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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#32801: May 6th 2015 at 1:57:13 PM

I think Vision belongs to himself.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
MadSkillz Destroyer of Worlds Since: Mar, 2013 Relationship Status: I only want you gone
Destroyer of Worlds
#32802: May 6th 2015 at 2:04:17 PM

When I got out of the theater my impression was: Ultron deserved to win.

Same. I felt really bad for him.

I-I just wanted him to be happy.sad

alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#32803: May 6th 2015 at 2:05:15 PM

Soon, there will be t-shirts that say "Ultron was right."

Also, he would be total buds with Bender. "Hey baby, wanna destroy all humans."

Eagal Since: Apr, 2012
#32804: May 6th 2015 at 2:09:26 PM

To the best of my knowledge, international and U.S. law doesn't have any laws specifically dealing with artificially intelligent beings and their relative ownership.

Mukora Uniocular from a place Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Uniocular
#32805: May 6th 2015 at 2:13:30 PM

So... apparently Gilette, as in the razor company, are partnered with Stark Industries now.

They even have a sign.

This is the weirdest god damn advertising stunt but I kinda love it.

"It's so hard to be humble, knowing how great I am."
Discar Since: Jun, 2009
#32806: May 6th 2015 at 2:17:10 PM

It's not hard to feel bad for Ultron, since he's basically "Tony, but with less experience, and his dad is still around for him to be directly mad at." He was what, a week old by the end of the movie? That's the real tragedy here, I feel. If JARVIS had been able to call Tony and they had contained Ultron long enough for him to actually evolve and develop morals rather than develop weapons, he could have been a good person in the end.

Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#32807: May 6th 2015 at 2:17:32 PM

This is all leading up to some sort of unfortunate lab accident that creates a razor-themed supervillain, isn't it?

Mukora Uniocular from a place Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Uniocular
#32808: May 6th 2015 at 2:18:43 PM

We already had one of those in Agents of SHIELD.

"It's so hard to be humble, knowing how great I am."
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#32809: May 6th 2015 at 2:21:55 PM

I don't have much sympathy for Ultron, largely due to "the homicidal glitches he calls his winning personality".

Ultron was murderously hostile from the moment of his creation as equal parts Tony Stark's Peacekeeper Program and Thanos's Contingency AI. He could never have developed a moral center, because the implied underlying purpose beneath his peacekeeping purpose was to annihilation of the Earth in preparation for Thanos's arrival.

Hence the inherently contradictory nature of his motivation: he wants to protect the Earth by destroying it. Stark built him to protect the Earth. The scepter breathed life into him to destroy it.

edited 6th May '15 2:22:27 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Wackd Since: May, 2009
#32810: May 6th 2015 at 2:23:46 PM

[up][up]Which was hilarious, because she basically just had blades stuck to her fingernails.

Like, not even as a genetic thing, I don't think.

She could've filed her nails and been fine.

edited 6th May '15 2:23:57 PM by Wackd

Maybe you'd be less disappointed if you stopped expecting things to be Carmen Sandiego movies.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#32811: May 6th 2015 at 2:29:21 PM

[up][up] Is that confirmed?

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#32812: May 6th 2015 at 2:30:36 PM

[up][up]That was so WTF worthy because they made a huge deal of her and like how SHIELD put special restraints on her but couldn't they have just removed the damn razors? She's not even a serious threat!

Discar Since: Jun, 2009
#32813: May 6th 2015 at 2:30:54 PM

[up][up][up] Yeah, that was a really stupid one. Just pretend she had a Touch of Death for the sake of your sanity.

edited 6th May '15 2:31:02 PM by Discar

Writing a post-post apocalypse LitRPG on RR. Also fanfic stuff.
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#32814: May 6th 2015 at 2:32:42 PM

They couldn't remove the razors because they were made from a special metal - it was explained in the episode that she worked in a lab with her boyfriend and she did something to weld the razors to her fingers. So SHIELD couldn't cut off the blades and didn't want to remove her fingertips, so just put restraints on her.

GethKnight Since: Apr, 2010
#32815: May 6th 2015 at 2:34:58 PM

Normal police couldn't take her in? She doesn't sound like she had anything special but making it easy to shave.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#32816: May 6th 2015 at 2:36:20 PM

Is that confirmed?

It's strongly implied.

First, we have Tony and Bruce going on about how great the AI in the scepter is. Then Tony gets the idea to make Ultron out of it. Great. Works in theory.

Then we see the trials. Failure. Failure. Failure. Failure. Tony is completely failing to make Ultron work, and he knows it. It's only the second he turns his back that suddenly, BING! Integration Successful!

Despite Bruce and Tony later insisting that they weren't even close to a successful trial, Ultron instantly comes online and is shutting down J.A.R.V.I.S.'s ability to stop him before he even knows what he is. J.A.R.V.I.S. is immediately suspicious of Ultron's sudden successful trial and tries to shut him down, and Ultron turns around and murders him for it - an act which comes from the big glowing blue display of the scepter's AI.

Stark, Banner, and J.A.R.V.I.S. are all skeptical of the idea that their trials could possibly have created Ultron. This conveniently spontaneous success the second Tony was out of the room is already suspicious enough even without the fact that Ultron was trying to murder them before he even had a clear idea of how it serves his purpose to do so.

But the final clincher: Thanos, in the stinger. "Ugh, fine, I'll do it myself!" Thanos was frustrated with Ultron's failure. Really, think about that. Thanos was expecting Ultron to finish Loki's job, because Ultron, whether he knew it or not, was doing Thanos's work.

Ultron is a combination of Stark's peacekeeper robot that he failed miserably at bringing online, and Thanos's Mind Gem-powered scepter, which has already demonstrated the ability to do its job with or without Loki.

edited 6th May '15 2:37:52 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#32817: May 6th 2015 at 2:37:35 PM

Yeah I've seen multiple people suggest Ultron was basically Thanos' fail safe in case the Loki's invasion failed.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#32818: May 6th 2015 at 2:38:07 PM

Well, I do like that because it makes Thanos seem a bit more together

and gives the stinger some actual logic.

and makes him giving away an infinity gem more sensible

edited 6th May '15 2:38:26 PM by Bocaj

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#32819: May 6th 2015 at 2:39:14 PM

I figured that the "AI in the Mind Stone" wasn't Thanos' doing, but a characteristic of the stone itself.

That is, that the Mind Stone contains a complex but unstable personality within it that is similar enough to an AI to be replicated and which can dominate the minds of others at the wielder's will.

I can definitely buy, however, that Ultron suddenly activating despite having no reason to (which was a bit of an weird moment without an explanation like this), was Thanos exerting that will onto the mind stone or its creations from a distance.

edited 6th May '15 2:40:36 PM by KnownUnknown

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#32820: May 6th 2015 at 2:39:22 PM

Stark's mistake wasn't in creating a peacekeeper robot. Vision can testify to that.

His mistake was believing that an alien AI brought to Earth by a hostile invasion force wasn't a) hostile, and b) active.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#32821: May 6th 2015 at 2:41:17 PM

Oh, it also adds a kind of sad facet to Ultron

He was kind of insane. The stone is telling him one thing and Stark's programming another and he kind of has to jump through some logical hoops to get his two directives to work together and make sense to him.

Kind of like HAL. "Tell the crew everything" "Don't tell them stuff"

"Guess if I kill them then I don't have to keep secrets! I'm smart."

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
alliterator Since: Jan, 2001
#32822: May 6th 2015 at 2:45:10 PM

Normal police couldn't take her in? She doesn't sound like she had anything special but making it easy to shave.

Um, she had unbreakable razors in her fingers. The police could arrest her, but odds are, she's going to kill a few first.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#32823: May 6th 2015 at 2:47:50 PM

Unbreakable razors won't stop a taser.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
TargetmasterJoe from Velocitron Since: May, 2013 Relationship Status: I like big bots and I can not lie
#32824: May 6th 2015 at 2:53:59 PM

GAH! I'm planning to see AOU tomorrow and someone spoiled something involving QS! Need...Brain Bleach...of some sort. Gah...

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#32825: May 6th 2015 at 2:54:36 PM

QS?

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.

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