TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Marvel Cinematic Universe

Go To

Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#74301: Sep 5th 2017 at 7:50:40 AM

[up][up] Pretty much, yes. The problem is that those side comments happen in a lot of the comic book related media out there...this is, after all, by now an industry in and off itself, and one shouldn't underestimate the impact it has on people when the so called "experts" keep suggesting that this is not a show worth wasting your time on. Considering that Ao S is dependent on good ratings this is really annoying. I for my part am kind of tired of having to pray every spring that it will be renewed again.

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#74302: Sep 5th 2017 at 8:01:24 AM

I'm not really sure these so called experts are taken seriously by the public.

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#74303: Sep 5th 2017 at 8:08:34 AM

I don't think it has anything to do with experts. A lot of people were just turned off by what they saw in Season 1 and haven't tuned back in since, even though the quality has improved. It's not terribly common that a show that loses that much of its audience manages to win it back, sad to say.

As for Inhumans, that wasn't surprising. This entire show was misconceived from Day 1 and never should've been made.

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#74304: Sep 5th 2017 at 8:56:00 AM

"but he didn't have to sleep with Tony Stark to be valuable."

and good thing because let face it, Coulson is too good for tony stark, he have waaaay better taste than that. tongue

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#74305: Sep 5th 2017 at 8:59:36 AM

Ao S first episodes were weak, but I don't think that this is all to it. There are people who have never watched the show who "know" that it is bad. There are always people who don't try a show immediately but wait one or two seasons for the wom.

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#74306: Sep 5th 2017 at 9:46:16 AM

[up]the first half is weak, it take until the hydra reveal to grow better and there still low downs every now and them(garret defeat was laughable and ward kinda were nowhere.)

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#74307: Sep 5th 2017 at 10:39:16 AM

I hope this won't screw up the chances of a Kamala Khan movie.

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#74309: Sep 5th 2017 at 11:54:13 AM

[up][up][up] I enjoyed Garret's take down...especially since it gets extra point of SL Jackson being there.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#74310: Sep 5th 2017 at 12:01:03 PM

I feel Agents of Shield got better, but I don't disparage anyone for disliking it still.

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#74311: Sep 5th 2017 at 2:17:41 PM

Someone noticed (which I totally missed) that the crew photo from the Avengers 4 shoot had Gamora and Nebula in their old costumes from the first Guardians of the Galaxy movie rather than what they wore in Vol. 2 (and Infinity War). I guess this'll be for flashbacks or whatever since Karen Gillan said Thanos' torment of Nebula would factor into the movie.

Whowho Since: May, 2012
#74312: Sep 5th 2017 at 3:04:42 PM

I doubt the inhumans bombing would screw up Kamala Khan's movie chances. MARVEL is yet to introduce the inhumans to film, so they pretty much have a blank slate how how to debut them to their primary audience.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#74313: Sep 5th 2017 at 7:29:18 PM

The Inhumans have never been tied that strongly to Kamala's solo beyond a training arc anyway. If necessary, they might change how she gets her powers in the films, either for ease of explanation or to get away from the brand. Or they'll just leave it as is and handwave it to folks who don't know because it's not that important anyway.

Discar Since: Jun, 2009
#74314: Sep 5th 2017 at 8:06:59 PM

In the comics Kamala was empowered by a terrorist Terrigen bomb, right? You could easily recreate that for a movie. Hell, Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D. did that (when Shockley dropped the Terrigen crystal on the senator) despite the fact that Terrigen had already permeated the environment and randomly empowered all sorts of Inhumans. Then either give her a new mentor (Daisy, please?) or just have her deal with it on her own, like Spider-Man did in the previous movies.

Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#74315: Sep 5th 2017 at 8:20:18 PM

It was a terrigen cloud.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#74316: Sep 5th 2017 at 8:58:48 PM

Luke Cage, Episode Eleven!

So we last left Cage in the midst of a shootout at Harlem's Paradise, wherein a bunch of assholes apparently didn't get the memo about him being bulletproof and decide to waste a f*ckton of ammo trying to kill him with normal bullets.

This would be a really good time for Diamondback to slip in. Luke's blocking all these shots with his back, so sliding a few Judas Bullets through while he's shielding Misty would be perfect. Game to Diamondback.

Claire, what are you still doing here? GTFO before you get shot or taken hostage.

…and Claire's taken hostage. Goddammit, Claire.

"What you talkin' 'bout, Willis?!" [lol] I laughed. I admit it.

Let's talk about Diamondback's plan. He's hedging everything on the ability to kill Luke in a quick enough timeframe with his one remaining Judas Bullet that he can turn over a body to the cops, even though he's already seen Luke take two and come back. He's banking on everyone just assuming that Luke killed Misty, even though his men were shooting up the place and are now taking hostages at gunpoint. This is not a plan. This is Fisk-style career suicide, especially since Luke is barricaded in the kitchen and there's nothing stopping him from just kicking down the wall and escaping right now.

He's punched through tougher walls than Harlem's Paradise.

"Let's just go out the back." "He's already secured it." No, he hasn't. He and Shades were just talking about how they need to figure out an exit plan, which indicates that their men do not control the perimeter. Luke just made an ass out of u and Misty.

"Who's helping me? Luke Cage or Carl Lucas?" The f*ck does that even mean, Misty? I think you're a little delirious from the blood loss.

"His street name is Diamondback. He was the hardware connect for Cottonmouth that you were looking for. He's also my half-brother." Again, this just feels like a stronger part without that personal connection. This was a good enough explanation for the animosity Misty's stumbled into the middle of without Luke tacking on that bit at the end.

"We're going in. We have an active shooter and a hostage situation." He's absolutely right. Priscilla can shut up right now, because this is standard protocol. As soon as a gunshot is heard from within the building, SWAT storms the place. The first gunshot immediately ends any and all hostage negotiations and, from that point, it becomes about neutralizing the suspects as quickly as possible to minimize further loss of life.

Priscilla's pointing out that they haven't made any demands yet, but that doesn't matter anymore. That explosion means there aren't going to be demands, there aren't going to be negotiations, there's just going to be men and women kicking the door in and taking out targets. These kind of negotiations can only operate on good faith that the hostages won't be harmed, and the police have no way of monitoring that from outside.

Which is why you never, ever pull the trigger on a gun during a hostage situation; because even if you didn't shoot a hostage, the police have to assume that you did. If you fire a weapon, SWAT will come through the door and put you down.

Now, I'm not even sure why Priscilla's treating this like a hostage situation in the first place. Nobody's contacted the police. Nobody's said, "We have hostages." By her own admission, no demands have been made. This is not a robbery. Several armed men were unloading automatic weapons into Harlem's Paradise. This is a shooting. Lacking any further information about the situation, SWAT should already be in there trying to take out the shooters. You do not wait for demands when people are actively shooting off guns in the building.

Priscilla is bad at policework. She's lucky she psychically read the script and discovered that Diamondback's taken hostages without ever being informed of this, because she's making the wrong call several times over but will surely be vindicated for doing so by the plot.

"No way he went out the back." Why not? Luke raised the concern that there might be dudes watching it but, like, how is that even an issue? Even if there were a handful of goons out there, they are not a threat to him. He covered Misty in a room full of guys firing assault rifles. There's no reason for him not to go out the back and just plow through whatever men he thinks Diamondback put there.

"We are making way too much noise. They're going to bust in that door any minute." By all rights, they already should have.

Also, I love how Shades has his gun drawn and ready as if it would do anything to Luke. All the other men are doing this same thing. Diamondback's having his people hunt for Luke and Misty without any actual game plan for what to do if they find them. This is the same issue Cornell had; Diamondback has his one remaining Judas Bullet, but everyone else? Their guns are basically here to make them feel better about themselves, not to actually stop Luke.

"They're scared of Cage now." No, what they're scared of is the guns in their face, and they're going to talk. Unless you have them killed, in which case the police will find them riddled with bulletholes and will not blame Cage for it. Seriously, Diamondback, your idea of winging it is oversimplistic and dumb. You were doing so well, too.

And now Diamondback has the politician guy call Priscilla, but it's a bit late. SWAT should have kicked in the door already.

"I can't leave you. You'll bleed out. You'll die." …the hell do you think you're accomplishing by standing in the middle of the room waiting for her to bleed out and die? You are not a medic, Luke. Lacking any kind of medical training, her chances of bleeding out aren't any different regardless of whether you go save those people she wants you to help.

"Escort the Night Nurse here downstairs." Monicker drop!

Wow. Claire's method of dropping the guard by trip-shoving him down the stairs is actually really clever and effective. I was all set to complain about how a ninety-pound nurse somehow drops an armed hitman but that was actually really good.

Her picking up his rifle and then just sorta lobbing it into a corner of the room, on the other hand, is dumb. Take the gun, Claire. You might need it. Shit, even if you aren't going to take it, do not throw a loaded firearm across a room. That's how misfires happen.

And now she's leaving him unconscious. With his gun in a dark corner some ten feet away, so if he wakes up, she'll have successfully made him spend thirty seconds trying to figure out where it dropped. Troll win, I guess? Not a very sound strategy, but I guess she can giggle to herself about mildly inconveniencing the dangerous murderer.

"That is not Cage's M.O. Every encounter we've ever had with him, he has never used a gun." That doesn't mean there aren't active shooters in the building. Guns are loud. I cannot stress this enough. Guns are loud. Several men unloading assault rifles into the club would have been easily heard outside the building. There is no way the police aren't aware that people have been discharging firearms in their crime scene.

"Don't go do anything stupid." "Like what?" "Be a hero." What. Ten minutes ago, you were telling Luke to go up there and save those people. Now you're criticizing him for coming around to the idea. Make up your f*cking mind, Misty.

"Why the hell didn't you leave the club?" "When have I ever done as I was told?" That's a dumb answer and you know it, Claire. "I stuck around to catch a bullet in my face 'cause that's how I show how rebellious and wacky I am!"

"Me, medical shit. You, bulletproof shit." [lol] Straight to the point. I like that line.

"Y'all sound married." That line, on the other hand, I do not like. It's not the show's fault, though. I'm just sick of writers shilling an Official Couple prior to the Couple in question actually making things Official via having third-party characters comment on how totally a couple they are and/or should be. It's a setup I'm long since tired of.

"I just wanted him to see me. I was a good boy. I did well in school." Diamondback, your villain cred is slipping drastically for every minute this speech goes on. This random, unprompted Motive Rant to the politician hostage in which he's just prattling off information we already know so we can see how sad and vulnerable his personal connection with Luke made him is kinda embarrassing, really. Loki's got daddy issues too, but he doesn't burst into spontaneous monologues about how Odin should have loved him more.

"You! Stop looking around!" …why? It’s not like there are things happening you don't want the hostages to see. The main thing you don't want the hostages to know about for Diamondback's plan is that men with guns are involved and, well…ship's sailed on that one, dumbasses.

"What happened?" "Lopez got pushed down the stairs." I see he found his gun in the dark corner. Minor inconvenience achieved!

"Carl, Carl, Carl." Luke, is your ass still down there? Claire told you to go do bulletproof shit. What are you waiting for, the flag to come up and say "LEVEL START"?

Diamondback's loaded his Judas Bullet. Which means it wasn't loaded earlier. Which means Luke could have solved everything by just going up and rampaging through the club. Jesus, for an invulnerable man, Luke sure takes a longass time to work up the nerve to go be invulnerable.

"Hey, what if he has more of those special bullets?" That didn't seem to be an issue when you told him to go do bulletproof shit. God, we finally got a villain who can actually physically threaten Luke and we're still resorting to getting around his Story-Breaker Power via just sorta having him not do stuff for no reason.

"Willis plays for keeps. Especially with the people I care about the most." Are you still on about that? Both Luke and Diamondback have made this sort of statement, but it hasn't been supported by anything. Diamondback doesn't have some grand master plan for breaking you down slowly, bit by bit, using your loved ones. He just wants to kill you. That's it. The beginning and end of his goal here. Every time you say shit like that, it just sounds gratuitously comic booky.

Not that comic booky is bad, but I mean gratuitously comic booky. As in, it's really only there because it's an obligatory thing to say about comic book supervillains, even though Diamondback is more Hitman than Comic Book Supervillain.

"I see Luke Cage was here." THAT'S who Shades reminds me of! I finally placed it! The way he carries himself, the capacity for being the sane man, and the specific soft tone of his voice was strikingly familiar but I could not for the life of me place why. He's an evil Phil Coulson.

And then Luke was arrested without any of the Judas 2.0 guns being discharged because Diamondback woefully overestimated the police's bloodthirst. This really was a bad plan.

"Luke is innocent of everything." "And after we have Luke in custody, we can verify that." Priscilla's absolutely right here. An arrest is not the same as a conviction. Taking Luke into custody gives them an opportunity to sit him down and talk to him about everything that's happened. To get his side of the story. That's a necessary step for solving this case, regardless of whether or not he's guilty.

This episode was a clusterf*ck of an Idiot Plot. Too many plot points were overreliant on characters doing things solely because the plot demanded it rather than because it made any kind of conceivable sense for their character or situation.

Shame about Shades being taken into custody. I was hoping he'd stick around and be the villain for next season after Diamondback goes down. Oh well. Maybe he'll hook up with Fisk in prison and be the new Wesley or something.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Punisher286 Since: Jan, 2016
#74317: Sep 5th 2017 at 9:16:27 PM

Really the latter part of LC falls apart narratively overall unfortunately. And Diamondback is such an idiot villain that it's almost pathetic.

And yeah, giving him a personal connection to Luke was a bad idea.

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#74318: Sep 5th 2017 at 9:28:53 PM

Look, Tobias all Luke wants is to feel like he's special enough to have a supervillain try to systemstically destroy his life. Do you know how many black superheroes get that? Let him dream!

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#74319: Sep 5th 2017 at 9:30:50 PM

He doesn't even have a life to destroy! [lol] Before Claire came along, his list of loved ones began and ended at Pop!

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#74320: Sep 5th 2017 at 9:34:35 PM

Are you saying that living above a Chinese restaurant and your only friend being a fatherly barbershop owner isn't a life?

For shame, Tobias. You insult every bulletproof black man who lives above a Chinese restaurant and whose only friend is a fatherly barbershop owner.

edited 5th Sep '17 9:35:22 PM by KarkatTheDalek

Oh God! Natural light!
PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#74321: Sep 5th 2017 at 9:40:08 PM

A very select group.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#74322: Sep 5th 2017 at 9:41:38 PM

My favorite part of that episode is Claire crushing Shades' shades under her shoe.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#74323: Sep 5th 2017 at 9:43:42 PM

[up][up][up] [up] maybe Diamondback isn't so much being an idiot but inflicting what he thinks is some kind of specific torture on Luke by letting him live his pathetic blip of an existence a little bit longer.

Hey, I just made the villain a thousand times more coherent and intelligent than the writers did.

edited 5th Sep '17 9:44:27 PM by windleopard

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#74324: Sep 5th 2017 at 9:45:35 PM

You really think they're going to make anything stick to Shades? At this point Shades basically is the guy he wanted Diamondback and Cottonmouth to be in the first half of the season. I don't even think it's a spoiler to say it, but I'll leave that decision up to Tobias.

But yeah, Diamondback effectively being Coldfire, the way he completely self-destructs into cackling villainy... It just wasn't what I wanted from the show. I think there's still stuff that's working (not so much Luke's backstory, which seems to wrap things up a little too neatly), but it's still mostly just smaller character beats at this point. Like, as shitty as the police brutality off the previous episode is, it feels sadly true, and it has a point it wants to make.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#74325: Sep 5th 2017 at 9:48:30 PM

Which episode is the one where Method Man shows up, the next one?

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?

Total posts: 186,763
Top