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Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM
I don't think Claire or Black Widow's breakouts were unexpected, exactly. They've gone well, but I don't think the studio's done anything they weren't already planning, aside from possibly expanding Claire's role in Luke Cage. But other than that, everything you're saying is true. I still can't be confident that fridging won't be a thing, though, because she's a female love interest and advisor figure who unifies all four series, and Mentor Occupational Hazard is yet another thing. Rosario Dawson's And Starring, Fake Guest Star status makes the idea that she might leave the franchise worrying in a meta sense as well. Yes, she's more fully realized than Coulson was before The Avengers, but the darker tone of The Defenders has demonstrated that the spectre of Anyone Can Die has already crept in.
But it would suck. I would much rather have what you're suggesting, @Swanpride, where she continues to be Night Nurse, someone who keeps these idiots patched up between seasons. They all need a conscience and anchor back to earth.
edited 3rd Nov '16 11:34:49 AM by Unsung
How about this: if she dies, everyone can say they knew it and it can be the new issue everyone spends 7 pages on end debating every 2 weeks, if she doesn't, we unanimously agree that even worrying about it was a waste of time, and we never bring up the possibility of Clair getting fridged again, or at least until Season 2 is announced.
Where there is a popular female supporting character in an otherwise male-driven property, there will be a fear of fridging. It's something that fans of female supporting characters have to deal with, that other people don't think much about.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.And how many female characters have died in the MCU so far? Two. Frigga, who was pretty much a background character and Rosalind, whose fate was sealed from the get go. You might be able to make a case for Agent 33, but for one, her story was a little bit more complicated and she died to motivate the villain, not the hero Oh, and Peggy, but it is a little bit hard to count it as fridging when a 96 year old woman dies in her sleep.
Anyway, in a franchise which consists of 13 movies and five TV shows which have between them 132 episodes so far, this is not really a worrisome trend.
On the other hand, aside from Frigga the MCU has been pretty good about not killing off its female characters pointlessly (not that people won't still complain about Peggy in CW or Janet who they still don't realize isn't actually dead).
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I forgot about the problems with AOS but it's basically its own little sub-bubble right now.
edited 3rd Nov '16 12:20:05 PM by AlleyOop
Rosalind was a blatant, unapologetic fridging played completely straight.
Frigga hit all the notes of a fridging except the part about having no agency in her death. She still died for Manpain, though.
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.I mean, way more female characters have died than that, like Brandt and Hensen in IM 3, that one nurse in Daredevil S2, Mrs. Carnitas, Hope Schlottman, her mother, that obnoxious old lady who lived next door to Jessica, Hogarth's ex-wife, Riva...
You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!Well, a number of male characters have died too. You can't do a long-running franchise without killing off some characters along the way...and Reva was pretty much dead on arrival, it was never a question if she would die or not because she was already dead when we first learned of her existence. She is not different from Jessica Jones dead family or Matt's murdered father.
It's not that female characters can't ever die as part of these stories, and for the most part the MCU's been pretty good about not overusing it. Rosalind was pretty bad, though, and too many characters have tragically lost their mothers (Frigga, Janet Van Dyne, Maria Stark— Steve was orphaned, depending on which movies are canon the Hulk's dad may have killed his mother, etc).
Anyway. Fridging seems like the obvious move to unite the Defenders. It's not a foregone conclusion or anything, but it's something that's going to keep bothering me until I know for sure that they didn't do it.
I don't know if Stick works very well as character motivation; none of the characters who've met him seem to like him very much. In any case, we've already done that whole thing with the Avengers, I hope they're creative enough to think of something else.
edited 3rd Nov '16 1:30:10 PM by Pseudopartition
I haven't seen Luke Cage yet - my roomie got Destiny recently so Xbox time has been scarce - but in Jessica Jones, Reva wasn't fridged. She was a Posthumous Character who succumbed to Death by Origin Story. An Uncle Ben, not a Gwen Stacy.
What sets Claire and Reva apart is that Claire's an established character who's built up a fanbase and has a role of her own within the narrative that goes beyond conveniently dying in the first ten minutes to set the hero on his/her journey.
She's someone we've spent time getting to know, which is an important aspect of what makes suddenly dumping her in the plot grinder for cheap drama and Manpain into a Fridging.
edited 3rd Nov '16 1:54:49 PM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.I'm of two minds with Reva. While she's a character written mostly in absence and that can be a problem, she's not solely there to spur Jessica's heroism or Kilgrave's villainy. She may not have any lines in JJ, but she's still a person rather than just a plot device, one who had a life and loved ones before she died. Her death isn't just forgotten once her narrative purpose is served— her memory persists and goes on to add further complications down the line.
If anything, I thought the way she was written in Luke Cage was one of the show's weaknesses. She gets lines, but she comes off as too good to be true right up until it's time to reveal her complicity at Seagate, so she can be written off, a little glibly, and Luke can move on.
I do wonder if we'll see more of her, in old tapes or something, if IGH and the Seagate experiments do end up being part of The Defenders.
edited 3rd Nov '16 5:31:59 PM by Unsung
I think the question is what force or incident is considered enough of a big deal that it needs every one of them to team up together instead of just smaller partnerships or dealing with things in their part of the city on their own. I mean, gradually you could have them coalescing because it's easier to centralize then delegate, but a big dramatic threat is more immediately interesting than them just networking their way into becoming the Defenders over time.

I think it's still nice to have confirmation.
With so many supporting characters confirmed, I'm really hoping we will have at least one major fight sequence that includes absolutely everyone with any fighting skills at all.