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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#26026: Feb 9th 2015 at 2:54:52 AM

[up] He didn't look that burnable when he fleed with Rocket from the explosion. He can also rescue his teammates from more or less everything.

Whowho Since: May, 2012
#26027: Feb 9th 2015 at 4:43:37 AM

His practical abilities are comparable to Reed Richards; it's arbitrary if damage done to him snaps him or not. At least in the MCU Groot's regenerative abilities are nice and slow, so if he is hampered he will be for the rest of the conflict.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#26028: Feb 9th 2015 at 7:32:59 AM

Indeed. Much like Wolverine, the question of whether or not destroying his body to the point that he can no longer continue fighting would actually kill him is irrelevant, because at the point that he can no longer continue fighting, he has lost the fight, alive or no.

Groot's abilities ultimately amount to a strong resistance to being used for C-List Fodder and little more.

edited 9th Feb '15 7:35:37 AM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#26029: Feb 9th 2015 at 8:15:21 AM

Across the board the MCU has already made most of its heroes less powerful than in the comics.

LordofLore Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Consider his love an honor
#26030: Feb 9th 2015 at 8:20:44 AM

Hell, I don't think this Gamora has a healing factor like the original.

Canid117 Since: Oct, 2010 Relationship Status: Hello, I love you
#26031: Feb 9th 2015 at 8:20:55 AM

It's all but outright sated that Thanos can beat Ronan's ass with no difficulty and Ronan demolished Drax. All we need to know is how strong Drax is compared to Thor and the Hulk but safe money is that Thanos can smear anyone else in the MCU in a 1v1 fight.

"War without fire is like sausages without mustard." - Jean Juvénal des Ursins
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#26032: Feb 9th 2015 at 8:50:25 AM

And further down the "food chain", while The Other cowed Loki (who is somewhere between Cap and Thor in strength), Ronan effortlessly killed him.

I think the Hulk could probably take down Ronan and at least in theory Thanos, because he's as Strong as They Need to Be, but both would probably be able to stop/contain him before he got too far.

edited 9th Feb '15 10:21:23 AM by Hodor2

KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#26033: Feb 9th 2015 at 9:03:51 AM

If they don't do so with Ultron, I could see them doing a "holy shit he's able to curbstomp the Hulk!" bit with Thanos.

LordofLore Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Consider his love an honor
#26034: Feb 9th 2015 at 9:14:09 AM

Thanos has a more iconic moment that they will probably use: breaking Cap's shield.

LordofLore Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Consider his love an honor
Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#26036: Feb 9th 2015 at 9:35:18 AM

Damnit Loki, probably!

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
higherbrainpattern Since: Apr, 2012
TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#26038: Feb 9th 2015 at 10:21:00 AM

I wouldn't say the Other cowed Loki, as most of their scenes revolve around Thanos. "You question me; you question HIM?!" It's made pretty explicit that it's not the Other that Loki is intimidated by, but his unseen master, revealed to be Thanos.

It may not necessarily have been one blow like Ronan, but Loki probably could have killed the Other too. But he didn't, out of fear and reverence for Thanos, with whose authority the Other speaks. Meanwhile, the Other's death was a display of Ronan's defiance, not his strength. At no point are we meant to believe the Other is, in and of himself, a great and powerful physical force.

edited 9th Feb '15 10:22:44 AM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#26039: Feb 9th 2015 at 10:22:24 AM

I can't remember, but isn't The Other shown as being taller than Loki? And conversely, Ronan towers over The Other, right? (And of course, Thanos towers over Ronan)

Mukora Uniocular from a place Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Uniocular
#26040: Feb 9th 2015 at 10:23:41 AM

Ronan is Lee Pace and Lee Pace is like 6'5, so that sounds about right.

"It's so hard to be humble, knowing how great I am."
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#26041: Feb 9th 2015 at 10:31:15 AM

However, Tim Hiddleston is 6' 2" and Alexis Denisof is 6' 1". And Thanos has the help of his space chair.

edited 9th Feb '15 10:31:48 AM by Tuckerscreator

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#26042: Feb 9th 2015 at 10:34:46 AM

I don't think it is (mostly) an issue of the actors' actual heights- In GOG my impression was that Ronan was somewhere between 8-10 feet tall.

LordofLore Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Consider his love an honor
#26043: Feb 9th 2015 at 10:43:24 AM

616!Ronan is around 7' 5'' most of the time.

Also, the 616!Guardians of the Galaxy have switched to their MCU inspired designs now. Hated all the old Bendis designs aside from Gamora's(since she actually wore armor for once).

edited 9th Feb '15 10:46:41 AM by LordofLore

Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#26044: Feb 9th 2015 at 10:46:53 AM

I'm still not convinced that Loki wasn't at least partly under the influence of the szepter himself.

Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#26045: Feb 9th 2015 at 10:53:58 AM

I think so too (even though I believe it was jossed). All of that talk about The Evils of Free Will in The Avengers seems out-of-character and not really how he usually talks (although it is how Ronan talks FTW).

I mean I think the Doyleist explanation is that Joss Whedon has a different idea of Loki than the other two directors, but from a Sherlockian perspective I'm going to go with the Staff. Also on the Doyleist end, I'm not sure if this was confirmed, but the MCU Chitauri sure seem a lot like the DC Comics Parademons, which may explain why Loki talks like Darkseid in the film.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think the staff was mid controlling him/that trying to conquer Earth isn't something he would be interested in doing himself- I just think that it would go a long way toward explaining why he was unusually fascistic throughout The Avengers and acted more normally after Hulk beat the crap out of him (similarly to how Hawkeye was freed from the Staff's control).

Edit- Or as a simpler theory, how could it not mess with his brain? That thing screams Don't Touch It, You Idiot!.

edited 9th Feb '15 11:04:19 AM by Hodor2

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#26046: Feb 9th 2015 at 11:13:44 AM

I think its also word of god that falling through the void was bad for his brain.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Gaon Smoking Snake from Grim Up North Since: Jun, 2012 Relationship Status: Above such petty unnecessities
#26047: Feb 9th 2015 at 11:23:47 AM

That explanation smells like Draco in Leather Pants to me, even though it was probably not the intention. It seems like justifying Loki's atrocities by retconning a mind control plot in it. My personal take on his change of behavior between Thor I and the Avengers was simply that Thor spoiling his plans, Odin "betraying him" by attacking him even though he was "saving Asgard" broke Loki and sent him into a Sanity Slippage which led him to the point he is in the Avengers.

"All you Fascists bound to lose."
Hodor2 Since: Jan, 2015
#26048: Feb 9th 2015 at 11:28:53 AM

Well, I'll openly admit that I dislike Whedon's take on Loki (which I'll also admit is less sympathetic than the one on the other films), but I'm more saying that Loki acts out-of-character in The Avengers and even if the Staff didn't cause it, it's still interesting that there is a Word of God explanation/justification ("space madness") for him being out-of-character.

Again, there's the Doyleist explanation of a different director, but Loki acts considerably saner in Dark World and it would make sense that this is in part from being separated from the Staff.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#26049: Feb 9th 2015 at 11:29:20 AM

I've long theorized that Loki was in some way dominated by Thanos simply because his plan was just so shitty - and even the characters call out the incredible shittiness of his plan, which means it's not accidental that his plan is so shitty. His brilliant master plan is basically, "Give my master everything he desires and then he'll throw me a bone." That's not the brilliant masterwork of a fantastic puppetmaster, that is Loki being Thanos's personal bitch.

At the time, before the reveal of the Infinity Gems, I had Loki's behavior pegged as indicative of him having been beaten into submission by Thanos, but the idea that the scepter was influencing and/or controlling Loki just like it was everyone else has merit.

I'm not going to say that Loki isn't cruel or petty or the like, but mindlessly serving an abusive overlord who hurts him just to prove a point, obediently following a plan with no real gain for him, begging at his master's feet for a token present of dominion over a planet that isn't even the one he wanted, all without even a hint of betrayal planned is not typical behavior of Loki. It's the behavior of a slave.

edited 9th Feb '15 11:32:23 AM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Swanpride Since: Jun, 2013
#26050: Feb 9th 2015 at 11:32:19 AM

[up][up][up] Na, Loki is pretty much in dire need for redemption even if you do assume that the whole invasion was not exactly his idea...but I say the same thing about him I just said about a certain other character in the Ao S thread: Loki belongs in therapy in a very secure closed ward.

Thing is, I think it would be more interesting if Loki were now working against Thanos and not for him.

edited 9th Feb '15 11:32:42 AM by Swanpride


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