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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#32876: May 6th 2015 at 8:45:50 PM

I recall at the time of the release of Winter Soldier people discussing that Cap's mighty shield has the actual power to make all those who choose to oppose it yield.

When someone pointed out Winter Soldier not only didn't yield, but grabbed the damn shield mid-air, people pointed out back that Winter Soldier did not choose to oppose the shield, and thus the rules do not apply to him.

edited 6th May '15 8:46:19 PM by Gaon

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Wackd Since: May, 2009
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#32878: May 6th 2015 at 8:47:58 PM

I don't recall the 60's theme being in that movie. The theme from the live action show makes an appearance, though.

Might have been just as well. That one was kind of weird.

edited 6th May '15 8:53:13 PM by KnownUnknown

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#32879: May 6th 2015 at 8:54:20 PM

Just have to comment on this:

"LOKI: Awesome! ...wait, who said that? Did this thing just talk? / SCEPTER: No, I absolutely did not." [lol]

You know, with that in mind, something occurred to me. I've complained for a while about Loki's characterization in The Avengers- specifically in terms of his rhetoric about The Evils of Free Will and overall extreme Lawful Evilness (even though I'd place him as more Neutral Evil and saner in his other appearances).

Well, under the influence of Scarlet Witch's powers (which come from Loki's staff), Tony starts exhibiting hints of his "Eisenfuhrer" side and of course Ultron (who is basically the "computer" contained in the staff) is like the most extreme version of this, wanting to save humanity by wiping it out.

So what I'm saying is that it all makes sense with the reveal that the staff was something placed by Thanos. And going further, if you take Loki from The Avengers Up To Eleven, you get Ronan the Accuser who not coincidentally also uses a weapon containing an Infinity Stone. I do wonder though why Wanda and Pietro are comparably normal given the source of their powers.

edited 6th May '15 8:57:35 PM by Hodor2

InkDagger Since: Jul, 2014
#32880: May 6th 2015 at 9:00:02 PM

I watched Winter Soldier the other night and I also thought it wasn't some Crazy Aunt or whatever on the phone, but SHIELD and the Aunt thing was just a cover in the moment.

Hopefully, if they do make Sharon Carter/Steve Rodgers a thing, they'll work it through better than Widow/Hulk. I realize not everyone thinks Hulk/Widow was awful, but I would suggest that maybe they can work Carter/Rodgers in a way that there'll be far less people finding it out of nowhere or stilted.

And, I actually rather liked that she was included in Winter Solider and no romance was put there. It establishes her earlier out side of the role of Love Interest so she exists on her own first and not in relation to the hero.

HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#32881: May 6th 2015 at 9:01:21 PM

I recall at the time of the release of Winter Soldier people discussing that Cap's mighty shield has the actual power to make all those who choose to oppose it yield. When someone pointed out Winter Soldier not only didn't yield, but grabbed the damn shield mid-air, people pointed out back that Winter Soldier did not choose to oppose the shield, and thus the rules do not apply to him.

THAT WAS MEEEEEE!!!!!cool

I'm so glad someone actually acknowledge that!

.....And now I'm hoping I really was the first to bring it up, otherwise, I have nothing to be actually proud of.

One Strip! One Strip!
GethKnight Since: Apr, 2010
#32882: May 6th 2015 at 9:01:55 PM

[up][up]Might be reading you wrong, but Thanos had nothing to do with Ronan's behavior.

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#32883: May 6th 2015 at 9:06:53 PM

I was suggesting that, but it probably is unlikely (and he wasn't using the Mind Gem anyway).

I think the Loki-Ultron-Tony connection holds up though. Tony pegs Loki as being similar to him in being an egomaniac, and I guess egomaniac + Mind Gem = urge to control other people.

edited 6th May '15 9:12:50 PM by Hodor2

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#32884: May 6th 2015 at 9:11:05 PM

The Civil War cast being perfect on Twitter.

edited 6th May '15 9:12:55 PM by comicwriter

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#32885: May 6th 2015 at 9:15:26 PM

[up] Wait what's going on between them?

[up]x5 Yeah, I think the bits of interaction Sharon had with Steve combined with her other scenes in SHIELD, small as they might be, are already just enough to stave off the Crack Pairing-ness that pissed people off about Hulk/Black Widow.

edited 6th May '15 9:28:55 PM by AlleyOop

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#32886: May 6th 2015 at 9:29:03 PM

Nothing. Evans just posted one of those profound-sounding Twitter quotes and his costars responded by ribbing the shit out of him.

Wackd Since: May, 2009
#32887: May 6th 2015 at 9:32:38 PM

I don't recall the 60's theme being in that movie. The theme from the live action show makes an appearance, though.
...man, was the live-action show really 1978? It feels older than that, somehow, if not by much.

Maybe you'd be less disappointed if you stopped expecting things to be Carmen Sandiego movies.
Bloodsquirrel Since: May, 2011
#32888: May 6th 2015 at 10:16:07 PM

You know, there's not even anything fundamentally wrong with Natasha X Bruce. It just wasn't handled well in a movie that was characteristically full of things that weren't handled well.

For example, the way they portray the team at the beginning hints that the team has been together doing things for a while. But that doesn't really gel with how any of the previous solo movies ended, and the movie never gives us any explanation to smooth it over. So the romance seems to come out of nowhere because the timeline actually presented by the movies doesn't leave any room for it, even if Ao U was kind of written as if it had been brewing for a while.

It's also kind of a trademark for Whedon- a LOT of the romances in his shows more or less came out of nowhere and often didn't make much sense.

I don't think we should let one bad romance kill the idea of any other romances in the MCU, or even demand that they give us at least three movies of build-up. A script that's tighter and more focused that Ao U could very likely develop a proper romance.

Khfan429 Since: Aug, 2009
#32889: May 6th 2015 at 10:22:14 PM

[up]There actually is an explanation for why the team has been back together, implied though not outright stated (in the movie, it was mentioned in early interviews).

The team didn't get back together until after the Winter Soldier, and has consistently been a team since then until Age of Ultron happened. The fall of SHIELD was the catalyst, since it left the world without a force to handle the big threats. That's why Steve brings up that the Avengers were supposed to be different after finding out that Tony and Bruce kept Ultron a secret, and why Falcon is chasing leads on Bucky by himself... Steve got swept up in the Avengers and was too busy to do so himself.

edited 6th May '15 10:26:04 PM by Khfan429

Ekuran Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#32890: May 6th 2015 at 10:25:56 PM

They also went after other Hydra bases in-between the films.

Bloodsquirrel Since: May, 2011
#32891: May 6th 2015 at 10:34:49 PM

That's the kind of thing that could have easily been clarified in the movie.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#32892: May 6th 2015 at 10:36:06 PM

Especially since, the way that The Stinger of The Winter Soldier and Age of Ultron's opening align, it makes it seem as though the latter film started immediately after the previous.

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#32893: May 6th 2015 at 10:46:56 PM

But we know Age of Ultron didn't start immediately after Winter Soldier because Agents of SHIELD came between them. There was quite a bit of time.

I mean, this is sort of obvious. At the end of TWS, the Twins are still in a cell and they don't really have control of their powers. In AOU, they do. Time passed, they got control, SHIELD found out where Strucker and the scepter were and passed the information to the Avengers, the end.

Ekuran Since: Feb, 2010 Relationship Status: watch?v=dQw4w9WgXcQ
#32894: May 6th 2015 at 10:53:18 PM

[up][up][up]It was explicitly said when they were attacking the Hydra base at the beginning. You probably just didn't hear it.

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#32895: May 6th 2015 at 11:11:23 PM

The main things that give the sense of time between them in the actual movies is - on Winter Soldier's side - Strucker saying that he would be distracting the Avengers by sacrificing other HYDRA cells until they were ready and - on Age Of Ultron's side - the characters making several references to the fact that they've been attacking HYDRA bases and searching for Loki's scepter for quite some time.

edited 6th May '15 11:11:58 PM by KnownUnknown

KJMackley Since: Jan, 2001
#32896: May 6th 2015 at 11:30:01 PM

Even still I consider that to be a flaw of the movie, relying entirely on past movies for how it starts. The last time the Avengers were together they dispersed, waiting for the next time they are needed. Last time Hawkeye was seen was the previous Avengers. Thor was making out with Natalie Portman. Banner was playing therapist to Tony. Tony had blown up all his suits. Steve and Sam at the end of Winter Soldier made plans for a personal mission. Natasha went her own way.

Based on all facts established, the Avengers are something you pull out when the threat requires their full attention. That's how you feebly justify why Tony wasn't on Steve's speed dial for Winter Soldier. Even if they knew how advanced this particular Hydra base was (and dialogue suggests they did not), the lack of a proper set-up felt sloppy.

Plus, it's dangerous to begin so big, because it leaves the movie with little room to get bigger. Between that opening battle, the Hulkbuster fight, the freeway fight and the climactic free-for-all the action stops being distinctive and kind of blurs together.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#32897: May 6th 2015 at 11:31:48 PM

I don't know.

The big action beats all felt pretty distinct from each other.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#32898: May 7th 2015 at 12:01:01 AM

Yeah, of all the flaws in the film, "time has passed since the last one and the Avengers are back together" doesn't seem like one of them.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
GeekCodeRed Since: Sep, 2010
#32900: May 7th 2015 at 3:24:49 AM

...am I the only one who hope Steve's love interest is Queen Elsa?


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