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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

dRoy Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar from Most likely from my study Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just high on the world
Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar
#31701: May 1st 2015 at 1:14:54 PM

I just think that Cap needs a purpose in life.

......You know what I think should happen?

When Cap retires from the Avengers, he should take up painting. He was an art student, no?

Continuously reading, studying, and (hopefully) growing.
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#31702: May 1st 2015 at 1:16:11 PM

I think the gist is enjoying fighting is okay, but relishing on bloodshed is a problem.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Paperbritt Since: Apr, 2013
#31703: May 1st 2015 at 1:16:25 PM

Sooooo evidently I went to the bathroom during a scene where Natasha tells Bruce she's infertile and that makes her a monster. Can someone give me a rundown of this scene and how anyone on any plain of existence thought that was an idea even remotely resembling anything that could be considered a "good idea"?

PurpleDalek Since: Sep, 2011
#31704: May 1st 2015 at 1:18:32 PM

She thinks she's a monster because she used to be an assassin and presumably murdered a metric fucktonne of people over her career. This has been set up in Natasha's previous two appearances. I have no idea how people are reading it as, "Infertile people are abominations."

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#31705: May 1st 2015 at 1:19:05 PM

I think this is going to be a love it or hate it scene for a lot of people. One of my friends who saw the international release was annoyed by it, but other people here say that line is being completely blown out of context.

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#31706: May 1st 2015 at 1:23:10 PM

It's very simple: She doesn't. The scene is Banner and Natasha talking, Banner says he's a monster and Natasha comments she is also a monster (being a cold-blooded assassin and whatnot). Banner exasperatedly tells her he can't have children because of his Hulking, and Natasha counters with stating neither can she because she was made infertile via surgery back in her training school. The parts of "I'm a monster" and "I'm infertile" are different ones, if interconnected (her meaning being something like "I was made to be a cold-blooded monster in every aspect and that's what I am and will always be", the forced infertility being the ultimate proof of how fucked up her training was).

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#31707: May 1st 2015 at 1:24:11 PM

I understood the intent of the line but I know a lot of people misread it that way. There were audible gasps and a woman in front of us going "WHAT?" when she said it. It was an odd juxtaposition and I think wording it better could have helped.

Galadriel Since: Feb, 2015
#31708: May 1st 2015 at 1:26:20 PM

My "WHAT" moment was Tony's "prima nocta" comment. I know he's a dick, but seriously. That's a pretty horrible thing to treat as a joke.

edited 1st May '15 1:27:58 PM by Galadriel

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#31709: May 1st 2015 at 1:27:52 PM

Prima nocta? As in "noble gets to rape his subjects on the night of their wedding" prima nocta? I don't think I want to know the context for that.

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#31710: May 1st 2015 at 1:28:53 PM

When she said she was sterilized, did she mean can't feel sex, can't have kids, or both? In the theater I thought she meant the former because it's easier for Femme Fatale spies to not get attached to targets if there's no pleasure in them being with the target.

[up]It's when he was joking about what he'd do if he got to rule Asgard by lifting Thor's hammer.

edited 1st May '15 1:29:36 PM by Tuckerscreator

Paperbritt Since: Apr, 2013
#31711: May 1st 2015 at 1:28:55 PM

Aaaah OK. I still question the importance of bringing up forced infertility in this film at all but it make more sense in that context.

Galadriel Since: Feb, 2015
#31712: May 1st 2015 at 1:29:08 PM

[up][up][up] Yes, that.

Context if you do care to know it (very mild spoiler): When they're all trying to lift Thor's hammer, Tony jokes that if he manages to do so and thus becomes ruler of Asgard, he will be re-instituting prima nocta. He thinks he's being funny, but he really, really isn't.

edited 1st May '15 1:29:57 PM by Galadriel

Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#31713: May 1st 2015 at 1:30:30 PM

It's a joke Tony makes in the Mjolnir-lifting scene, quipping he'll re-instate the Prima Nocta if he rules Asgard.

Tony's a pretty clever guy, so he may know Prima Nocta is completely ahistorical and there is zero evidence it was ever a thing in Europe.

On the other hand, he was stupid enough to quote Nevile Chamberlain, so I guess it depends on the time period.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
dRoy Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar from Most likely from my study Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just high on the world
Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar
#31714: May 1st 2015 at 1:30:32 PM

That joke alone was enough to lose his chance. [lol]

Continuously reading, studying, and (hopefully) growing.
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#31715: May 1st 2015 at 1:31:32 PM

Oh. Wow, that truly is horrible, bordering on character assassination. I guess the haters were kind of right in accusing Whedon of flanderizing characters. Tony has his problems with respecting women, but not once has he ever been presented in his own movies as the kind of person who would think it's funny to crack jokes about rape, even if he wouldn't actually follow up on it.

edited 1st May '15 1:37:30 PM by AlleyOop

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#31716: May 1st 2015 at 1:31:33 PM

Mjolnir: "Wait, what did you say, mister? That does it, I'm staying right here."

dRoy Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar from Most likely from my study Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just high on the world
Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar
#31717: May 1st 2015 at 1:32:38 PM

[lol]

By the way, that prima nocta was pretty much never carried out in practice.

edited 1st May '15 1:33:37 PM by dRoy

Continuously reading, studying, and (hopefully) growing.
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#31718: May 1st 2015 at 1:33:19 PM

[up][up][up] Alright I think that's blowing it out of proportion. It's an off-hand stupid remark from Stark. He's made those before and very often. It shows more that Stark has a dark sense of humour rather than he's a unrepentant rapist.

edited 1st May '15 1:33:29 PM by Gaon

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
dRoy Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar from Most likely from my study Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just high on the world
Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar
#31719: May 1st 2015 at 1:33:56 PM

He could be both. evil grin

Continuously reading, studying, and (hopefully) growing.
KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#31720: May 1st 2015 at 1:35:43 PM

[up] ...That's not funny.

Oh God! Natural light!
dRoy Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar from Most likely from my study Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just high on the world
Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar
#31721: May 1st 2015 at 1:36:11 PM

tongue

Continuously reading, studying, and (hopefully) growing.
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#31722: May 1st 2015 at 1:36:25 PM

Weird that that one was chosen, though, since the teaser clip in the trailer had him saying other lines like "I will be fair but firmly cruel, and maybe even work out the wench clause." Probably, like mewling quim, it flew right past the censors due to being old.

edited 1st May '15 1:36:49 PM by Tuckerscreator

vandro Shop Owner from The little shop that wasn't Since: Jul, 2009
Shop Owner
#31723: May 1st 2015 at 1:38:22 PM

It's not funny, it's hilarious.

dRoy Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar from Most likely from my study Since: May, 2010 Relationship Status: I'm just high on the world
Professional Writer & Amateur Scholar
#31724: May 1st 2015 at 1:40:48 PM

At worst, he would be like Tyrion Lannister in terms of sex life. [lol]

Continuously reading, studying, and (hopefully) growing.
AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#31725: May 1st 2015 at 1:42:46 PM

[up][up][up]

Speaking of "mewling quim", bizarrely I see Whedon haters and some of the more vocal social justice bloggers bring up that line a lot as proof that Whedon secretly hates women, even though it's painfully obvious that's not something Whedon himself believes. If anything, the fact that it's spoken by Loki means that Whedon's trying to advocate the opposite point here by painting Loki as a Politically Incorrect Villain.

edited 1st May '15 1:45:20 PM by AlleyOop


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