Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules
still apply.
- This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
- While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread
. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
- Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.
If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.
Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM
Honestly, I thought we were over the whole "Evil German" thing until Amazing Spider-Man 2 made me realize that's still a stereotype people are willing to embrace with open arms.
The Nazis were a long time ago. They're still popular as an Acceptable Target for a mindless evil Army of Doom, but so far as serious representation as characters, I thought we were past that.
edited 18th May '15 10:17:50 AM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.Yeah, but Hydra gets a pass for being derived from actual Nazis. In the show, Skye even called out a character for it.
- Skye: All this time, everything we've been through why? How could you?
- Grant Ward: I was on a mission. It wasn't personal.
- Skye: "It was - " you did not just say that. "It wasn't personal"?
- Grant Ward: Skye, listen to me...
- Skye: God, you might actually believe that. That - that is the twisted logic that they teach you when you sign up to be a Nazi.
- Grant Ward: Stop. Wait. I'm not a Nazi.
- Skye: Yes, you are. That is exactly what you are. It's in the S.H.I.E.L.D. handbook, chapter one. The Red Skull, founder of Hydra, was a big, fat, freaking Nazi.
- Grant Ward: That has nothing to do with today.
- Skye: You know, you always had that Hitler Youth look to you. So it's really not that surprising.
edited 18th May '15 10:28:36 AM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.![]()
Well, I give Marvel some credit for saying that Zola wasn't German but Swiss. And for putting one line in "The First Avenger" to clarify that Germans are not necessarily all Nazis. Which makes the whole thing more a Nazi than a German stereotype. I can life with that. They can turn as many Nazis into Banksys as they want as long as they don't fall into the "All Germans are Nazis" trap.
That is actually an idea which really should die in the American media, because membership in the Hitler Youth was mandatory at one point. Making it as a shortcut in a "this guy was in the Hitler Youth, so he is evil" way is wrong on so many levels. The Scholl-siblings for example were also members, and died fighting the regime.
edited 18th May '15 10:30:54 AM by Swanpride
I took it more as "This guy was in the Hitler Youth, so he was indoctrinated from an early age with Hitler Values."
I don't know, I've yet to see a black guy in Hydra.
edited 18th May '15 10:46:19 AM by TobiasDrake
My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.It's worth noting that in the comics HYDRA explicitly does NOT have racist hiring policies and they accept anyone they can take as long as they are able to serve.
Strucker makes a point of saying how clearly the idea of Aryan superiority didn't work out too well in the past, so there's no reason to not accept candidates who happen to be of non-white racial groups.
The only reason they were Jewish in the first place was because they were related to Magneto. They were always Roma first and foremost, which they continued to be. Even when they thought Magneto was their father, I don't think they ever gave their Jewish hereditary much of a thought.
(also, I am cynical to whether this change is meant to stay in the first place)
At any rate, they are still Roma in the comics and are presumably Roma in the movie as well. Scarlet Witch's actress even explicitly called the character gypsy at last once (and apologized for the term latter, I believe).
PS:There are multiple Jewish characters in the comics who are not related to Magneto. Kitty Pryde, Sabra and The Thing are the ones who spring to my mind immediately. But I know there are multiple others as well.
edited 18th May '15 11:20:57 AM by Heatth
I had no idea this was a stereotype, and I consider myself a connoisseur of Argentine stereotypes.
Dopants: He meant what he said and he said what he meant, a Ninety is faithful 100%.The comic twins are now 100% romani since their changed origin now isn't "Magneto's wife gets scared of him one day and runs away, she ends up in the High Evolutionary's area, one of his subjects(a cow) takes care of her until the twins are born after which the wife leaves her children, cow takes them to the master who gives them to a wandering couple of romani who'd lost their own kids since he doesn't want to raise babies and judges the couple as a good family for the kids" into "High Evolutionary takes the twins from a romani couple(why?), experiments on them(aside from that being his thing, why?) and then sends them back to the couple(why doesn't he wait to see if his experiments worked? He didn't abandon Warlock for months so why would he abandon 2 experiments so soon?)".
Edit:
edited 18th May '15 12:32:50 PM by LordofLore
![]()
The new origin for the twins and direction for HE pretty much eliminated one of the few good qualities of him(that he could actually care and listen to his subjects)so I'm still kind of mad.
◊ Why would he actually kill his old experiments that are loyal to him(among them the cow woman who delivered the twins in the old origin)?
edited 18th May '15 12:25:14 PM by LordofLore

Theoretically they could get away with a Bangladeshi American actress, or even an Indian American actress because Urdu and Hindi are basically the same language, although the latter probably isn't wise for political reasons.