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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#62076: Sep 5th 2016 at 1:44:18 PM

I wish the diamond/mattress cushion pattern was more visible, but other than that, this works for me. I wonder if the movie will go with Shocker having personally invented his gauntlets and the fabric that makes up his costume.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#62077: Sep 5th 2016 at 2:08:42 PM

Shocker's costume is supposed to be So Bad, It's Good but it's not a bad creative choice to move it towards being visibly homemade so he's less of a joke character.

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#62078: Sep 5th 2016 at 2:11:56 PM

Right, I wouldn't want the full bodysuit, just that pattern. Because the diamonds actually do look kind of cool, especially if you ignore everything below his head and arms on his comic book costume. Kind of a rattlesnake look to it.

edited 5th Sep '16 6:44:22 PM by Unsung

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#62079: Sep 5th 2016 at 5:26:38 PM

It reminds me a bit of the Reality Ensues nature of Spider-Man's first costume in Civil War.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#62080: Sep 5th 2016 at 6:09:19 PM

He looks like an everyday thug with homemade suit, with the gauntlets as flashy and sophisticated in contrast to the rest of him - which perfectly fits who the Shocker is as a character. The low budget look is a great idea.

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#62081: Sep 5th 2016 at 6:32:02 PM

Looks like Shocker is competing for the identity of The Bombastic Bag Man.

But yeah, it works and is an interesting choice, just like the Civil War Spidey suit. One thing that has struck me and doesn't get acknowledged enough is that being a genius doesn't mean you inherently have a budget. Like not everyone can be Tony Stark and have unlimited funding for their ideas/inventions.

Once again, Spectacular was pretty great on this in how Mysterio and Tinkerer were basically villains/worked for other villains because how else are you going to get funding and be able to test your inventions?

Nightwire Since: Feb, 2010
#62082: Sep 5th 2016 at 7:27:24 PM

That's why I wish the Tinkerer would survive Homecoming and become a recurring character who would pop up in other MCU franchises.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#62083: Sep 5th 2016 at 8:43:31 PM

It also makes sense in both how Shocker is likely to appear in the movie and thematically. Given that we know the Big Bad is Vulture, Shocker is probably going to be the Batroc of this movie: a minor supervillain threat that Spidey takes down tangential (but still likely essential in some way) to the plot - which is a role he does perfectly in the comics. Maybe Pete spends a good chunk of the movie's early parts tracking Shocker, only to realize too late that there's a much grander and more sinister (no pun intended... although maybe?) plot going on around him that's bigger than the bang robber with the air cannon. And like proto-Rhino in Amazing 2, Shocker's shabbier and less polished than the Big Bad and so comes of better as a "regular day in the office" villain for Spidey.

Also thematically, Spidey's feeling more and more like he'll be the dawn of the traditional superhero in the MCU (at least movie-wise), and this makes a lot of sense as a "realistic" MCU take on a "early supervillain" sort of concept. The idea of a regular working class joe getting ahold of a super-tech weapon and deciding to become a bankrobber of all things is classic camp that's every where in the Silver Age - especially with Spidey - and adapting all that Silver Age Spidey goodness is at the heart of Homecoming. But nevertheless, this is a perfect idea of what a "random dude who goes on a super crime spree" concept might look like in a time before being a supervillain becomes "cool."

Because of both of those things, I want Shocker to live through the movie.

edited 5th Sep '16 8:43:42 PM by KnownUnknown

Unsung it's a living from a tenement of clay Since: Jun, 2016
it's a living
#62084: Sep 5th 2016 at 9:10:47 PM

The revolving door prisons that keep putting his rogues gallery out on the street are as important to Spider-Man as they are to Batman, and for the same reasons. The common complaint has been that Loki (and Red Skull and maybe Ultron, sort of) has been the only good, classic supervillain in the MCU so far. I'd make a case for Arnim Zola, and of course we can't forget Kingpin, Purple Man, and Mr Hyde.

But the point is, most of them end up dead after their first appearance. That really needs to stop at some point. And a Technical Pacifist career robber like Shocker is a good way to kick that off.

I hope they go with the portrayal where they really emphasize his Punch-Clock Villain status. Shocker's just in this for the money (yes, even if his inventions could earn him a fortune legitimately). He doesn't even bear a grudge against Spider-Man for putting him in jail, because them's the breaks when you're a criminal.

edited 5th Sep '16 10:50:30 PM by Unsung

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#62085: Sep 5th 2016 at 9:14:42 PM

I still think it's funny that the movie's main villain and biggest threat will be a geriatric man in a bird suit.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#62086: Sep 5th 2016 at 9:22:08 PM

[up][up] I'm imagining Spidey's confrontation with him.

Spider-Man: "So what's your deal? Did some guy experiment on you or steal your inventions or kill your family or some shit like that?"

Shocker: "Oh no, it's my boss that's on the revenge train. I'm just in it for the money, man."

Spider-Man: "Oh. Well, that's...refreshing."

Shocker: "Isn't it?"

Sorry if I stole your bit, Tobias.

edited 5th Sep '16 9:22:24 PM by KarkatTheDalek

Oh God! Natural light!
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#62087: Sep 5th 2016 at 9:26:35 PM

I still think it's funny that the movie's main villain and biggest threat will be a geriatric man in a bird suit.
That's prejudice against the elderly!

KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#62088: Sep 5th 2016 at 9:30:05 PM

Well, he's got a point.

Maybe Peter should try calling him a furry instead. Low-hanging fruit, I know, but hardly moreso than what he was going with.

Oh God! Natural light!
Cross (Don’t ask)
#62089: Sep 5th 2016 at 9:37:30 PM

Would Vulture count as a furry?

edited 5th Sep '16 9:37:54 PM by Cross

Nightwire Since: Feb, 2010
#62090: Sep 5th 2016 at 9:49:04 PM

If you want to, more than half of Spider-Man's rogues would count as furries. Like, the Rhino literally dresses himself up in a rhino suit, for fuck's sake.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#62091: Sep 5th 2016 at 9:49:56 PM

"Feather-y"? What's the bird equivalent of "yiff"?

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#62092: Sep 5th 2016 at 10:01:30 PM

Maybe he's just a very avid Falcon fanboy.

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#62093: Sep 5th 2016 at 10:27:47 PM

Now I want Toomes' sinister plot to actually be the purchase of a ton of extra-stale hard candies.

edited 5th Sep '16 10:28:26 PM by Anomalocaris20

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
Nightwire Since: Feb, 2010
#62094: Sep 5th 2016 at 11:05:48 PM

And to rob Manhattan's entire supply of prune!

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#62095: Sep 6th 2016 at 12:00:39 AM

That is one of the reasons why Hydra works so well...even if you kill of the villain, two more will take his place.

But yeah, we need a few villains which are allowed to live at least for a while. And not just until the next movie in order to get killed off there. Zemo is the kind of baddie who can be around for a long, long time - is it strange that I want him to team up with Justin Hammer at one point? Hammer is technically not a villain, just an antagonist who has bad taste in helpers, but I can see him funding more questionable characters in the future.

Though with most of those villains, there really wasn't much of a choice but to kill them. Killgrave, Ultron, Ronan, you either stop them forever or not at all.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#62096: Sep 6th 2016 at 12:11:23 AM

Now that I think about it, Ultron is a good example of a classic supervillain plot and mentality as well, though one highly unlikely to be a real start of a trend in-universe.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#62097: Sep 6th 2016 at 7:13:41 AM

Ultron is a good example of an unhinged supervillain's plot. It's constantly changing because of various setbacks Ultron has, as well as the fact that he's, well, insane.

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#62098: Sep 6th 2016 at 7:52:36 AM

Which is actually my favourite part of his character...I really wasn't looking to see another Skynet/Hal/insert every crazy computer ever on the screen, so having him unbalanced and emotional was an interesting shake-up. Especially once you consider that all his emotions are artificial.

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#62099: Sep 6th 2016 at 8:00:30 AM

[up][up]That's probably why I really didn't like that version of the character.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#62100: Sep 6th 2016 at 8:00:58 AM

[up][up][up] Well, yeah. But that doesn't mean he's not very Silver Age in execution.


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