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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#75827: Oct 24th 2017 at 11:56:25 AM

Maybe in 80 years. Maybe.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#75828: Oct 24th 2017 at 11:57:15 AM

I'll wait for ninety, but no higher!

edited 24th Oct '17 11:57:22 AM by KnownUnknown

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#75829: Oct 24th 2017 at 1:06:12 PM

One step after another. Plus, ten years isn't really all that long considering that the MCU will have its 10 year anniversary next year and it feels like yesterday since it started out.

Anyway, I agree that the Claire/Luke romance feels very obligatory. Danny/Colleen to a certain degree, too, but in their case there are narrative aspects to it which justifies it partly. IE Davos anger is way more understandable when he has reason to think that Danny thinks with the wrong part of his body.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#75830: Oct 24th 2017 at 1:40:44 PM

All MCU romances feel obligatory.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#75831: Oct 24th 2017 at 2:02:03 PM

I wonder if they're finally going to subvert it in Black Panther. Nakia in the comics... isn't exactly the love interest they're semi-advertising her as in the film. But knowing the MCU and superhero adaptations in general, I could see them just adapting her as a regular love interest instead for convenience.

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#75832: Oct 24th 2017 at 2:50:14 PM

As bad as most of the romances in the MCU films are, I would be kind of annoyed honestly if Black Panther is the first film with no romantic stuff given the way Hollywood is really weird about portraying black sexuality. Marvel themselves are really guilty of this. Black Panther has had like, two love interests in his 50 years of existence.

edited 24th Oct '17 2:51:00 PM by comicwriter

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#75833: Oct 24th 2017 at 2:57:15 PM

Didn't he have a thing with Storm for a while there?

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#75835: Oct 24th 2017 at 4:17:21 PM

So, so bad. The two had no prior history together until self-admitted black supremacist Reginald Hudlin, the man writing Black Panther at the time, decided that because Storm is Marvel's most prominent black woman, she should be married to T'Challa. So that happened, and it was every bit as abrupt as it sounds.

That said, I second the sentiment that T'Challa should have a love interest. Although I agree that nearly all of Marvel's romances are obligatory and the franchise could do with fewer of them, the first black superhero to receive a film in the MCU is not the place to draw that line.

Neither is Captain Marvel, incidentally. I expect to see a shallow, obligatory love interest for her as well.

edited 24th Oct '17 4:17:42 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#75837: Oct 24th 2017 at 4:38:31 PM

I don't think characters getting together based on proximity is that bad a thing, since that's generally how it happens in real life, and a heavy audience investment likewise isn't necessary for a romantic element to work. I actually like Claire and Luke because they seem like a relationship that isn't this flagship romance that can never break up come hell or high water, because love is forever, dammit. They're two people who like each other seeing if they can make it work, and I think that's normal, that's healthy. Same with Luke and Misty— they had sex one time, but that didn't mean they were a designated couple, and it didn't make things too weird between them, or at least not for very long.

Obligatory love interests generally don't bother me (though as GOTG 2 shows, you can largely do without them), just as long as they're not entirely perfunctory like Jane Foster in Thor. Because I would have liked to have seen more of Natalie Portman in the MCU, but I get why she wouldn't want to come back, if that was all the character she got to play.

...Asgard wasn't really a deep enough setting to support it, but I wonder What Could Have Been if her story was about a human getting to investigate this alien fantasy kingdom.

edited 24th Oct '17 4:52:11 PM by Unsung

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#75838: Oct 24th 2017 at 4:40:42 PM

The two had no prior history together until self-admitted black supremacist Reginald Hudlin, the man writing Black Panther at the time, decided that because Storm is Marvel's most prominent black woman, she should be married to T'Challa.

Okay, Hudlin's run is abysmal, but that is not true. Like at all. The whole idea of them being former childhood friends who still carried the torch for each other went as far back as the early 80's, and them still having feelings for each other (but being forced apart by duty) was a plot point in Christopher Priest's run in the 90's. Priest being the one who redefined Black Panther and whose work the movie seems to largely be drawing from.

I have no idea where people keep getting the idea Black Panther and Storm didn't know each other before Hudlin's run, but I've had to edit several Trope pages on this very site that erroneously claimed that. The claim that Storm and Panther's relationship came out of nowhere with zero history is one of those things the entire internet clearly knows despite never having actually read the stories in question.

[up]Lindsay Ellis did an interesting video where she said that she really liked the fact that Gamora and Quill's relationship hadn't progressed in the sequel, because she felt it was the natural consequence of Peter being a douche and refusing to grow up. She felt in some ways Peter's characterization in Vol. 2 was a stealth deconstruction of cocky Manchild heroes, because his immaturity and childlike behavior continually fucks things up and nearly gets people killed.

edited 24th Oct '17 4:50:01 PM by comicwriter

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#75839: Oct 24th 2017 at 4:53:39 PM

Yeah, that's the impression I had to— proximity is a start, but you need more than that for a relationship to last. And family and friends are just important, despite most superheroes being orphans and most movie and TV characters not knowing anyone they don't also work with.

And I wouldn't mind if Peter and Gamora never really got together. Nobody ever breaks up in these movies.

edited 24th Oct '17 5:30:41 PM by Unsung

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#75840: Oct 24th 2017 at 5:09:00 PM

Ben Mendelsohn is in talks to play the villain in Captain Marvel. He was great in Rogue One.

edited 24th Oct '17 5:13:05 PM by comicwriter

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#75841: Oct 24th 2017 at 5:16:54 PM

[up][up][up]

Oh wow. I had no idea the thing with Storm and T'challa had been pre-established. I thought it was something they just came up with.

I'm shocked.

edited 24th Oct '17 5:26:58 PM by HandsomeRob

One Strip! One Strip!
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#75842: Oct 24th 2017 at 5:25:56 PM

Mendelsohn seems an odd choice for Karla Sofen but I'm prepared to be pleasantly surprised. Seriously though, giving it a bit of thought, he's almost certainly some asshole Kree (a redundancy), right? I mean he kind of has the same look and mannerisms as Lee Pace.

Also count me among people that had heard via the internet that Hudlin came up with the Storm and Black Panther romance. Learning that it's a decently longish established thing makes the criticisms of that as well as Hudlin's run generally seem pretty unfair. Also, "black suppremacist" seems like a hyperbolic criticism, lousy run aside.

Draghinazzo (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: I get a feeling so complicated...
#75843: Oct 24th 2017 at 5:29:21 PM

I'm not sure that Black Panther would really be losing anything substantial by not having a love interest, except perhaps the opportunity to have more WOC representation. I mean, that's fairly big all things considered but you can have good and important female characters without having a love interest as well.

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#75844: Oct 24th 2017 at 5:32:57 PM

[up][up]In the comics Carol has a recurring Kree nemesis named Yon-Rogg, who was accidentally responsible for her getting powers in the first place. I think that's who Mendelsohn is playing.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#75845: Oct 24th 2017 at 5:38:08 PM

Ah, I also thought Hudlin invented Storm and Black Panther knowing each other. Alright then, my bad there.

LordVatek Not really a lord of anything Since: Sep, 2014
Not really a lord of anything
#75846: Oct 24th 2017 at 5:40:56 PM

Okay I won't claim to know anything about Black Panther in the comics but is that one of those plot points that was forgotten and buried until it was randomly brought back years later or was it referenced occasionally?

This song needs more love.
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#75847: Oct 24th 2017 at 6:19:23 PM

You know, now that I know they had a prior history, I can't help but think their break up during Avengers vs X Men (among the many issues that story had) was due to the fan perception that they were just thrown together just because they were both black.

One Strip! One Strip!
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#75848: Oct 24th 2017 at 6:23:30 PM

Speaking of Carol and love interests, what are the chances they make Mar-Vell her doomed-to-die love interest?

KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#75849: Oct 24th 2017 at 6:25:51 PM

It's difficult to say. I was under the impression that they'd be modifying her origin somewhat, so I still don't know just what it is they're doing here.

Oh God! Natural light!
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#75850: Oct 24th 2017 at 6:31:26 PM

[up][up]If not love interest he could play The Obi-Wan to Carol.


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