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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#76601: Nov 17th 2017 at 5:20:08 PM

The best Dr Strange movie is the ten minutes or so that he trolls Thor and Loki in Ragnarok.

Also, I liked Ant-Man, even if it was an origin story. I don't mind origin stories so much when its not an origin story I haven't seen three times like Batman or Spider-Man.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#76602: Nov 17th 2017 at 5:21:13 PM

[up][up][up][up]Which is a problem, because is another "asshole with heart of heart of gold" we already saw in Tony,Peter and Hank.

Adric: I will blame the writing since benedict clearly try is best and manage to carry some scenes(pretty much everything before he learn magic) and I kinda disagree with Chris carrying out Thor, I always feel he was just the "fun guy" of the avenger and that it.

edited 17th Nov '17 5:24:47 PM by unknowing

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#76603: Nov 17th 2017 at 5:45:30 PM

And done with The Punisher.

This was without a doubt one of the best offerings from the Netflix line. Easily up there with Dardevil Season 1, which means it leaps over the other shows in quality until you put more stock in Luke Cage or Jessica Jones' themes.

Frank himself is explored brilliantly, mentally and conceptually. The side characters like Dinah, Micro, and Curtis add strong support to Frank's supporting cast and the show. Each had a purpose, and none were wasted. The main villains aren't Kingpin or Purple Man memorable, but the topical nature of their villainy kept me invested in seeing their defeat, and none of them turned in anything less than great performances. The storyline revolving around Frank's army past was engaging and filled with suspense. The fight scenes were appropriately brutal and showed Frank's expertise in gunmanship and hand to hand combat.

In the end, I walked away extremely satisfied with what I had watched.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#76604: Nov 17th 2017 at 6:04:57 PM

Yeah, Doctor Strange's brief cameo in Thor Ragnarok did feel a lot more enjoyable and comic book tone than much of his movie.

edited 17th Nov '17 6:09:13 PM by Tuckerscreator

Galadriel Since: Feb, 2015
#76605: Nov 17th 2017 at 6:25:55 PM

I don't prefer any phase. I prefer a few specific movies: Winter Soldier, Civil War, and Avengers, with Winter Soldier being the best.

Most of the rest achieve solid mediocrity, with Ant-Man and Doctor Strange feeling more bland and less creative than the rest. Not so much the worst Marvel movies as complete nonentities.

But the lack of any genuine drama, emotional force, or variety in most of movies is getting old. Talk about "different genres of supergero movie" all you like, but at the end of the day, they all feel the same, and they've got no impact.

edited 17th Nov '17 6:29:08 PM by Galadriel

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#76606: Nov 17th 2017 at 6:52:35 PM

[up]I lot of that is what I feel is "comic book check list" which are obligatory moments comic book mos indulge themselves let they risk the ire of more casual public, for example a climatic fight with the villian, even good movies end bad because of it, like Iron man 2, AOU, Malekith,etc, and hell that is no only for marvel: Suicide Squad include some big apocalitic thing just because, and WW decide Diana need to beat Ares or otherwise it would be futile(as it should since is World war).

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#76607: Nov 18th 2017 at 3:23:41 AM

I have come to not rank movies anymore (because honestly, some of them are so different they are hard to compare and some of them are quality wise so close to each other, it is hard to tell which is better), I am ranking first outings and overall franchises. In terms of overall franchises (I only rank those which have more than one movie):

1. Captain America

Honestly, close to perfect. I think that the first movie is really underrated, the two sequels weren't half as good as they are without the ground work laid down in the first one.

2. Got G

Which could still move past Cap, but as long as it only has two outings vs Cap's three, and due to Cap doing a different genre in each movie while Got G is a little bit less creative when it comes to shaking things up, I gibe Cap the edge.

3. The Avengers franchise

Though it is not really a separate franchise, more a part of the other franchises.

4.The Ironman franchise

Honestly, this is close....I kept switching it around with Thor.

5. The Thor franchise

I think I decided to keep it below Ironman, because overall they are quality wise more or less on the same level, but Ironman was a trailblazer, while Thor doesn't really have any excuse for The Dark World being the worst movie of the whole MCU. Not the one I enjoy the least, but the worst, and the most frustrating, because trapped in this terrible Thor movie is an outstanding Loki movie.

And in terms of first outing my list (this time without The Avengers, because those movies don't really work as first outings or franchise starters, they are more the big crossover event) looks like this:

1. The Got G

2. The first Avenger (yeah, sue me, I really think that the movie is an underrated gem)

3. Ironman (which I think most people would have on place one).

4. Thor

5. Spider-man: Homecoming

6. Ant-man

7. Doctor Strange

8. The Incredible Hulk

Place 4 to 7 are pretty much interchangeable (and yes, this means that The Incredible Hulk is my least fav of the MCU movies, and not just because it is the most skipable.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#76608: Nov 18th 2017 at 4:01:00 AM

I guess I'll say I prefer phase 3 then.

Julep Since: Jul, 2010
#76609: Nov 18th 2017 at 5:54:16 AM

Thinking about phases just makes individual movies look worse because phases 2 and 3 have no consistency whatsoever. Phase 1 had a logic, in that we got the origin stories one after another which culminated in The Avengers, but phases 2 and 3, geez...

I mean, phase 2 had the potential biggest status quo-shaker, Winter Soldier...right in the middle. Meanwhile, it ends with Ant-Man, which is so inconsequential its insertion into the rest of the universe is treated as a complete joke in Civil War. Civil War, in turn, is no climax, but the first movie of phase 3.

Had Civil War ended phase 2, there would have been some kind of logic, with phase 1 being about the heroes getting together, and phase 2 being about them being torn apart over their differences, while 3 would hypothetically be them banding again so that they can find Thanos. As it stands, it's better not to treat the phases as any kind of arcs.

So if you only consider the "phases" in terms of production, then I'd say phase 3 has the better average, with only one mediocre movie so far (haven't seen Ragnarok so far but apparently it's good) while phases 1 and 2 had three. But phase 2 had the best one. And phase 1 had a real story arc.

edited 18th Nov '17 5:55:32 AM by Julep

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#76610: Nov 18th 2017 at 7:17:34 AM

The logic is less in the different phases an more in the franchises themselves: Movie 1: Introduce the hero and the most important persons and influences on his live, complete with a proper heroes journey. Movie 2: Confront the hero with something which shakes him up and makes him question his position in live. Movie 3: Destroy whatever the hero thinks symbolizes him and make him realize that he is more than an arc reactor, a shield or a hammer - and then shatter his world. Due to the fact that the franchises overlap, the heroes are at different points of their respective journey in different phases.

Anyway, I am done with The Punisher. And I can honestly say that this is easily the best structured of the Marvel Netflix shows. It is NOT my favourite - that honour still belongs to Jessica Jones, which is way, way stronger on the meta level - but I enjoyed it more than I thought I would. Mostly because the propped a story I cared about on the Punisher Plot I frankly don't really care for and most likely never will. But I really enjoyed Micro's story.

Thematically, I have some issues with the Punisher, though, but that is a discussion for the actually Punisher thread.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#76611: Nov 18th 2017 at 10:29:49 AM

I'm now able to watch the Punisher, and have looked at the first two eps.

Frank's series is so down to earth that he might as well be buried up to his neck by it.

All of the shows have had both fantastical and mundane elements (with Iron Fist having the most of the former) but Frank is clearly gonna be different on that front. I'm looking forward to it.

One Strip! One Strip!
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#76612: Nov 18th 2017 at 3:56:32 PM

So it looks like we know who Sterling K. Brown is playing in Black Panther. It looks like he's Killmonger's dad in a flashback, which is what a few people had predicted.

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#76613: Nov 18th 2017 at 4:18:33 PM

Interesting. Was wondering if his role got cut. or recast I had some impression he was like a "head of security", but then I was confused because Daniel Kaluuya was identified as playing a character in that role.

edited 18th Nov '17 4:19:05 PM by Hodor2

ComicFan Since: Sep, 2016
#76614: Nov 18th 2017 at 8:35:27 PM

Details about the Infinity War Lego set was leaked. Potential major spoilers if accurate.

The Hulkbuster seen in the leaked teaser belongs to Bruce and he uses it to fight Proxima Midnight.

Thor will have Jarnbjorn.

Shuri will try to separate Vision from the Mind Stone.

The Soul Stone is in Wakanda.

Corvus Glaive is leading the attack on Wakanda.

Spider-Man and Doctor Strange fight Ebony Maw and Cull Obsidian

edited 18th Nov '17 8:48:37 PM by ComicFan

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#76615: Nov 18th 2017 at 9:21:55 PM

So not to stereotype the poor guy based on his height, but if that's true, could Peter Dinklage be playing a dwarven blacksmith who makes Thor's axe for him? Because the set link mentions Nidavellir, the realm of the dwarves.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#76616: Nov 18th 2017 at 9:25:46 PM

Okay so I'm up to episode five of the Punisher right now, and it's okay I guess. A lot more low key than the other Netflix shows. Hell it doesn't feel like a superhero show.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#76617: Nov 18th 2017 at 9:26:51 PM

I applaud them for acknowledging torture doesn't work.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#76618: Nov 18th 2017 at 9:30:44 PM

Ah yeah, was pretty surprised by that. Nice subversion for once.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Pseudopartition Screaming Into The Void from The Cretaeceous Since: Dec, 2013 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
Screaming Into The Void
#76619: Nov 18th 2017 at 9:34:11 PM

I have next to zero interest in the Punisher, but fucking finally. It drove me nuts when Daredevil tried to justify it.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#76620: Nov 18th 2017 at 9:37:32 PM

And uh, gonna add that this is probably the most explicit sex scene they've done in an MCU property, jeez...

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#76621: Nov 18th 2017 at 9:39:56 PM

The only reason it works for Matt is because he has a built-in lie detector that has real high accuracy. Doesn't make it any less shitty, though.

Okay so I'm up to episode five of the Punisher right now, and it's okay I guess. A lot more low key than the other Netflix shows. Hell it doesn't feel like a superhero show.

I haven't seen Punisher yet, but it's hard to imagine how much more lowkey you could get than the Netflix shows. Jessica Jones for example didn't really feel like a superhero show, more like a psychological noir story with superpowered people in it.

edited 18th Nov '17 9:42:52 PM by Draghinazzo

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#76622: Nov 18th 2017 at 9:41:52 PM

Yeah. With Matt, it's not the effectiveness that's in question, but the morality. With everyone else, it's both.

One Strip! One Strip!
AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#76623: Nov 18th 2017 at 10:20:44 PM

[up][up]

Jessica Jones still had things that placed it as being somewhat science fiction with superpowers and junk. With the Punisher there's none of that. Nobody with powers, nobody with any crazy alien guns, no magic ninjas. I know it shouldn't feel jarring because I don't think anyone wanted that to be in a Punisher show but it still feels kind of weird after all of the previous Netflix shows.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#76624: Nov 18th 2017 at 10:27:03 PM

That reminds me of all the weird shit they've done with the Punisher. Like the time they turned him into Frankenstein, or an angel, or a black man.

...

edited 18th Nov '17 10:32:25 PM by Draghinazzo

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#76625: Nov 18th 2017 at 10:31:55 PM

Why did they turn him into Victor Frankenstein?

edited 18th Nov '17 10:41:11 PM by Anomalocaris20

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!

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