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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#68401: Apr 10th 2017 at 1:59:38 PM

[up][up] In regards to...?

Oh God! Natural light!
Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#68402: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:01:08 PM

[up][up]The forum post uses the term 'fired', but she doesn't. I still always got the impression from interviews with her and the other actors that the decision was more mutual than that. If I'm wrong, though, by all means, point me at the moment where it became a more acrimonious parting of ways. I'd genuinely be curious.

edited 10th Apr '17 2:02:53 PM by Unsung

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#68403: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:03:32 PM

Word of God from Joss would really help here,it's unlikely that he'd want bring it up again though because it was probably something he regrets knowing the reaction it caused

edited 10th Apr '17 2:03:55 PM by Ultimatum

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#68404: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:05:05 PM

Ordinarily I love the idea of bashing Joss Whedon after Age of Ultron, but I get the feeling some of this is going a bit too far.

Of course, I've never seen his previous works aside from Firefly, it's possible he's fucked up in numerous ways that I'm unaware of.

edited 10th Apr '17 2:05:11 PM by AdricDePsycho

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#68405: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:09:17 PM

I've never bashed him, but I was and still am critical of Age of Ultron.

edited 10th Apr '17 2:09:24 PM by VeryMelon

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#68406: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:10:42 PM

I think that article Karkat posted earlier does a pretty good job of briefly summing up his hangups. He's not necessarily a bad guy, but he's got a type: kickass, waifish, vulnerable. Which isn't without its own unfortunate implications regarding portrayals of women, because it becomes a bit one-note.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#68407: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:14:45 PM

Yeah, that interview doesn't actually say she was fired, and it doesn't even mention her pregnancy. It's a stretch to call that proof that she was fired for getting pregnant.

Especially since she's like, "I would love to come back to the show and finish out my character's arc," and then she did. People who get fired don't usually get brought back.

edited 10th Apr '17 2:15:29 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#68408: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:16:46 PM

Yeah, I never got that she was treated badly like Higher Brain Pattern thought.

higherbrainpattern Since: Apr, 2012
#68409: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:21:02 PM

[up][up] Joss didn't even tell her that she was going to be removed from the show prior to filming the fifth season. I'm just saying, there's a difference between being written out of the show and getting removed without even being told. That screams "fired" to me.

edited 10th Apr '17 2:23:45 PM by higherbrainpattern

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#68410: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:27:48 PM

I fell you need more evidence than a personal interpretation.

higherbrainpattern Since: Apr, 2012
#68411: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:30:12 PM

[up] I'm going by Charisma Carpenter's own remarks in the interview from 2003 I posted on the last page.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#68412: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:32:02 PM

Age of Ultron was pretty mediocre if not terrible, but people have a tendency to subject Joss Whedon to the real life equivalent of Ron the Death Eater i.e. exaggerating his genuine faults to puppy kicking or reading in sinister motivationsnote  for the sake of a subjective grudge. When my takeaway from AOU is that he's simply not that good of a writer or director, or that he's a Fair for Its Day liberal still trapped in the 90s, not that he's a Heteronormative Crusader Writer on Board who actually hates women and wants them to Stay in the Kitchen.

As far as other criticisms go, he wanted to but thankfully decided against having Inara on Firefly gangraped for shock value, some people don't like his portrayal of Gina Washburn for being too masculine because it's femininity-shaming in an inverse of Real Women Never Wear Dresses, or various criticisms on his portrayal of rape in The Dollhouse, which I've never seen so I can't judge for sure but it should be acknowledged that the show went through a ton of Executive Meddling and some of the criticism is centered around the fact that the show featured rape at all.

edited 10th Apr '17 2:39:43 PM by AlleyOop

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#68413: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:32:12 PM

[up][up]Sure, but its still your interpretation of her words we're arguing about.

edited 10th Apr '17 2:33:27 PM by VeryMelon

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#68414: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:50:28 PM

*Steps into thread, sees discussion*

Did I take a time machine back to 2015?

edited 10th Apr '17 2:50:45 PM by comicwriter

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#68415: Apr 10th 2017 at 2:50:58 PM

@higherbrainpattern She says she was stunned, but I thought that was more about having the baby than about leaving the show. Like, she doesn't really sound all that disappointed, more diplomatic— yeah, it was great working here, I'm gonna miss all my coworkers, I'd be happy to come back and finish out my character's arc— but y'know, I have a child now, and I'm way more psyched about that.

I don't know, it just seems weird that they'd write a whole season around finding a way to incorporate her pregnancy into the show and then unceremoniously let her go, especially with her being one of the characters who'd been around from the very start, who was that snarky says-what-she-thinks archetype that Whedon loves, and who was the show's primary love interest. I can't see them letting all that slide unless there's more to this. Her wanting to leave and spend time with her newborn son just seemed like a plausible, reasonable explanation.

That being said, Whedon does tend to involve his old casts in his new projects, and Carpenter has never come back, so maybe they did have some kind of falling out, who knows.

[up]The internet, where all old arguments are preserved in an endless loop, forever

edited 10th Apr '17 2:52:11 PM by Unsung

PushoverMediaCritic I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out. from the Italy of America Since: Jul, 2015 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
I'm sorry Tien, but I must go all out.
#68416: Apr 10th 2017 at 3:00:26 PM

Thor: Ragnarok looks fun as hell. Thor's Big "YES!" caught me so off-guard in the best way.

diyedas Since: Feb, 2010
#68417: Apr 10th 2017 at 3:08:23 PM

[up]There was so much good stuff in the trailer, I wouldn't even know where to begin.

DrFurball Since: Jan, 2001
#68418: Apr 10th 2017 at 3:09:36 PM

It's funny, Thor's Big "YES!" mirrored mine for the whole trailer (especially when he put the helmet on).

Ultimatum Disasturbator from the Amiga Forest (Old as dirt) Relationship Status: Who needs love when you have waffles?
Disasturbator
#68419: Apr 10th 2017 at 3:10:20 PM

And great part is that they didn't need to spoil the entire film,like certain trailers do these days

have a listen and have a link to my discord server
Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#68421: Apr 10th 2017 at 3:15:55 PM
Thumped: This post has been thumped with the mod stick. This means knock it off.
KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#68422: Apr 10th 2017 at 3:18:05 PM

Things are rarely cut and dry, it sounds like Carpenter was leaning towards reduced time while still remaining a cast member and they couldn't make it work so they let her go. A number of other actors on other shows have made that work, especially in an ensemble cast, so it sounds like bad timing overall.

As for Ragnarok, I was digging the trailer up until the 80's laser graphics and "We know each other through work" joke. It's a hilarious joke but the tone is all over the place. With a subtitle of Ragnarok you would think it would be a bit more grandiose and desperate, maybe that will be later in the movie. Certainly, if Hela is able to break Mjolnir like that she has to be something more cosmic in origin.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#68423: Apr 10th 2017 at 3:25:08 PM

I think the plot is slightly different than the first thing you might think looking the subtitle. Judging from the trailer, it's less a "prevent the end of the world" story and more a "pick up the pieces after everything went to shit" movie.

edited 10th Apr '17 3:25:48 PM by KnownUnknown

rjryan3 Since: Mar, 2016
#68424: Apr 10th 2017 at 3:25:26 PM

Sorry it's not grimdark as the DCEU.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#68425: Apr 10th 2017 at 3:26:32 PM

[up] Can we not do that? We already have enough threads bogged down by Marvel vs DC arguments.


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