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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
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If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Mukora Uniocular from a place Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Uniocular
#25351: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:19:50 PM

Y'know, the joke was always "The only characters who stay dead are Uncle Ben and Bucky Barnes"

But... as far as I'm aware, Bucky hasn't stayed dead for a long time. Like, Winter Soldier isn't that new is it?

"It's so hard to be humble, knowing how great I am."
BadWolf21 Since: May, 2010
#25352: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:20:56 PM

I thought about Gwen, but decided that it should be a true return from the dead, not a clone or a newly created alternate universe version who never died.

I suppose technically that means the comic book characters who have been dead the longest are Thomas and Martha Wayne. :P

(Yes, I know we said Marvel.)

[up] 2005. And he died in the '40s.

edited 28th Jan '15 5:21:36 PM by BadWolf21

Mukora Uniocular from a place Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Uniocular
#25353: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:22:02 PM

Oh.

Well never mind, then.

"It's so hard to be humble, knowing how great I am."
BadWolf21 Since: May, 2010
#25354: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:23:46 PM

Jason Todd was usually included on the list, but his death really only stuck for 15-ish years. The fact that he was Robin, and it stuck at all was enough to make the list.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#25355: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:25:18 PM

Thomas and Martha Wayne are alive on Earth-2, aren't they?

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#25356: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:28:00 PM

If you want to get technical "Bucky Barnes" returned in the seventies. Of course the actual Bucky killed him when he came back as the Winter Soldier but still.

BadWolf21 Since: May, 2010
#25357: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:28:22 PM

[up][up] Again, alternate universe versions don't count as being "back to life".

I suppose they technically did come back to life in Flashpoint, since that was not an alternate universe. And then they went right back to being dead afterwards.

[up] Wut?

edited 28th Jan '15 5:28:46 PM by BadWolf21

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#25358: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:31:09 PM

There were stories written in the fifties about Cap and Bucky fighting Soviets. When people questioned how this was possible in the sixties they came up with the excuse that two other people took over the identities of Cap and Bucky but slowly went insane due to a botched super soldier serum. The fifties Bucky eventually became Cap's ally Nomad but then the original Bucky killed him when he turned up as the Winter Soldier.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#25359: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:31:45 PM

Oh, I remember that.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#25360: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:33:42 PM

Minor, supporting or C-list characters stay dead all the time, as well as characters that some writers liked or were trying to make something of and other writers didn't like or wiped out to make way for their new characters.

It's just that those don't get as much press. tongue

BadWolf21 Since: May, 2010
#25361: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:33:45 PM

So it wasn't really Bucky Barnes, it was Bucky Barnes: Legacy Edition. Or something.

Wow, that's...confusing. :P

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#25362: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:34:02 PM

Yeah. Revealing the "True Cap" awakening from a frozen iceberg was an Author's Saving Throw after the Red Scare passed, hating communists fell out of style, and Captain America punching out communists began to look unpleasant.

edited 28th Jan '15 5:34:26 PM by TobiasDrake

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
Whowho Since: May, 2012
#25363: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:35:10 PM

If Spider-Gwen came to the 616 universe and made her home there, I would count that as Gwen Stacy returning to the 616 universe after 42 years.

It's difficult to apply this to DC due to how their continuity works. Also things get fuzzy when you ask yourself who counts as 'dead, or believed dead, or believed out of action.' thankfully the longer examples (and ones which are not on going) are less ambiguous.

EDIT: [up][up][up] Good old C-List Fodder. Batroc the Leaper is the only one who's immune. Even Stilt-Man got killed off. Of course, it's not noteworthy when a minor character is killed off; but if that character is noteworthy enough that down the line a writer feels like bringing them back; then it becomes interesting to ask why.

edited 28th Jan '15 5:38:16 PM by Whowho

Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#25364: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:35:46 PM

Yeah, Legacy Bucky's name was Jack Monroe. And as far as I know of he's stayed dead since 2005.

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#25365: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:36:43 PM

[up][up][up][up]Well it's not as bad Hawkman's history.tongue

It was a pretty convoluted excuse though. This was back when Marvel was trying to insist their superhero world was a continuous narrative and didn't say "Screw it, we're retconning those stories." They split up the original Avengers team for a similar reason when people questioned how it was possible for them to be having all these solo adventures while supposedly working as Avengers.

edited 28th Jan '15 5:38:13 PM by Kostya

BadWolf21 Since: May, 2010
#25366: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:38:29 PM

Whowho: I would disagree with you on that, then. It's not "Gwen coming back," it's "A different Gwen existing."

Kostya: I gave up even trying to understand Hawkman's history a long time ago. It helps that I never really found Hawkman terribly interesting to begin with.

edited 28th Jan '15 5:39:34 PM by BadWolf21

Whowho Since: May, 2012
#25367: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:39:49 PM

[up][up]And yet now days you can have a character be in four different on going books met only with a lampshade and a wolverine joke.

[up]That's fair, and I think I prefer that. The benefit of playing this game with MARVEL is that their world are pretty distinct outside of Captain Britain/Exiles shenanigans. Though time will tell what the fourth secret wars will entail.

edited 28th Jan '15 5:46:54 PM by Whowho

Kostya (Unlucky Thirteen)
#25368: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:42:19 PM

Well I do think it's unusual at times but the time scales in comics are always fuzzy. Even though the adventures are being printed simultaneously that doesn't mean they're happening that way in universe.

Bocaj Funny but not helpful from Here or thereabouts (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Pining for the fjords
Funny but not helpful
#25369: Jan 28th 2015 at 5:53:08 PM

I didn't know that about the roster change.

Still, the Kooky Quartet set a good precedent. Yes.

Forever liveblogging the Avengers
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#25370: Jan 28th 2015 at 6:31:07 PM

[up][up][up][up][up]The other big part was Stan having trouble coming up with threats that could challenge a team that powerful. One of the first Kooky Quartet story is literally them fighting Swordsman (who is basically Hawkeye with a sword) for two issues.

edited 28th Jan '15 6:31:21 PM by comicwriter

wanderlustwarrior Role Model from Where Gods Belong Since: Jun, 2009 Relationship Status: What's love got to do with it?
Role Model
#25371: Jan 28th 2015 at 6:46:05 PM

I like the idea and names of Ben Reilly as the Scarlet Spider. I wish he stuck around.

TobiasDrake (•̀⤙•́) (Edited uphill both ways) Relationship Status: Arm chopping is not a love language!
(•̀⤙•́)
#25372: Jan 28th 2015 at 7:18:51 PM

One More Day never would have happened if Ben Reilly were alive today.

My Tumblr. Currently side-by-side liveblogging Digimon Adventure, sub vs dub.
KarkatTheDalek Not as angry as the name would suggest. from Somwhere in Time/Space Since: Mar, 2012 Relationship Status: You're a beautiful woman, probably
Not as angry as the name would suggest.
#25373: Jan 28th 2015 at 7:22:08 PM

Yeah. Revealing the "True Cap" awakening from a frozen iceberg was an Author's Saving Throw after the Red Scare passed, hating communists fell out of style, and Captain America punching out communists began to look unpleasant.

I've seen some of the covers for those comics. Each is proudly emblazoned with the title "Captain America: Commie Smasher!" Ran for what, five issues?

Edit: Here's one of them. The art here makes them look like a couple of assholes, if you ask me.

edited 28th Jan '15 7:23:35 PM by KarkatTheDalek

Oh God! Natural light!
comicwriter Since: Sep, 2011
#25374: Jan 28th 2015 at 7:25:33 PM

[up]Yeah. Especially since the guys they apparently beat up and arrested look more like average joes than evil supervillains.

Mukora Uniocular from a place Since: Jan, 2010 Relationship Status: I made a point to burn all of the photographs
Uniocular
#25375: Jan 28th 2015 at 7:26:38 PM

Y'know, shit like this is why I think it'd be so much better if comics just gave up any attempts at having a coherent "canon" and just treated individual storylines as their own thing.

"It's so hard to be humble, knowing how great I am."

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