TVTropes Now available in the app store!
Open

Follow TV Tropes

Following

Marvel Cinematic Universe

Go To

Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#65001: Nov 15th 2016 at 8:27:14 AM

I mean, there's no reason they have to limit it to fish oil. They could easily say that the terrigen's infected the water and is spreading that way.
That's exactly what they did on Agents of SHIELD.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#65002: Nov 15th 2016 at 8:29:31 AM

The Marvel IP rights issues are kind of fascinatingly muddled.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#65003: Nov 15th 2016 at 8:43:36 AM

Another thought regarding Ego involving Doctor Strange spoilers which I'll cover just in case-

So the Dormammu who appears in the movie is not a demon lord like in the comics. Rather he's this sort of eldritch entity from another dimension and he seems to be a composite with Galactus, as he's known for being endlessly hungry and devouring planets. And besies this characterization tying together Fantasy and Science Fiction elements, it seems like a set-up for future Thanos-related stuff, as well as Ego having a role- maybe as an enttity opposed to Dormammu?

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#65004: Nov 15th 2016 at 8:48:35 AM

Wanting to take over Earth is something he was up to in the comics all the time though. In the Avengers/Defenders War he fused Earth with the Dark Dimension to get around an oath that he swore to Strange that he'd never come to Earth again.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#65005: Nov 15th 2016 at 8:53:41 AM

Interesting. But yeah, what I was also thinking specifically is that the fact that Dormie is implicitly a case of You Cannot Grasp the True Form and appears as this outline of dark dimension constellations in the shape of Cumberbatch's face seems to neatly set-up the idea of Ego's actual appearance being a scarier take on his comics' one, with the Kurt Russell form being an avatar he uses to interact with people on an individual basis.

edited 15th Nov '16 8:54:20 AM by Hodor2

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#65006: Nov 15th 2016 at 8:59:17 AM

Ah

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#65007: Nov 15th 2016 at 9:00:29 AM

He's not really a demon lord in the comics either. The Dark Dimension isn't a realm of Hell. Dormammu being the eldritch lord of another dimension is straight from the comics. They just made him into You Cannot Grasp the True Form instead of a big guy with a flaming head.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#65008: Nov 15th 2016 at 9:18:29 AM

The terrigenisis spreads much further than Fish oil. That was only the beginning. The implication was that the stuff spreads over the water into our whole ecosystem (btw something to think about concerning all the PVC stuff which is swimming around in our oceans) until the whole earth is hit. It won't happen all at once...ie vision guy was out in the rain and got hit with the stuff while his daughter got lucky so far....but the likelihood that an Inhuman manages to avoid the transformation his whole live becomes smaller and smaller with each passing year.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#65009: Nov 15th 2016 at 12:19:35 PM

Regarding that Doc Strange spoiler, I'm conflicted on whether I want flame-head Dormammammammammammu to show up in the sequel or not. On the one hand, it's such an iconic look and would give him a humanoid form with which to be more directly involved, but on the other hand it'd feel like a step down threat-wise from "giant face manifested with the fabric of the Dark Dimension itself in Strange's own image because you cannot grasp his true form".

Maybe if they adapt the whole "Dormammu challenges Strange to plain ol' hand-to-hand combat and puts his own pride on the line" bit.

edited 15th Nov '16 12:21:06 PM by Anomalocaris20

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#65010: Nov 15th 2016 at 12:23:06 PM

I wasn't sure leaving the movie whether Dormie would return. While I know that he's like the central Strange villain, it doesn't seem particularly likely to me that this version of Mordo would seek power from him.

Another thought- wonder if The Hood will be introduced at some point in the MCU.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#65011: Nov 15th 2016 at 12:43:05 PM

You know, with everything going on right now, do you expect the Psycho Cap who uses Steve's name as a means of pushing a hard rightwing agenda and the Secret Empire to be a thing in a future Marvel movie?

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#65012: Nov 15th 2016 at 12:48:06 PM

I hope not because Steve has a bad rep inside and outside of universe already as it is.

I'd rather see one of those far right wing guys (Burnside or Walker) take up the Cap mantle and be a Deliberately Bad Example in contrast to Steve and Sam.

Edit- One other issue is that besides possibly being dead, the Red Skull in the MCU is not a racist like his comics counterpart, so even if he was alive, he wouldn't have an interest in this kind of plan. The MCU versions of Zola and Fenhoff/Faustus probably would (not so much out of racism but more like a "stick it to America/destroy freedom" kind of thing, but both of them are dead and/or a computer.

edited 15th Nov '16 12:53:57 PM by Hodor2

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#65013: Nov 15th 2016 at 12:56:29 PM

I don't really want to see the MCU go and push a political agenda, personally, regardless of which end of the spectrum it's on. I go to movies to be entertained, not lectured. Undertones like in Winter Soldier can work fine, but anything more than that gets too smug and preachy for my liking.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
jakobitis Doctor of Doctorates from Somewhere, somewhen Since: Jan, 2015 Relationship Status: I'd need a PowerPoint presentation
Doctor of Doctorates
#65014: Nov 15th 2016 at 12:56:53 PM

I can definitely see there being a bad/hard-right 'Captain America' but it will be the title used and Steve himself will be using another alias entirely or just going by his normal name at that point - possibly 'reclaiming' it and becoming 'Captain America' the icon and inspiration again in the process.

"These 'no-nonsense' solutions of yours just don't hold water in a complex world of jet-powered apes and time travel."
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#65015: Nov 15th 2016 at 12:57:02 PM

One other issue is that besides possibly being dead, the Red Skull in the MCU is not a racist like his comics counterpart
Uh, says who? The Hydra in Winter Soldier isn't racist, but the Hydra in First Avenger is populated solely by white men.

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#65016: Nov 15th 2016 at 12:59:39 PM

Well I read the MCU Red Skull as a megalomaniac with a god complex who wasn't into Nazism because he thought he was better than everyone else- this doesn't rule out the fact that he approved what the Nazis did to people they considered inferior, but as well Strucker, the MCU take seems to be a deliberate attempt to remove the Politically Incorrect Villain aspect of those characters.

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#65017: Nov 15th 2016 at 1:07:12 PM

To be fair, both of them eventually lost those traits in the comics too. There's a reason for this: racists are hard to take seriously as scientific masters (like the eugenic theory is laughable nowadays), which these characters are often meant to be.

In the movies they compromised with Skull by making him a Uber-Nazi. I.e he's so racist his perspective isn't "Aryan > Everyone else" it is "Super soldier > everyone else". He out-nazis the nazis.

Strucker is a In Name Only adaptation of his comic self, but in the comics he pointedly noted he didn't give a shit about the triumph of the Aryan race. One of his best moments in Secret Warriors is when he monologues to a bunch of Skrulls, and he adds something to the effect of: "I never wanted to cleanse the world like Hitler did. I just want to rule it."

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#65018: Nov 15th 2016 at 1:31:23 PM

[up] I think you have it the other way around. Comics Skull is still an ultra-Nazi to the point he retcon-retconned Sam's past to think he was a pimp because of his racism. Movie Skull doesn't give a shit about Nazism, he just wants to leech off of it to advance HYDRA to rule the world based on power and not ethnicity, having decreed the actual Nazis and their beliefs beneath him because he's that much of an arrogant SOB.

[up]x5 They don't have to push a political agenda that hard. The original plans for Civil War were going to be something similar to begin with, involving a populist figurehead (no explicit platform specified) using the Cap mantle and buzzwords to get people to rally around him and then a Hate Plague to turn the populace against the real Cap. It'd be less opportunism and more repurposing of an old script that was prescient in some ways.

edited 15th Nov '16 1:32:02 PM by AlleyOop

windleopard from Nigeria Since: Nov, 2014 Relationship Status: Non-Canon
#65019: Nov 15th 2016 at 1:34:52 PM

I don't really want to see the MCU go and push a political agenda, personally, regardless of which end of the spectrum it's on.

The MCU's been pushing a political aganda since the first Iron Man movie.

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#65020: Nov 15th 2016 at 1:36:58 PM

For what it's worth I don't think Hydra are Nazis by the time of the main movies. They're still fascist assholes but their bigotry seems to have shifted to a more general Might Makes Right idea than racial theories.

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#65021: Nov 15th 2016 at 1:39:23 PM

Hydra stands more for a specific mind-set instead of a specific movement. Which is a good thing, because you can find this "we are superior and the end justifies the means" mind-set in a lot of toxic movements. Hell, agents of Shield even connected it to fanatic religious movements...and wasn't exactly settled about it.

edited 15th Nov '16 1:40:01 PM by Swanpride

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#65022: Nov 15th 2016 at 1:40:39 PM

@Alley Oop: In the comics the general view of Skull seems to be he's just a hateful asshole who despises everyone. His racism boomerangs on whenever he feels being racist would cause more suffering on that particular day or not.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#65023: Nov 15th 2016 at 2:29:35 PM

I know that a thing in the terrible Uncanny Avengers was Red Skull deciding that racism was old hat, being anti-mutant was where it was at these days. And then stealing Professor X's brain.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#65024: Nov 15th 2016 at 3:33:35 PM

And that's still a thing. The Avengers have been sandbagging on taking down the Psychic Nazi for years. The X-Men have also been sandbagging on avenging the desecration of their namesake's corpse for years. The only person actually trying to do anything about the "Red Skull with Xavier's stolen brain and powers" right now is Captain Hydra!

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#65025: Nov 15th 2016 at 3:34:39 PM

You continually disappoint me in more and more ways, Uncanny Avengers.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers

Total posts: 186,763
Top