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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#39976: Aug 6th 2015 at 8:40:39 AM

The heroes weren't any better either, as the Conflict Ball was strong. Strange informs them of Doom's new universe and how it's worked great for seven years or so, and their response is that he's Doom, therefore it can't possibly work great and he must be overthrown. They don't even take a moment to actually see what Doom's created, they just go, "He's DOOM, he's going down."

At last they are consistent. That is exactly the same reaction the Avengers had about the Phoenix Five.

edited 6th Aug '15 8:41:01 AM by Heatth

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#39977: Aug 6th 2015 at 8:46:50 AM

The Phoenix Five had a chance to do things, though. They were threatening the U.N. into submission to declare an end to war under penalty of retribution, terraforming the Earth, mandatorily mind-raping trauma victims, using Limbo as a prison for political enemies, and noticeably not repowering mutants, which had been their entire motivation to begin with. They were drunk on power and YMMV on how positive or negative their influence was, and the power they were drunk on stemmed from a cosmic force bent on annihilating the planet.

In short, while there were many reasons available to support the Phoenix Five, there were also many reasons to oppose them. For Doom, no argument could even be made one way or another because they never even had a chance to see Doom's new world. They already made up their minds to depose him before they even left the facility their ship was housed in.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#39978: Aug 6th 2015 at 8:47:06 AM

Does anyone in here actually like the Fantastic Four? As characters?

Because I am getting really sick of the repeated assertions that they're only worth reacquiring for their rogues gallery.

I like the entire Fantastic Four, even Reed.

While I'm not against their Rouges Gallery showing up in the MCU, I'm not of the opinion the Marvel Cinematic Universe would benefit from them.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#39979: Aug 6th 2015 at 8:48:12 AM

I love the individual members of the Fantastic Four and feel that they are all great characters in their own right.

It's the team itself that is less than the sum of its parts. Johnny's great when he's kicking it with Spider-Man and being a super-celebrity, Ben's awesome as an Avenger, Reed's the definitive super-scientist of the Marvel Universe, and Sue is fantastic as both one of the most powerful superhumans in the Marvel U and an action mom.

But as a team, their adventures are just dull. As with Doom, they play off other characters much better than off each other.

edited 6th Aug '15 8:49:52 AM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Theokal3 Since: Jan, 2012
#39980: Aug 6th 2015 at 8:51:23 AM

I don't hate the Fantastic Four, but I admit they are in my least favourite superheroes. But I would gladly see a F4 movie that would actually succeed in changing my mind and convincing me they are awesome characters, much like Captain America's movie did.

edited 6th Aug '15 8:51:41 AM by Theokal3

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#39981: Aug 6th 2015 at 8:52:22 AM

If the MCU does get the Fantastic Four back, they don't need to make another movie for them. Hell, if the current movie is as bad as it is, even squatting on the rights beats running the name into the ground with more bad movies. I've always thought the FF make for better support cast than main stars nowadays.

As for Fox's treatment of the X-Men property, they've been doing a good job (for the most part). I'm not a mindless Marvel fangirl who thinks the MCU can do no wrong, so I don't think they should be in a rush to get the rights back, or that it would even be a good idea to do so. It's unfortunate that most of the interesting diverse characters are tied up with Fox as a result, but the X-Men's presence causes more problems for MCU continuity than good. Can't say I agree with the way Marvel's decided to marginalize them in the merchandise though.

edited 6th Aug '15 8:53:37 AM by AlleyOop

DrDougsh Since: Jan, 2001
#39982: Aug 6th 2015 at 9:05:03 AM

I honestly think you could make the case that the X-Men are a poor fit for a shared superhero universe anyway.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#39983: Aug 6th 2015 at 9:05:16 AM

For Doom, no argument could even be made one way or another because they never even had a chance to see Doom's new world.

Honestly, "Doom is God" is all that's needed to show them how messed up the world is. But even if they had seen it, what then? "Oh, look, a giant wall separating the rest of Battleworld from zombies, Ultrons, and the Annihilation Wave! Wait, Doom is God, why hasn't he just gotten rid of all of them? Oh, look a land of Hulks! Wait, why hasn't Doom cured them? Oh, look, the sun! Wait, where's Johnny?"

Honestly, their first instincts that this world was bad (well, most of it) are spot on.

And it's not like they attacked Doom outright. Reed even congratulated him on saving this piece of the Multiverse! But Strange knew that none of them would bend their knees towards Doom, so Doom would kill them, so that's why he scattered them.

edited 6th Aug '15 9:06:04 AM by alliterator

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#39984: Aug 6th 2015 at 9:14:11 AM

The Phoenix Five had a chance to do things, though. They were threatening the U.N. into submission to declare an end to war under penalty of retribution, terraforming the Earth, mandatorily mind-raping trauma victims, using Limbo as a prison for political enemies, and noticeably not repowering mutants, which had been their entire motivation to begin with. They were drunk on power and YMMV on how positive or negative their influence was, and the power they were drunk on stemmed from a cosmic force bent on annihilating the planet.

The Avengers decided to oppose the Phoenix Five before all of that happened. Black Panther Beast even made a whole speech about it in AvX#6. The P5 explicitly didn't do anything wrong before the Avengers decided to oppose them.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#39985: Aug 6th 2015 at 9:49:38 AM

In fairness, they've seen Doom gain godlike powers and take over the world before. It doesn't go well. Or it goes super well until he gets bored of it. When your godlike will is the only thing holding together the last scraps of existance, you don't want to get bored of it.

Ha, I remember Reed telling Hank that he knew more about Pym Particles than Hank

I really want to see MCU Hank in a scene like that.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#39986: Aug 6th 2015 at 10:19:38 AM

Let's say the Fantastic Four did end up back at the MCU, how would they be reintroduced to the audience if they don't make a film? Are they going to be former members of SHIELD? Recluses kind of like Hank Pym? Or will the accident be a recent thing and they'll be introduced via exposition?

VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#39989: Aug 6th 2015 at 10:33:03 AM

It'd be cool if the FF were dedicated supporting characters to the verse as a whole, rather than any individual movies - so they and their mythos have a role in lots of future MCU plots but don't have their own solo movie. That's something that imo the MCU should've started doing a long time ago, but the FF is as good a place to start with it as any.

A way they could explain their absence could be to say that they have no interest in the rest of the MCU's heroics and politics and/or were off in space of the Antimatter universe or something.

edited 6th Aug '15 10:36:14 AM by KnownUnknown

Wackd Since: May, 2009
#39990: Aug 6th 2015 at 10:41:01 AM

Honestly, I feel like the whole Alien Space Bats thing the X-Men currently have going on would've been a far better fit for the Four.

Maybe you'd be less disappointed if you stopped expecting things to be Carmen Sandiego movies.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#39991: Aug 6th 2015 at 10:47:15 AM

hisssssss

turtledoooove

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#39992: Aug 6th 2015 at 11:46:19 AM

I saw an amusing post somewhere on Tumblr of the Four getting sent into space in the 60s and having adventures with young Pym and Peggy. An earlier post on this forum reflected some of that.

wehrmacht belongs to the hurricane from the garden of everything Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
belongs to the hurricane
#39993: Aug 6th 2015 at 11:58:00 AM

outside of me liking ben grimm i've never had strong feelings one way or the other towards the FF.

xbimpy Since: Jul, 2015
#39994: Aug 6th 2015 at 12:58:06 PM

So I'm on IGN and I would say 90% of these commentators are dumbfounded to hear that Dr. Strange will be "trippy" and "dark"... Why do some people find it hard to believe Marvel can't pull off a cosmic horror story when obviously that is the only option Dr. Strange leaves? I am sick of the "Marvel is all jokes, they can't do dark" even though they just said it's inspired by Fantasia.

spashthebandragon thebandragoness from USA Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: Yes, I'm alone, but I'm alone and free
wehrmacht belongs to the hurricane from the garden of everything Since: Dec, 2010 Relationship Status: YOU'RE TEARING ME APART LISA
belongs to the hurricane
#39996: Aug 6th 2015 at 1:11:36 PM

well marvel CAN do dark lol they did it in daredevil, although that's a tv series and not a movie.

pretty sure they can do dr. strange we just have to see how it turns out.

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#39997: Aug 6th 2015 at 1:12:14 PM

By fantasia? Colour me intrigued...at least if the talk about the Chernabog sequence.

TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#39998: Aug 6th 2015 at 1:12:57 PM

[up][up][up] Well, it does have Strange right in the title. So it shouldn't be that surprising...

edited 6th Aug '15 1:13:20 PM by TargetmasterJoe

DrFurball Since: Jan, 2001
#39999: Aug 6th 2015 at 1:14:26 PM

I'd actually be disappointed if Doctor Strange wasn't trippy. With all the times they've mentioned Ditko when discussing the movie, it seems like a no-brainer.

What really worries me, though, is that he's apparently gonna have a goatee. It's not a dealbreaker, obviously, but I think the mustache is pretty iconic for Strange.

edited 6th Aug '15 1:14:45 PM by DrFurball

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#40000: Aug 6th 2015 at 1:16:26 PM

There was a Fantastic Four spinoff I read, I think it was Fantastic Four Unplugged? It dealt with stuff going on in the main book, Mr Fantastic missing, presumed dead.

There was a really good issue where Ben and Sue attend the reading of Reed's will and Ben obviously is not having a good day but some of Reed's stuff going to people who Ben doesn't think deserves it (including his class ring to Doom, I think) makes him flip his shit and the table.

Sue shuts him down and shows that the last bestowal was the old championship football that Ben had given Reed back when they were in college and Ben had no idea that Reed had even cared enough to keep it.

And he starts blubbering and apologizing for making things hard on Sue.

It was a pretty good story.

Which is an excessively WORDS way of saying that I've seen Fantastic Four stuff that I liked.

edited 6th Aug '15 1:16:36 PM by Bocaj

Forever liveblogging the Avengers

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