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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Mukora Uniocular from a place Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Uniocular
#36251: Jun 9th 2015 at 2:43:44 PM

[up]x2 I'm sure he could be. But I've seen too many badly-written versions of him and characters like him to really care.

"It's so hard to be humble, knowing how great I am."
Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#36252: Jun 9th 2015 at 2:48:05 PM

Cool. The Punisher is a great fit for the Netflix series and there is no reason to wait until they are ready to add yet another series.

I could definitely see the Punisher be an antagonist in the Daredevil season given their very different approach to vigilantism. Especially if the Punisher starts dealing out some disproportionate retribution and not just shooting bad guys in the heat of battle. If they do work together in the end, it will only be the result of a mutual threat passing the Godzilla Threshold.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#36253: Jun 9th 2015 at 3:10:06 PM

Not the biggest fan of the Punisher for similar reasons as Mukora, but I think fitting him into Daredevil is a good choice that plays to his strengths.

edited 9th Jun '15 3:11:07 PM by AlleyOop

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#36254: Jun 9th 2015 at 3:23:22 PM

For anyone who says he's boring, y'all need to read some Garth Ennis Punisher. Preferably, Punisher MAX. Ennis pretty much redefined the character so much that he wrote it for, like, nine years.

"It was in that moment that I realized something. A dull, blurred feeling that I'd had since this whole mess began, all of a sudden crystal clear. It had been a long, long time since I hated anyone the way I hated them"

edited 9th Jun '15 3:24:23 PM by alliterator

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#36255: Jun 9th 2015 at 3:25:26 PM

It should also be noted that the Punisher and DareDevil have a long, well-established history in the comics.

Castle got his start as a Spider-Man villain and drifted over to the pages of DareDevil too, because Spidey and DareDevil had a lot of crossover due to their close geographic proximity and similar focus. His character relationship with DareDevil is easily one of his most interesting; unlike Spidey who just sees him as a criminal to bring to justice, Murdock views Castle as a broken man and goes out of his way to try and save him.

It's a resigned frienemy relationship that explores both the dangers of what Murdock could become if he continues down this path, and also Murdock's merciful side, his Catholic drive to pull a lost soul back from the brink of damnation. As for what it does for Castle, well, as I've said before, Castle's not really a character, he's an event. He's something that happens to characters, and when he happens to Murdock, it's heart-wrenching in a way no other character relationship can reproduce.

That unique character relationship is why the Punisher and DareDevil cross over so much, and it's also why whenever Castle is apprehended, Murdock usually isn't far behind, ready to defend him in court.

edited 9th Jun '15 3:26:56 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#36256: Jun 9th 2015 at 3:38:19 PM

Their most recent crossover also had one of the greatest Author Filibuster moments in recent superhero memory.

edited 9th Jun '15 3:38:27 PM by comicwriter

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#36257: Jun 9th 2015 at 3:39:03 PM

In fact one of the few legitimately good (and not So Bad, It's Good) parts of "Punisher kills the Marvel Universe" is how that plot deals with Daredevil and the Punisher. Daredevil acts as a sort of Inspector Javert to Punsiher as he goes about murdering every superpowered being in cold-blood. Daredevil's the only one the Punisher is reluctant to kill and he's the final one he goes after. Their fight is so heartbroken on either side you could practically play "It Has To Be This Way" on the background.

And after he kills Daredevil and sees he's actually Matt Murdock, the champion of the innocent, the Punisher has a My God, What Have I Done? moment and ends up comitting suicide.

Incidentally Daredevil is the only character on that entire story to get a fair and balanced fight with the Punisher, he wins every other fight by ridiculously ham-fisted writerisms. Matter of fact he wins the fight, but the Punisher gets the drop on him as Daredevil is trying to reason with him.

edited 9th Jun '15 3:39:14 PM by Gaon

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#36258: Jun 9th 2015 at 3:44:59 PM

[up][up] To be fair, he was talking to Rachel Cole-Alves, who was the Punisher's partner at the time.

Ninety Absolutely no relation to NLK from Land of Quakes and Hills Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
Absolutely no relation to NLK
#36259: Jun 9th 2015 at 3:52:17 PM

That is a good filibuster. What's the difference between that and Author Tract again?

Dopants: He meant what he said and he said what he meant, a Ninety is faithful 100%.
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
#36260: Jun 9th 2015 at 3:53:49 PM

Author Tract: The author preaches his beliefs through the fiction he writes.

Author Filibuster: The story grinds to a halt for a long, rambling speech.

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#36261: Jun 9th 2015 at 3:54:45 PM

Author Fillibuster is more small-scale. It's a character (or narration) stopping to deliver a message that the author intended for a relatively long period of time, Author Tract is the work itself in its narrative and plot seems to have a bias for the author's views.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Ninety Absolutely no relation to NLK from Land of Quakes and Hills Since: Nov, 2012 Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
Absolutely no relation to NLK
#36262: Jun 9th 2015 at 4:45:58 PM

Eh, in that case, considering how ridiculous comic conversations are (in an actions-to-words sense), that doesn't seem much of a filibuster.

Dopants: He meant what he said and he said what he meant, a Ninety is faithful 100%.
TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#36263: Jun 9th 2015 at 4:56:55 PM

Their most recent crossover also had one of the greatest Author Filibuster moments in recent superhero memory.

What comic issue is that from?

edvedd Darling. from At the boutique, dear. Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: We finish each other's sandwiches
Darling.
#36264: Jun 9th 2015 at 10:44:01 PM

I'll say that Jon Bernthal has the right mug for the role. That face already looks like it's taken a beating.

Visit my Tumblr! I may say things. The Bureau Project
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
LordofLore Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Consider his love an honor
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#36267: Jun 10th 2015 at 8:04:06 AM

It seems incredibly Doomy to me. The cloak, the throne, the fantasy European setting in the largest and most important building in the city, even the metal bits of Ultron's body visible under the cloak are reminiscent of Doom's armor.

It's like Marvel went, "We can't have Doom, but we can totally emulate him!" MCU Ultron is a Composite Character of Ultron, Doom, and Stark.

edited 10th Jun '15 8:04:39 AM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#36268: Jun 10th 2015 at 8:12:23 AM

Jarvis Man, the most heinous foe the Avengers ever faced.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#36269: Jun 10th 2015 at 8:58:40 AM

So what are Jon Bernthal's references? Aside from having a part in The Walking Dead?

edvedd Darling. from At the boutique, dear. Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: We finish each other's sandwiches
Darling.
#36270: Jun 10th 2015 at 9:00:42 AM

He was in the WW 2 film Fury recently.

Which was directed by David Ayer, who is, funnily enough, directing Suicide Squad.

Visit my Tumblr! I may say things. The Bureau Project
VeryMelon Since: Jul, 2011 Relationship Status: Anime is my true love
edvedd Darling. from At the boutique, dear. Since: Jan, 2001 Relationship Status: We finish each other's sandwiches
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#36273: Jun 10th 2015 at 9:25:56 AM

Some more alleged Civil War details from Joblo:

We'll start with Black Panther. According to the site, T'Challa will actually side with Tony Stark initially, though his loyalties may shift as the story progresses. This obviously places him in direct conflict with Captain America, and the two ultimately come to blows. As expected, Panther's costume is "shrouded in Vibranium", and during his battle with Rogers we'll see him "scratching Cap's shield easily and his prowess will prove to be a viable threat." We can also expect to see a "sleek Panther jet of some type," which apparently looks very "Stark-like."

War Machine will be getting a huge armoury upgrade, and is said to appear more "tank-like" in the film. He'll also have a new shoulder cannon which can be detached and "used as a kind of warhammer/baton."

Fans of Hawkeye's classic 616 comic look will be happy to hear that Barton will be adding some more purple and a full right sleeve to his costume - though probably best not to hold your breath for the Wolverine-like mask.

] As was previously reported, Scott Lang WILL debut his Giant-Man persona in this threequel, and he'll have a brand new "modern/techno stylish" outfit to go with it. Reportedly there will also be what sounds like an awesome visual of the character as Ant-Man, "standing on one of Hawkeye's arrows, ready to be launched."

edited 10th Jun '15 9:33:13 AM by comicwriter

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#36274: Jun 10th 2015 at 9:33:33 AM

I really hope they don't go full-Sue with Black Panther.

That's the character's biggest problem: narrative overcompensation. A lot of writers like to depict the characters as doing whatever you do better. Like, he's a better fighter than Captain America and builds better tech than Iron Man and can shoot straighter than Hawkeye and all of his vibranium hardware trumps everyone else's hardware and so on.

Poorly written, Black Panther feels like he doesn't have a character niche of his own and is just trying to establish himself by outdoing the white guys at everything.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#36275: Jun 10th 2015 at 9:35:27 AM

Nothing there really says "Sue" to me. He fights Cap but then so did Winter Soldier and a host of other characters.


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