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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Pannic Since: Jul, 2009
#31401: Apr 25th 2015 at 2:08:08 PM

I recall thinking around the time when Iron Man came out that it was pretty much just what the character needed so that everyone who knew about him didn't associate him with some variant of "Super-Fascist."

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#31402: Apr 25th 2015 at 2:28:24 PM

They're probably not going to tarnish him as badly this time around since they still have Zemo and Crossbones.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#31403: Apr 25th 2015 at 2:34:12 PM

Wasn't that mostly the result of the comics' multiple writers being given carte blanche to do what they want depending on their own political views? I have some hope Marcus and McFeely will be able to handle Tony with tact considering the nuanced work they did on Widow.

Speaking of which, I'm seeing quite a lot of anger from fans of The Winter Soldier over Cap and Widow's characterizations in Ultron (among the usual complaints of overstuffing or Whedon not respecting other films' writing). I guess that film really resonated with people. Haven't looked too closely into it since I'm still trying to avoid being spoiled too hard, but what do people here think?

EDIT: I'm also seeing a lot of hate towards Whedon in general. Some of it is understandable as the guy is probably set in his ways and a lot of his tics are Love It or Hate It, and he seems like a bit of a control freak. But a lot of it is flat-out Hate Dumb like accusing him of being a woman-hater for pairing Widow up (it's kind of a step back but really?) or claiming he changed the Maximoffs' background and had them work with HYDRA as an act of spite motivated by genuine hatred for non-whites and Jews. Not sure how seriously to take some of it now.

edited 25th Apr '15 3:06:10 PM by AlleyOop

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#31404: Apr 25th 2015 at 2:39:59 PM

There's a Brick Joke / Running Gag I felt was really out of character when you look at Cap's Character Development in TWS.

And that was part of the problem but the other is that Mark Millar is just not very good with nuance. He intended for Tony to be right despite having him depicted as a near-Complete Monster.

edited 25th Apr '15 2:41:08 PM by comicwriter

Pannic Since: Jul, 2009
#31405: Apr 25th 2015 at 2:40:30 PM

I'm going to have to see The Winter Soldier.

I hope that in Civil War they keep Cap's speech from the Amazing Spider-Man comic.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#31406: Apr 25th 2015 at 2:45:34 PM

[up] Do eet. Some of the best fight scenes ever in a superhero film, the baddies are pleasantly hardcore, and I'm not the kind of person who cries easily at movies but the ending gave me real feels.

GethKnight Since: Apr, 2010
#31407: Apr 25th 2015 at 3:29:45 PM

What Brick Joke / Running Gag?

edited 25th Apr '15 3:30:21 PM by GethKnight

Heatth (X-Troper) Relationship Status: In Spades with myself
#31408: Apr 25th 2015 at 4:42:15 PM

[up]I presume it is the fact Cap said "language" in response to Tony saying "shit" in the first 5 minuts of the movie. Everyone started making fun of him for it through the rest of the movie. I want to clarify Cap only said that as a reflex and is not at all concerned about bad words for the rest of the story. He said some himself at some points (and, of course, is mocked for it). At last that is the only Captain America related running gag I an think of, but I don't see how this is out of character regarding his characterization in TWS.

This isn't a real spoiler, btw, but better safer than sorry.

edited 25th Apr '15 4:43:42 PM by Heatth

GethKnight Since: Apr, 2010
#31409: Apr 25th 2015 at 4:47:21 PM

Oh that. Eh, he's a soldier. It's to be expected for them to have a bit of a mouth. I wouldn't call it a spoiler, but I would say that talking about a mind whammy last page would probably count. The film's not even out in the US for another week.

edited 25th Apr '15 4:47:55 PM by GethKnight

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#31410: Apr 25th 2015 at 4:59:35 PM

Looks like they've ALREADY announced the home release of AOU is going to have an extended run time and a bunch of deleted scenes.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#31411: Apr 25th 2015 at 5:01:53 PM

Personally I thought Whedon leaned a little heavy on the "Cap is old-fashioned" jokes in the first movie, and if he's still milking that cow then that sounds like lazy writing. Also I've been suspecting for a while that there's a lot of Writer on Board behind the way he portrays Cap, which is totally not cool if that's the case.

[up]From the sounds of a lot of things, maybe they should've released the extended version in the first place. We might have another Affleck Daredevil situation on our hands.

edited 25th Apr '15 5:05:30 PM by AlleyOop

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#31412: Apr 25th 2015 at 5:04:58 PM

So, is the Marvel One Shots idea pretty much retired at this point?

edited 25th Apr '15 5:05:11 PM by KnownUnknown

Brandon Deadly Vu! from Between Thanksgiving and Christmas (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Don't hug me; I'm scared
Deadly Vu!
#31413: Apr 25th 2015 at 5:08:30 PM

I haven't heard any news regarding an actual Hulk movie. Has that been put on the back burner?

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Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#31414: Apr 25th 2015 at 5:11:27 PM

Whedon claimed he wanted to make this film shorter than the last one, and made it one minute shorter. Was that a good idea or bad idea?

It's a shame there haven't been further One Shots. It would be great to have a Howard the Duck one shot or Howling Commandos or characters they pitched introducing like Synthia Skull or sate our appetite for a Black Widow movie.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#31415: Apr 25th 2015 at 5:17:45 PM

Last I heard there was speculation on using the One-Shots to expand into animation.

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#31416: Apr 25th 2015 at 5:28:17 PM

I haven't heard any news regarding an actual Hulk movie. Has that been put on the back burner?

They announced their full slate for Phase 3 in November, and as of 2019, no new Hulk movie.

Whedon claimed he wanted to make this film shorter than the last one, and made it one minute shorter. Was that a good idea or bad idea?

Bad. It's a really good film but it's also really obvious where stuff got hacked out to make a shorter film. Thor's subplot in particular seems kind of random and choppy at times because of the amount of stuff you can tell was cut out.

edited 25th Apr '15 5:29:23 PM by comicwriter

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#31418: Apr 25th 2015 at 5:42:11 PM

[up][up] Who is he trying to impress by taking up that challenge? It's not like the original film seemed that long, and it sounds like he sabotaged his own movie by trying to set this arbitrary limit.

comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#31419: Apr 25th 2015 at 5:45:50 PM

On the press tour he spoke publicly about clashing with Marvel and Feige (but he called it "constructive" and claims the disagreements were for the best) and that Feige apparently really hated some of his ideas.

I'm starting to slightly think there was more tension behind the scenes than we're being told, and that maybe the runtime thing was Marvel/Disney's decision.

kkhohoho (4 Score & 7 Years Ago)
#31420: Apr 25th 2015 at 5:47:26 PM

[up]True, but I think even if he hadn't made that challenge, he'd still have to cut a good chunk of screentime; 3 hours just isn't something that's done anymore, or at least not by big studios like Marvel. Most viewers would complain that the film's just too long, and I don't think Marvel would want that. (Filmgoers these days have it easy; back in the 50's, they had 3&1/2 hour long epics like Seven Samurai and, guess what, THEY LIKED IT!tongue)

edited 25th Apr '15 5:48:45 PM by kkhohoho

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#31421: Apr 25th 2015 at 5:58:51 PM

It might be a push against blockbusters that have been getting longer over the years, such as the Transformers films, The Hobbit films, Avatar, etc.

DeathsApprentice The Ultimate Lifeform from The Ark Since: Aug, 2011 Relationship Status: Is that a kind of food?
The Ultimate Lifeform
#31422: Apr 25th 2015 at 6:00:36 PM

Steggy Ponies!

When we're done, there won't be anything left.
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#31423: Apr 25th 2015 at 6:01:34 PM

Only the Steed of America deserves four cutie marks.

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#31424: Apr 25th 2015 at 6:10:41 PM

Just watched it...here some not particularly spoilery thoughts I put under a tag, just in case someone wants to know nothing. But first of all: I think the movie was as good as the first avengers, but in a different way, and I think I'll need some time and rewatches to figure out which one I like better in the end. It's not as good as Winter Solder or Got G though.

First of all the bad: The movie was a little bit overcrowded which resulted in some aspects didn't get as much time as they deserved and there was one subplot I didn't really care for. The good though: It's a little bit deeper than the first Avengers. It discussed questions of humanity and some twists are really clever. And the action scenes: Awesome!!!! Just Awesome!

And now some real spoilers to elaborate, but nothing major The subplot I didn't care for was the Black Widow/Bruce Banner romance. It came pretty much out of the left field, the characters have none chemistry whatsoever and I honestly don't see why they couldn't have made a similar arc with a friendship instead of a romance. It felt like there were some scenes missing in the movie, so I really want to see a directors cut of it. But what I really, really liked was how they handled Ultron. I thought that after all those movies about machines taking over the world this would feel like a repeat of the same, but it wasn't. It was more like a Zombie movie with robots. And all in all, while the movie hit a lot of familiar beats, it still managed to built in enough twists that it didn't feel stale at all.

BTW, to everyone who is worried that the trailor spoiled too much: They really didn't. Most of the scenes in it are actually from the first half of the movie.

AlleyOop Since: Oct, 2010
#31425: Apr 25th 2015 at 8:39:00 PM

Welp, a friend just accidentally spoiled me on part of Black Widow's backstory. Apparently she sees a lot of kinship with Bruce because she's sterile? WTF? There's like, a billion Unfortunate Implications right there, especially since that kind of insecurity doesn't gel well with what we've seen of her so far. Who the hell thought this was a good idea, because if it's Whedon then way to drop the ball in terms of female representation, and what a way to undo a lot of the good that's been done for female superheroes with Widow's portrayal so far.

edited 25th Apr '15 8:51:04 PM by AlleyOop


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