stringer to introduce him and the X-Men. Do you think they should use him? I always found contrived and ridiculous that his father survived and went to have space adventures.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#78269: Dec 23rd 2017 at 5:35:44 AM

There are so many ragtag space groups

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TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#78270: Dec 23rd 2017 at 8:34:58 PM

I think that, if you change what genocide Magneto was victimized by, you have to be very careful not to make him a race which is currently doing a major civil rights push in the U.S., otherwise he could easily be interpreted as a harsh criticism of that movement (especially if Professor X, the one always lecturing him on the right way to fight against discrimination, is still a white guy).

This is true. The fundamental reality of allegory and applicability is that even if you didn't mean to comment on a thing, your story will still be seen as a commentary on that thing. Everything's political in some way or another, and if you aren't careful to define those themes, the story will define them for you. Often in ways you didn't want.

For instance, if you make Magneto black, then his story becomes a commentary on Black Lives Matter, reinforcing the belief that BLM activists are dangerous terrorists trying to undermine our country. You might not have meant that, but because that's the political environment the story is entering into, that's what it becomes about.

God help you if you make Magneto Muslim.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#78271: Dec 23rd 2017 at 9:40:26 PM

[up] Why in the blue hell would they cast a black actor for Magneto? This isn't like Domino who was a C-Level mutant this guy is known for his background as a white character.

Just Makima.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#78272: Dec 23rd 2017 at 9:44:19 PM

Its a hypothetical to illustrate why it would be difficult to update Magneto by changing his background to another genocide.

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RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#78273: Dec 24th 2017 at 12:24:17 AM

Yeah, I've seen people suggest updating Magneto's origin so his family was killed in the Rwandan genocide, ignoring the huge real-life clusterfuck that changing his race would create.

Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#78275: Dec 24th 2017 at 3:08:01 AM

That would also change the ethnicities of three more characters - Scarlet Witch, Quicksilver and Polaris.

I honestly think that X-Men is a rare comic book in that you can have super diverse casts without changing anyone's origins. You just have to pick smartly.


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