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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#69276: Apr 26th 2017 at 6:36:42 AM

Shit, I must've missed that little easter egg. Nice one.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#69277: Apr 26th 2017 at 6:50:30 AM

Recurring villains are overrated. Every superhero has a huge rogues gallery. Given the development time for new films, every time a villain recurs, that's one less villain from that gallery who can show up. This isn't like a TV show where you're guaranteed 16-24 different stories in the span of a year. Like, take Winter Soldier. Would the film really be improved if Alexander Pearce didn't exist and, in his place, we just got more cackling Red Skull? Loki's trying to make it work by transitioning into a protagonist to avoid stealing the other villains' thunder, but even then, they ripped out all of Malekith's personality to give Loki more time to shine, so YMMV on whether or not the effort's proving effective. Too much emphasis on keeping important villains around in a medium where you only get about 2-3 hours of story per 5 year period just results in shit like the Joker, who won't f*cking go away even though everyone's sick of his stupid face showing up in every goddamn thing as though Batman doesn't have any other villains to use. See also: all the people begging for the new Spider-Man movie to be about anything but Norman Osborn again.

In addition to this, there are external factors that can affect how often a villain is used such as conflicting schedules, actors demanding more pay, actors aging out of roles or even death. Having a villain last only one film is the less risky move.

shatterstar Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I wanna know about these strangers like me
#69278: Apr 26th 2017 at 8:49:31 AM

Add that to the fact that returning villains risk undervalue the hero's effort (Cardboard Prison) and Character Derailment for the villain to justify them to keep returning and have a grudge on the hero.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#69279: Apr 26th 2017 at 8:53:48 AM

[up] Definitely that.

As a general rule, the point at which a villain's motive shifts from "Do a thing that is relevant to my interests" to "take revenge on my favorite superhero" is usually the point where Villain Decay takes full swing.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#69280: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:12:14 AM

I finished the Netflix shows at last. Enjoyed them all, but I think Daredevil was my favorite of the bunch due to the fight choreography. I hear there's a crossover happening? Never read any of the comics so I don't know who the Defenders are but... are they actually calling themselves that in the show?

The only one I could see going for it is Danny (Mr. "I Am The Iron Fist and People Totally Understand What That Means") and even that's kind of a stretch.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#69281: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:14:35 AM

The good thing about the Netflixes is that you don't neeeeed to know about the comics Defenders!

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#69282: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:19:25 AM

Ugh. The hard part about figuring out where I'd want the Squadron Movie to be is the fact that the Marvel timeline is so thoroughly laid out that there's no wiggle room for like the next five years.

My various fanfics.
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#69283: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:24:17 AM

It helps Defenders is probably the most generic descriptor of a group of vigilantes possible. You can just picture Madam Gao saying "Ah, look, The Defenders of Hell's Kitchen come to the city's aid! Care to die with some dignity?" in a phrase and this just catching on, leading them to use this as their official name (much like Ronan's "BEHOLD, THE GUARDIANS OF YOUR GALAXY!")

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#69284: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:25:06 AM

[up] (3) That a fact?

Well, goodie for me. I didn't want to have track down the comics. :) I barely knew DD from the old film, and Luke Cage because he was in Web of Shadows.

[up] Heh.

edited 26th Apr '17 11:27:48 AM by FOFD

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#69285: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:27:37 AM

[up][up] Also, it helps that the Defenders are considered a "non-team," in that superheroes generally just showed up, were considered a Defender for a few issues, and then left. Hell, I even think there was a "Defender for a Day" issue, so there are a ton of superheroes that were part of the Defenders.

I kind of wish they included more from the Steve Gerber version, though, so that way we could get the Elf with a Gun.

edited 26th Apr '17 11:27:54 AM by alliterator

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#69286: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:29:00 AM

Which reminds me...Aldric, how is your watch going? Have you finished Luke Cage yet?

also...*sigh*...live ratings for Ao S are down again. Why? But then, no wonder, as long as the self-appointed expert fans keep campaigning against it, it will never get the appreciation it currently deserves.

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#69287: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:30:05 AM

Which also brings me to: I'm still waiting for you to read through the DD comics I recommended you, Adric.

Don't think I've forgotten.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#69288: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:39:58 AM

I would be very shocked if it had anything, if at all, to do with any comic iteration of the team. More likely Marvel just realized Defenders is a snappy name (one that also sounds similar to their most popular team franchise) and they owned the trademark, and the alternative title sounds really stupid.

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#69289: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:41:25 AM

Head's up for anyone interested. Out of curiosity, I looked on The Other Wiki and see that there's a detailed summary on GOTG 2. Assuming it's true, it sounds pretty cool, although I can kind of get from the description why it might be rated less highly than the first movie. I particularly like two things:

One is that Ego is actually evil. I had been thinking to myself that if the movies didn't go the route of further compositing and made Ego Starfox for an extra tie with Thanos, it would make a lot of sense to have Ego as the bad guy because while not necessarily a surprising twist, it's a good twist when you cast a likable and charismatic actor who is like the older counterpart of Chris Pratt.

The other is that apparently one of the stingers is a bit of an Ascended Meme, as Stan Lee is a Watcher.

edited 26th Apr '17 11:42:00 AM by Hodor2

FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#69290: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:42:34 AM

That all makes sense I guess, but

More likely Marvel just realized Defenders is a snappy name (one that also sounds similar to their most popular team franchise) and they owned the trademark, and the alternative title sounds really stupid.

...what's the alternative title?

Also:

Also, it helps that the Defenders are considered a "non-team," in that superheroes generally just showed up,

That... leaves this crossover open to a lot of newcomers. I hope this turns out to be like Legends and they just keep adding new members with each season. Like a "Marvel-Netflix Phase 2."

edited 26th Apr '17 11:53:57 AM by FOFD

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#69291: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:52:21 AM

The fact that all of them but Danny are probably gonna be super-reluctant to form a team is one of the things I'm most looking forward to. Claire's basically gotta slap some sense into them and say "You idiots can't do this alone, work with other people for once in your fucking lives" and it's gonna be fun to see how they react to that.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#69292: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:53:48 AM

Matt: But I work with other people all the time. It didn't super work last time.

My various fanfics.
FOFD Since: Apr, 2013
#69294: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:56:01 AM

...that sounds like a cool title to me.

Or, well, The Knights...

...Knights...

...Knights of Marvel...

...okay, maybe not.

Marvel Knights makes me think they've gone off the deep-end and made some sort of medieval fantasy spin-off.

[down] Considering those two are my favorite cast members I sincerely hope you're wrong. :( I thought Stick was dead in DD Season 2 and then he wasn't. I thought Claire might die because yeah she is the connective thread between each show and if there's anyone who'd make all four of them put their differences aside, it's her.

edited 26th Apr '17 12:00:35 PM by FOFD

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#69295: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:56:31 AM

That's part of why I get the mighty feeling Claire, the Coulson of the Netflixverse, will share Coulson's actual fate and bite the dust, her death providing the Defenders with their final motivation to come together as one.

I also get the sense Stick is going to die, probably later on, in a moment of "holy shit the villain actually is this powerful".

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#69296: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:56:32 AM

I guess they could have also picked Heroes for Hire? Which I think sounds cooler than Defenders, but kind of limits the concept, so I am okay with it.

edited 26th Apr '17 11:56:57 AM by Swanpride

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#69297: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:57:51 AM

@Gaon

I've been busy with college, easy. My Netflix binging has been slowing down too.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#69298: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:58:54 AM

[up] So you are still stuck in the second half of Luke Cage?

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#69299: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:59:05 AM

I would've preferred Marvel Knights to Defenders honestly. Fits their theme more as protectors of the people although obviously having Marvel in the name would be a little too on-the-nose and Knights alone is a little too boring.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#69300: Apr 26th 2017 at 11:59:56 AM

I've got two more episodes of Luke Cage left.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?

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