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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#60151: Jul 6th 2016 at 7:55:57 AM

[up][up] Yes, it was.

[up] That's because people like Peter Parker. And also because it was the Clone Saga, and people try very hard not to remember anything that happened in the Clone Saga.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#60153: Jul 6th 2016 at 8:15:56 AM

[up][up]

Are you saying people DON'T like Hank Pym, and that's why they are so unwilling to cut him any slack.

One Strip! One Strip!
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#60154: Jul 6th 2016 at 8:17:41 AM

He has always been a second stringer for one of the earliest heroes

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#60155: Jul 6th 2016 at 8:54:44 AM

Yes. That is exactly what I am saying. Hank Pym has never achieved the level of popularity that Peter Parker and Reed Richards have and, as such, fans are more willing to sweep their wife-beating episodes under the rug because they're more familiar with things the characters did that weren't the wife-beating episode.

Spider-Man and the Fantastic Four are household names, while Hank Pym is "One of the white Ant-Men. No, not the funny one. Yes, the one who hit his wife that one time, he's that one."

edited 6th Jul '16 8:56:29 AM by TobiasDrake

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Watchtower Since: Jul, 2010
#60156: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:01:52 AM

People know Reed Richards, but no one really likes Reed Richards. At best he doesn't really stand out that much, at worst he becomes Reed Richards Is Useless incarnate. And even then people don't try to hold him to his 60s casual misogyny.

Also, aren't all the Ant-Men white? I'm pretty sure Goliath only went big.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#60157: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:06:14 AM

No one likes Reed Richards but they still know much more about him than the 60's misogyny. They don't like Reed for his pompousness and his scienceness and his boringness. They know his archnemesis is Doctor Doom who he blew up in college or some shit, and they know about something something Silver Surfer and Galactus.

Who's Hank Pym's archnemesis? What adventures has he been on that have become ingrained in the public knowledge? As far as the lay person is concerned, he's a guy who talks to ants and hits his wife and that is the entirety of his character and story.

Now, at least, he has a movie so people can go, "Ooh, I know this one. His archnemesis is Darren Cross!" Which isn't actually accurate but it's more than casual fans had before.

Reed Richards gets parodies, some affectionate and some less so. Hank Pym gets Aquaman publicity.

edited 6th Jul '16 9:09:18 AM by TobiasDrake

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Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#60158: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:10:07 AM

"Who's Hank Pym's archnemesis?"

I think it was originally The Slug or Eggman- and I'm only aware of them through Nick Spencer (and I'm not completely sure Eggman isn't a Wonder Woman villain).

I'd say that in a sense, Ultron is his archnemesis, playing a similar role as the Venom symbiote does to Spider-Man.

In another sense, Hank Pym is Hank Pym's archnemesis.

Edit- It's Egghead- I was close.

Also, I guess Whirlwind would count for a major enemy, if not archnemesis.

edited 6th Jul '16 9:11:27 AM by Hodor2

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#60159: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:11:42 AM

More: Oh, I know this one! He is the one with the cute ant which was killed, and the rambling side-kick, and the adorable little daughter. Plus, he is Mac Gyver!

Oh, and there was this other guy, too, who was played by Michael Douglas, in all his awesomeness.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#60160: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:13:44 AM

Well, I guess we should all just kick Hank around.

That'll help his reputation. Yes sir.

And like, I see your point and all, but it feels like people don't like him anyway, so lets just keep treating him like shit has become the default for Hank.

One Strip! One Strip!
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#60161: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:14:04 AM

[up][up][up] It's usually said to be Ultron these days, yes. Which the films also aren't helping because they gave that one to Stark.

End result: the reason people won't let the wife-beating episode die when Peter Parker and Reed Richards have also done it is because the controversy is more famous than Hank.

edited 6th Jul '16 9:14:21 AM by TobiasDrake

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HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#60162: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:18:04 AM

[up]

Wow. That's...really really sad.

Theres nothing worse then being defined by a single mistake (that only happened due to a miscommunication between the writer and artist).

How different things would have been for him if that had never happened at all.

One Strip! One Strip!
DrWillHatch63 Since: May, 2014
#60163: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:19:11 AM

I like Reed Richards, or at least from what I've read of him in the early Jack Kirby/Stan Lee and John Byrne runs, but I can get why people might not. He's pretty much what Rick from Rick and Morty would be if he weren't an alcoholic and cared about his family.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#60164: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:23:47 AM

I mean, the dumbest part about the wife beating part was that people forget what happened after...Pym pulled himself together, found out Egghead and the Masters of Evil were fucking with his mind, and proceeded to save the Avengers by soloing all of the Masters of Evil.

BY HIMSELF.

Like, the guy went full on badass on them.

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VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#60165: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:27:19 AM

People tend to remember the worst things comic characters do when they themselves haven't experienced anything that character was well written or important in. It's the same reason shit tons of X-Men fans hate Wanda for the Decimation Wave, that's all they really knew about her aside from being the former daughter of Magneto.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#60166: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:27:52 AM

And of course it happens in the MCU when people still hate her for South Africa.

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VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#60167: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:29:10 AM

Well that case is a tad more justified. Film Wanda only has 2 stories she's in, and one of time was her as a villain.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#60168: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:30:15 AM

Fair point. Just getting kind of annoyed how it's still brought up (I mean, outside of the legit criticism of how it's kind of swept under the rug in Civil War).

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#60169: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:31:53 AM

People also tend to forget that Janet van Dyne was pretty awful back then, too. She deliberately married Hank when he was in his "Yellowjacket" phase, even though she knew he was having mental problems at the time. (Hank was Yellowjacket, but didn't remember he was Hank. He thought he killed Hank at the time. This is when Janet decided to marry him and it's only afterwards that it's revealed to everyone that Yellowjacket is Hank.)

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#60171: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:36:53 AM

It started the moment the news hit.

AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#60172: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:37:18 AM

Uh, does that belong in this thread? Isn't that kind of comic specific?

Also, kind of a loaded question, mate. I don't even read the comics.

Have you any dreams you'd like to sell?
unknowing from somewhere.. Since: Mar, 2014
#60173: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:37:40 AM

Count me as one of the biggest haters of movie wanda for what she did, I think that afect a little bit my enjoyment of Civil war.

And with Hank, well a hero having badass movement is nice at all but is given to superhero story, a hero doing something stupid? yeah that stick out more

I mean, when I remenber Spiderman in comic is pretty much: clone saga, one more day and Superior spiderman

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SonOfSharknado Love is Love is Love Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: And they all lived happily ever after <3
Love is Love is Love
#60174: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:39:08 AM

[up][up] "Loaded" is the most polite way to put it.

My various fanfics.
AdricDePsycho Rock on, Gold Dust Woman from Never Going Back Again Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: [TOP SECRET]
Rock on, Gold Dust Woman
#60175: Jul 6th 2016 at 9:39:25 AM

Unknowing, I know how much you hate Wanda, you don't stop bringing it up.

Though you have a point about the negative moments sticking out more. I mean, Iron Man is known as a drunk by a lot of people.

[up]

I try my best to be polite, good sir.

edited 6th Jul '16 9:45:17 AM by AdricDePsycho

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