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Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM
They play different Punishers. Bernthal's is more emotional, traumatized and full of anger, whilst Jane plays him as more emotionally dead inside, stone-cold and ruthless.
Bernthal is pre-Ennis and Jane is Ennis Punisher, in essence.
edited 12th May '17 6:49:16 PM by Gaon
"All you Fascists bound to lose."edited 12th May '17 6:50:15 PM by alliterator
Thomas Jane is still my favorite Punisher, but Bernthal was a very close second. It's very close. Bernthal has a few of my all-time favorite Punisher scenes, but I more consistently enjoy Jane's.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.@Tobias
While you're kind of here, wasn't it you who said you disliked Netflix Kingpin/Fisk? I have no idea how it came up but I am relatively certain it was you who said you found him non-threatening and whatnot.
I've not seen Netflix Daredevil. I just know they combined two awesome things - Vincent D'Onofrio and Wilson Fisk - but you made it sound like he was an incompetent loser in the series.
Been thinking about watching the series is all. I have a new Netflix subscription and all.
edited 12th May '17 7:07:06 PM by Nikkolas
Yeah, that was me. Netflix Fisk is an incompetent moron with outrageous murder Tourettes who largely self-destructs while Murdock is nearby. The only thing threatening about him is his pocketbook. He doesn't plan, he doesn't scheme, he just conveniently happens to have bribed everyone in every scene he's in.
The second season introduced the Punisher and Elektra while increasing Stick's role so that they could deal with the villains while Murdock is nearby.
edited 12th May '17 7:16:27 PM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.Tobias took issue with the fact he isn't the cerebral powerhouse of the comics. DD in general has a tendency to build things up as origin stories for characters, so everyone tends to start lacking their traditional traits and slowly get up to their usual selves. Punisher, Murdock and Fisk all follow that path.
PS: Murdock is also the true villain of Daredevil according to everyone who isn't me in this forum.
edited 12th May '17 7:16:23 PM by Gaon
"All you Fascists bound to lose."![]()
I think that's an incredibly simplistic and almost insultingly inaccurate way to look at it.
Kingpin's greatest nemesis is his own temper and hubris, yes, but it's not as if Daredevil can just sit there and let him self-destruct to win; he came within mere seconds of getting away with his killing-Owlsley outburst and was only foiled by Murdock and pals doing a shitload of auditing just in time.
And he's not just an idiot who only knows how to bribe people; after the car door incident in Episode 4 he's not only able to rebound from that and cover it up with just words and subterfuge, but continue to spin it to get what he wants (the Russian mob's destruction). And then there's his public debut at just the right time to intercept the efforts of anyone investigating him.
The biggest power he possesses is his wallet, yes, but saying he has no scheming ability to complement that is just flat-out wrong.
edited 12th May '17 7:32:10 PM by Anomalocaris20
You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!Eh, me, my favorite Punisher is the Bernthal Punisher. That Punisher...well, he came off as the most human of the Punishers and considering how inhuman the Punisher can get, I'd like a strong reminder that he was just some normal dude before he became the Punisher.
Trans rights are human rights. TV Tropes is not a place for bigotry, cruelty, or dickishness, no matter who or their position.Like I said, it's his origin story. The first season is Fisk slowly becoming the man who would be called the Kingpin.
There's one particularly clever moment that highlights this: During Fisk's ride at a police truck, he muses on how he always (i.e throughout the first season) thought about the good samaritan parable, and always thought he was the samaritan in it, the man who helps the one in need. And then he realized that no, he isn't. He is the ill intent that causes the man to be in need. Later on he fights Murdock and observes that this city does not deserve to be saved, it deserved to drown in its own filth.
It's in moments like this you can see the Kingpin rise, and the second season solidifies this. He's angry and rash in the first season because he thinks he's the hero and the world is wronging him. When he entirely abandons those notions he starts to become a much more ruthless man.
To be honest, while I've always valued Tobias's opinion in almost any subject, I've always had a bit of a disconnect with him when it comes to Fisk ever since he suggested for Fisk to be raped in prison to "toughen him up" so he can become the comic book character. That's just not right.
edited 12th May '17 7:54:03 PM by Gaon
"All you Fascists bound to lose."I felt ![]()
![]()
that way at first, but I felt like they made it work by the end. I'm only a fan of a season-long origin story if they can make it work, which I think they did here. Wilson Fisk had the perfect plan— he didn't need to scheme, because he'd already schemed. Then we saw his season-long Villainous Breakdown, and I found that very satisfying, someone who'd gone to such lengths to be anonymous and untouchable, forced out into the open and ruined. That all worked for me.
Plus I liked how badly his perception of himself— as the hero Daredevil couldn't be, the man who would actually cure the city no matter the cost— was eroded over the course of the show. That story ![]()
is a great moment, the moment where the gloves come off and the real man, shorn of any sense of guilt or obligation, is allowed to shine through at last.
edited 12th May '17 7:56:02 PM by Unsung
I mean if it is I'd really like for Tobias to correct me because I have no ill will towards him and I would consider him a friend if we interacted more often. If I'm misrepresenting what he said, I apologize profusely, it's just how his post at the time came across to me.
"All you Fascists bound to lose."I don't recall ever saying that, and it sounds incredibly OOC for me, being the extremely vocal feminist that I am.
Like, I'm usually the first to go, "Wow, that's kinda rapey, I'm not okay with this," in a story.
Like, even if you were willing to credit the idea that prison rape "toughens someone up", that's stupid. Fisk's problem isn't that he's not tough. It's that he's an idiot.
edited 12th May '17 8:45:41 PM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.I distinctly recall it being you, Tobias. That's some Mandela effect shit. My mind seems to be playing tricks on me.
Well I apologize either way, carry on.
"All you Fascists bound to lose."I get that Fisk is still in progress to becoming the Kingpin we all know but it feels like it's taking longer than it should to get there.
This song needs more love.It really doesn't sound like something I'd say, but I apologize if I did, 'cause that is some f*cked up shit to say about anyone.
I can be pretty crass from time to time, but saying that someone should get raped is, like...if that's not a bannable offense, it should be.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.

Thomas Jane was a great Punisher.