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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#61401: Aug 11th 2016 at 11:55:25 AM

Anyone else got straw in their eyes?

KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#61402: Aug 11th 2016 at 11:57:42 AM

Given the possible emphasis on Carol's military niche, I'd love to see Kamala as an impulsive and enthusiastic buck private who's green and quirky but whom Carol nevertheless forms a close friendship with after getting her powers. Though the way I see that going is similar to what they already did with Falcon, I suppose.

Nah. I understand they'll probably be making some changes, but I don't think that the military is a good fit for Kamala, personally.

Oh God! Natural light!
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#61403: Aug 11th 2016 at 12:03:13 PM

As much as I agree with you, I'm kinda gonna miss her old swimsuit costume. I'm not gonna lie about the reasons I'll miss it, but still.

Also, EMH made me really like her original costume as well. It looked rather good on her.

One Strip! One Strip!
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#61404: Aug 11th 2016 at 12:05:00 PM

Yeah if she's not a Kid Hero I don't really see the point of using Ms. Marvel. I understand changes and liberties happen with all characters but Kamala as an adult soldier just seems like a waste when you have a bunch of other characters who could fill that role (like Monica Rambeau or the aforementioned Jessica Drew).

edited 11th Aug '16 12:05:49 PM by comicwriter

nervmeister Since: Oct, 2010
#61405: Aug 11th 2016 at 12:06:37 PM

[up][up][up][up]It was more a response to the whole "power fantasy" jive that comicwriter said . While that does make sense for the Hulk's HIGHLY disproportionate physique, it shouldn't be the goto excuse for any male character who so much as bares a six pack.

edited 11th Aug '16 12:10:52 PM by nervmeister

Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#61406: Aug 11th 2016 at 12:16:29 PM

[up][up]

Something else to consider is that Kamala Khan doesn't actually have any meaningful 1:1 interactions with Carol Danvers until well after she becomes the new Ms. Marvel.

If they are commit to making Kamala Khan a character in the MCU in Phase 4 (whether it be in a solo film or a supporting character elsewhere), the best place to include her in Captain Marvel is probably not unlike her initial Early-Bird Cameo in the comics, just have her as one of many civilians that Carol Danvers protects.

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#61407: Aug 11th 2016 at 12:18:59 PM

I've honestly never met a dude who has said they felt uncomfortable with Hawkman or Namor. The only time I see dudes genuinely get uncomfortable over sexualization of men is when it's like slash or making a character look like a pretty boy. And even if there were, Namor is usually more covered up nowadays anyway.

[up]Yeah. I'd do something akin to her first cameo, just show a little girl hanging up a Captain Marvel poster in her room.

edited 11th Aug '16 12:19:31 PM by comicwriter

nervmeister Since: Oct, 2010
#61408: Aug 11th 2016 at 12:23:41 PM

[up]Okay comicwriter. How many men fantasize about punching the shit out of a monster.............while wearing just briefs or a speedo, like Namor?

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
nervmeister Since: Oct, 2010
#61410: Aug 11th 2016 at 12:32:16 PM

[up]REALLY? That's your battle attire of choice?

DeathsApprentice The Ultimate Lifeform from The Ark Since: Aug, 2011 Relationship Status: Is that a kind of food?
The Ultimate Lifeform
#61411: Aug 11th 2016 at 12:37:01 PM

I thought the reason why Namor's or the Hulk's costumes aren't equivalent to skimpy costumes on a woman superhero was that there are way more superheroines that wear skimpy, fanservice-y costumes than guy superheroes? (I could be wrong, but that's just what I heard. :/)

It would be pretty cool if Jessica Drew could be a part of the supporting cast. Or Monica Rambeau. I've always thought it'd be cool to have Kamala's first intro to the MCU be like her intro to the comics: a post credits scene with her putting up a poster of Carol. She really does not need to be supporting cast in Captain Marvel, it wouldn't make much sense, honestly.

edited 11th Aug '16 12:38:35 PM by DeathsApprentice

When we're done, there won't be anything left.
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
nervmeister Since: Oct, 2010
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#61414: Aug 11th 2016 at 12:47:07 PM

[up][up][up]Basically. That and even if they were even, the way they're drawn and presented is usually vastly different.

[up]But it makes me feel empowered.

edited 11th Aug '16 12:48:20 PM by comicwriter

nervmeister Since: Oct, 2010
#61415: Aug 11th 2016 at 1:05:30 PM

[up]Okay. Then why aren't we seeing more modern supehero adaptations where the male heroes are in little tight speedo numbers if the appearance of such brings power to mind.

edited 11th Aug '16 1:25:18 PM by nervmeister

MousaThe14 Writer, Artist, Ignored from Northern Virginia Since: Jan, 2011 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
Writer, Artist, Ignored
#61416: Aug 11th 2016 at 1:22:27 PM

It's not about practicality it's about the message that the author sends with their choices, Namor and Hulk were never created with the female gaze in mind unlike most female superheroes which were created with the male gaze in mind, you're creating false equivalences, per usual, and inventing a strawman to knock down with the "It's equal sexualization" when that's never what was going on in the first place.

The Blog The Art
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#61417: Aug 11th 2016 at 1:30:52 PM

[up][up]I'm not really following the train of your argument anymore.

[up]Basically. Namor was created with a speedo because he was a swimmer and the artist gave him what people wear when they swim. Carol Danvers was designed with a cut out swim suit because the people involved thought it'd look sexy and hot. It's not rocket science.

edited 11th Aug '16 1:32:19 PM by comicwriter

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#61418: Aug 11th 2016 at 1:32:22 PM

That's what happens when you use straw arguments.

nervmeister Since: Oct, 2010
#61419: Aug 11th 2016 at 1:39:17 PM

[up][up]And oldschool Martian Manhunter? What purpose did the briefs and chest straps serve?

[down]Well I think it was designed with eye candy in mind. But fine, let's call it a day.

edited 11th Aug '16 1:55:30 PM by nervmeister

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#61421: Aug 11th 2016 at 2:08:16 PM

Let's put it this way: Show me the comic panel which focusses solely on the crouch of a man or one which focusses on his butt instead of his muscles. Yes, Woman like to look at muscles, too (though not as much as men seem to think, there is something like a "good measure" in this regard), and I bet that a lot of us swooned over Chris Evans biceps when he pulled back the helicopter. But for a male the reaction to those poses tends to be along the line of "cool, manly!", meaning they are drawn for the male gaze (the movies are a different matter, Marvel studios has obviously figured out that they get more money if they put something for the female audience in, too). But if you want to know which kind of poses of a female character is pleasing for the female audience have a look at how they are drawn in stuff like Sailor moon. Hint: The focus is not on the breast, the butt or the area between their legs.

Anyway, her wearing the costume with leaves the legs free would look ridiculous anyway.

Punisher286 Since: Jan, 2016
#61422: Aug 11th 2016 at 2:22:37 PM

Yeah usually when parts of male hero's anatomy is focused on in comics, it's their massive biceps or toned physique. Where's with female characters, it's usually their (often suspiciously consistently large) breasts, or their butts, etc. Basically the male character, when they are "objectified," are done so in a way that emphasizes how "powerful" and "awesome" they are. Whereas with female characters, it's much more about pure sex appeal.

And their costumes also seem to emphasize this as well (looking like swimsuits, riding up their butts like thongs, high-heels, thigh-highs, etc). And in the case of Carol, the excuse is that it "makes her feel powerful." Well that costume makes her "feel powerful" as defined by the MALE writer and artist who came up with it decades ago.

There's also a difference between a couple of "fanservicey" moments (we've mentioned some in the films already) and having your superhero costume, that is meant to taken seriously, be about fanservice. The MCU has generally tried to homage the "classic" costumes from the comics while making them fit into the film-verse. Which often means making them seem more practical. They did it with Cap's costumes, Black Panther, Hawkeye, and even Black Widow and Scarlet Witch. So seeing all of them standing together, and then Carol is there with her glorified one-piece suit and thigh-highs, she's going to stick out like a sore thumb (and not in a good way).

But I fully expect them to use her current CM costume in the films (with modifications to fit the films). Everything that they've said and done so far points in that direction imo.

hollygoolightly Since: Apr, 2012 Relationship Status: Showing feelings of an almost human nature
#61423: Aug 11th 2016 at 2:22:45 PM

[up][up]Also, Steve pulling back the helicopter had at least three to four things going on at once: Steve is even stronger than we expected, Steve is crazily stubborn to degrees even we didn't know yet, Steve won't let brainwashed Bucky leave even if that means he has to pull a helicopter out of the sky, and wow, look at Chris Evans' awesome biceps. If he had been wearing any of the Carol costumes that have been linked aside from the jump suit, people would have wondered if he was going to a special fetish party and really desperately wanted the Winter Soldier to be there, too.

edited 11th Aug '16 2:23:12 PM by hollygoolightly

nervmeister Since: Oct, 2010
#61424: Aug 11th 2016 at 2:26:13 PM

[up][up][up]LOOK AT IT!

edited 11th Aug '16 4:38:35 PM by nervmeister

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love

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