TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Marvel Cinematic Universe

Go To

Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#71526: Jun 3rd 2017 at 12:27:49 PM

Because he's a very well-trained normal human.

jakobitis Doctor of Doctorates from Somewhere, somewhen Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Doctor of Doctorates
#71527: Jun 3rd 2017 at 12:42:02 PM

Batroc put up a good fight, but when a trained human fighter goes up against a trained superhuman fighter, the human loses (And Steve in the MCU is totally superhuman, even if relatively low on the power scale compared to the big boys.) When it came down to the wire, Steve handed Batroc's butt to him pretty decisively.

Although that does raise the question of when exactly DID Steve get any kind of combat training (beyond possibly army CQC moves?) Or do we simply assume the serum sort of supercharged his skill as well as his physique?

"These 'no-nonsense' solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex world of jet-powered apes and time travel."
Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#71528: Jun 3rd 2017 at 12:43:29 PM

From punching Hitler hundreds of times.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#71529: Jun 3rd 2017 at 12:44:33 PM

Also, he really wasn't able to give Steve that much trouble. The second Steve decided to try a little bit, it was a curbstomp symphony.

My various fanfics.
RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#71530: Jun 3rd 2017 at 1:04:39 PM

I assume one of the benefits of the supersoldier serum is having really good muscle memory, so Steve can probably pick up fighting techniques incredibly quickly.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#71531: Jun 3rd 2017 at 2:03:13 PM

Really? Because I don't remember them stating this at all. I remember them saying something like "This is the last Hydra base" or something, but nothing about how they assaulted all of Hydra (especially since that would contradict Agents of SHIELD).

That this is the last Hydra base implies they've been hitting other Hydra bases prior to this. Also, the movies give approximately zero f*cks about Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.

Uh, no, there's nothing to indicate the Avengers would have fired first.

Again,

  • Thor: Loki's scepter must be here. Strucker couldn't mount this defense without it. At long last.
  • Romanov: At long last is lasting a little long, boys.
  • Barton: Yeah, I think we lost the element of surprise.

The element of surprise. Barton is outright stating that the Avengers wanted to get into a better position before engaging this battle, but Strucker's border patrol spotted them touching down. There was always going to be a battle. They are not here to sightsee.

Like, I can't believe we're even having this conversation. What do you f*cking think they were doing in Sokovia? Was Thor going to walk up to the front door and go, "Hello, good sirs. We are peaceful envoys here to calmly negotiate terms by which to purchase Loki's scepter."

edited 3rd Jun '17 2:04:23 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#71532: Jun 3rd 2017 at 2:06:29 PM

That this is the last Hydra base implies they've been hitting other Hydra bases prior to this.
No, it does not. It implies "this is the late Hydra base."

Also, the movies give approximately zero f*cks about Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D.
The later movies, perhaps, but AOU was written and directed by Joss Whedon, who knew exactly what was going to happen on the show and the movie. He may have been too busy to feature any cameos in the movie, but he let the show know ahead of time what was going to happen so that the show could then lead directly into the movie (which is what it did).

Barton is outright stating that the Avengers wanted to get into a better position before engaging this battle, but Strucker's border patrol spotted them touching down. There was always going to be a battle. They are not here to sightsee.
Barton is joking. It was a joke. "Hey, they are attacking us. I guess we lost the element of surprise, whoops."

Like, I can't believe we're even having this conversation. What do you f*cking think they were doing in Sokovia?
They were sent there because that's where Hydra was keeping the scepter and where the leader of Hydra was. Hydra is a terrorist organization. Therefore, they (and SHIELD) have been fighting to keep dangerous weapons out of their hands.

edited 3rd Jun '17 2:08:17 PM by alliterator

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#71533: Jun 3rd 2017 at 2:28:11 PM

I'm going to be honest, I don't even know what you're trying to argue at this point. You just said exactly what we've been saying: that Hydra is a terrorist organization and the Avengers have been attacking them. I have no idea how you can possibly twist that into a self-defense claim.

Someone being a bad dude does not make any engagement of violence with them automatically become self-defense. Self-defense is not alignment-based. You cannot walk into someone's house uninvited and when they threaten you with a gun and demand that you leave, stab them in the face and go, "Self-defense! They threatened my person! This is their fault, not mine!" No matter how evil that person is, that does not make it an act of self-defense.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#71534: Jun 3rd 2017 at 2:38:40 PM

I wasn't pointing out that the Avengers weren't there to stop them, I was pointing that that the assumption that the Avengers have been attacking them all over the world is just that: an assumption. There is no proof of it.

No matter how evil that person is, that does not make it an act of self-defense.
The difference here is that you are talking about self-defense on a personal level, not on a country-wide scale. Hydra clearly represents a country-wide or world-wide level threat. The Avengers attacking a Hydra base is more akin to Seal Team Six going in and taking out Osama bin Laden.

edited 3rd Jun '17 2:38:47 PM by alliterator

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#71535: Jun 3rd 2017 at 2:41:24 PM

Except Seal Team Six were a government sanctioned team who answered to the U.S military while the Avengers are a group of private individuals with unusual abilities and exotic weaponry.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#71536: Jun 3rd 2017 at 2:51:12 PM

Which is the difference between reality and a comic book movie. But having them sanctioned by the US government doesn't change what they did.

There are certain things in a comic book film that are Willing Suspensions of Disbelief. The Avengers being allowed to exist without being completely taken over by the government is one of those things.

edited 3rd Jun '17 2:53:15 PM by alliterator

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#71537: Jun 3rd 2017 at 3:06:33 PM

It stopped being a suspension once Civil War called that into question, including questioning their actions in prior films.

edited 3rd Jun '17 3:07:57 PM by Tuckerscreator

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#71538: Jun 3rd 2017 at 3:08:41 PM

" AOU was written and directed by Joss Whedon, who knew exactly what was going to happen on the show and the movie. He may have been too busy to feature any cameos in the movie, but he let the show know ahead of time what was going to happen so that the show could then lead directly into the movie (which is what it did)."

which matter not seen is usually yhe show who give some fucks about movies and not the other way around, which it kidna show with inhuman being all over the world and Tony and Steve being busy punching each other in the dick.

[up]and even them, that is capturing a know criminal, not self defense, that is closer to frank justification of "if he hit him first, he wont hurt anyone"

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#71539: Jun 3rd 2017 at 3:19:09 PM

It stopped being a suspension once Civil War called that into question, including questioning their actions in prior films.
It questioned some of their actions, but it never questioned them attacking Hydra. It never brings up their attack on the Hydra base in Sokovia, presumably because they handed Strucker off to the UN and was thus tacitly approved by the UN.

which matter not seen is usually yhe show who give some fucks about movies and not the other way around, which it kidna show with inhuman being all over the world and Tony and Steve being busy punching each other in the dick.
Uh, all of those take place after Age of Ultron. I'm talking about AOU, not anything that came after.

edited 3rd Jun '17 3:20:00 PM by alliterator

unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#71540: Jun 3rd 2017 at 3:24:10 PM

[up]point is by pointing out those issue it point out the suspension of disbelief you mention early.

Also you again miss the point: is AOS the one who care about the movies, no the other way around.

"My Name is Bolt, Bolt Crank and I dont care if you believe or not"
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#71541: Jun 3rd 2017 at 3:32:49 PM

point is by pointing out those issue it point out the suspension of disbelief you mention early.
No, the suspension of disblief is still there. If it wasn't, the government would have gone in and arrested all of the Avengers for the deaths of those civilians or extradited them. They did neither, because the government still sees the Avengers as a superhero team, which is a Willing Suspension of Disbelief.

Also you again miss the point: is AOS the one who care about the movies, no the other way around.
And I'm saying that that doesn't matter. The movies have never contradicted the show (or shows, if we include Agent Carter and the Netflix ones). Hell, the show has even included actors from the movies, including Nick Fury, Maria Hill, and Sif, and the show tied in heavily with Winter Soldier as well as leading up to the beginning of Age of Ultron. The fact that the movies haven't reciprocated doesn't matter. There is nothing to indicate they don't take place in the same universe, because they do.

edited 3rd Jun '17 3:33:28 PM by alliterator

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#71542: Jun 3rd 2017 at 3:42:30 PM

Someone made a comparison last page, and now I can't stop thinking about the possibilities of Punisher vs Kira. Frank Castle vs Light Yagami.

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#71543: Jun 3rd 2017 at 4:29:38 PM

Light would win that fight easy, but I think he'd rather manipulate the Punisher to his side. The Punisher would, of course, kill Light once he finds out what he's like.

edited 3rd Jun '17 4:30:00 PM by VeryMelon

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#71544: Jun 3rd 2017 at 4:46:08 PM

I'm thinking more like a scenerio where Frank and Light hear about each other on the news and decide the other should die (obviously the Punisher's true identity should be unknown in order for him to have any chance whatsoever).

edited 3rd Jun '17 4:46:53 PM by PushoverMediaCritic

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#71545: Jun 3rd 2017 at 4:50:26 PM

Frank loses for exactly that reason. Light would know his true name and face, so killing him would be easy, while Frank has no way to know who Light is, or where he is (they wouldn't even be in the same country).

That being said, I'm sure Light could get a lot of mileage out of Frank by writing him to kill quite a few people first, since that's the latter's MO anyway. Probably write him in as mowing down some criminals that Light specifically wants him to get rid of.

One Strip! One Strip!
RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#71546: Jun 3rd 2017 at 5:17:04 PM

Are people actually assuming that, if the Avengers had shown up at the Hydra base and all of the Hydra guys had thrown down their weapons and surrendered, the Avengers would have started hitting and shooting them anyway? 'Cause unless the Hulk was pre-emptively triggered, I don't see that happening, and if that's not the case, then self-defense absolutely applies. If you're a wanted fugitive and someone tries to arrest you, even if it's a citizen's arrest, you do not have the right to violently attack them in order to escape, and if you do, then they absolutely have the right to fight back.

edited 3rd Jun '17 5:19:00 PM by RavenWilder

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#71547: Jun 3rd 2017 at 5:59:30 PM

Yes, people seem to be forgetting the whole "Hydra are wanted terrorists" thing.

edited 3rd Jun '17 5:59:39 PM by alliterator

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#71548: Jun 3rd 2017 at 6:33:18 PM

I've lost track of this entire conversation.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#71549: Jun 3rd 2017 at 6:35:43 PM

Everyone sounds dumb.

I'm on episode 6. Colleen's smile is the cutest thing. Claire is awesome. I like all the interaction between Danny and Colleen. I feel like their actors have good chemistry.

My various fanfics.
Beatman1 Since: Feb, 2014 Relationship Status: Gone fishin'
#71550: Jun 3rd 2017 at 6:36:49 PM

[up][up]Same.

You know what I want in one of these movies?

Red Ronin. Just for the sheer insane scale.


Total posts: 186,763
Top