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Welcome to the main discussion thread for the Marvel Cinematic Universe! This pinned post is here to establish some basic guidelines. All of the Media Forum rules still apply.

  • This thread is for talking about the live-action films, TV shows, animated works, and related content that use the Marvel brand, currently owned by Disney.
  • While mild digressions are okay, discussion of the comic books should go in this thread. Extended digressions may be thumped as off-topic.
  • Spoilers for new releases should not be discussed without spoiler tagging for at least two weeks. Rather, each title should have a dedicated thread where that sort of conversation is held. We can mention new releases in a general sense, but please be courteous to people who don't want to be spoiled.

If you're posting tagged spoilers, make sure that the film or series is clearly identified outside the spoiler tagging. People need to know what will be spoiled before they choose to read the post.

    Original post 
Since Thor and now Captain America came out this year, I wanted to get what Tropers thought of the concept and execution of the Marvel Cinematic Universe in general. Personally I love the idea and wonder why this idea hasn't been seriously tried before. It sorta seems to me like the DCAU in movie form (And well, ummm, with Marvel), and really 'gets' the comic book feel of a shared universe while not being completely alienating.

Edited by Mrph1 on Jul 29th 2024 at 3:09:00 PM

Shadao Dorzma Forever! Artwork by Kris Dobbins. (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Shipping fictional characters
Dorzma Forever! Artwork by Kris Dobbins.
#157626: Jul 1st 2023 at 9:01:36 AM

[up] Then Season 2 would simply be delayed. It's not like they need Loki 2 at the moment.

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#157627: Jul 1st 2023 at 9:16:54 AM

[up] If Loki 2 sets up other stuff in future installments, they do. Until the strike ends that is.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
RavenWilder Since: Apr, 2009
#157628: Jul 1st 2023 at 10:21:52 AM

Until the writer's strike ends, Marvel can't do any of that. Even the smallest of recasts/reshoots require additional writing to explain/justify what's going on.

Only if they actually change any lines of dialogue. If it's just the exact same scenes, but a different actor reading Kang's lines, then the writers strike wouldn't be an issue.

MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#157629: Jul 1st 2023 at 10:44:55 AM

I'm not so sure. When Tig Notaro replaced Chris D'Elia during Army of the Dead, they had to do minor rewrites and shoot a few new scenes to even out the swap, right?

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
shatterstar Since: Apr, 2015 Relationship Status: I wanna know about these strangers like me
#157630: Jul 1st 2023 at 10:51:10 AM

[up][up] Even if the script is the same, there would have to be some writing adjustment made to the new actor (eye lines with different height, different rewrite if the actor not having the right chemistry with the supporting cast etc.) And that would require writers or be even more expansive for reshoots

M1gamiTensei The Scrappy of the Trope Pantheon, God of Thumps from Punished “Brainwashed” M1gami Since: Oct, 2017 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Scrappy of the Trope Pantheon, God of Thumps
#157631: Jul 1st 2023 at 11:43:31 AM

I once read a Reddit that was surprised by how little Disney advertised Secret Invasion. I theorize Disney underpromoted the show because D+ because like many other companies’ streaming platforms, they dont like how unprofitable it is for them and I can imagine execs pulling the marketing plug out of a vendetta against their own streaming platform. The Majors still REALLY wont help Loki’s case on this regard.

Also, fuck Disney for doing the “tax write off Zaslav technique” on Runaways particularly since thats a part of the MCU that cant be accessed legally anymore.

Pantheon server for all who click here. Lost too much money and time, this coaster ain’t stopping.
LucienRen Since: Jan, 2023
#157632: Jul 1st 2023 at 1:26:50 PM

As a way of demonstrating how difficult it is to change a script for an actor or character change, when a character is replaced, the replacement is usually the exact same character with only minor differences.

CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#157633: Jul 1st 2023 at 1:48:53 PM

On a related note, I think Disney+ did have a lot of mistakes:

  • Hawkeye
  • Falcon and the Winter Solider

Even Loki and Ms. Marvel to an extent are all shows that could have been distilled down to actual movies in theaters.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
MatthewWayne The Tapestry Weaver from Camp Echo One Since: Oct, 2014 Relationship Status: 700 wives and 300 concubines
The Tapestry Weaver
#157634: Jul 1st 2023 at 4:04:08 PM

Personally, She-Hulk was my least favorite D series. Which upsets me, because I think the show had a really cool premise and some great ideas: I just felt the writing sucked, the non-guest star characters were pretty forgettable, and the jokes were underbaked.

I still would like Jennifer to show up in other installments though. With some good writing, I'm sure she could be great.

Hell, throw her in Deadpool 3 and have her do some Snark-to-Snark Combat with Wade while they take turns smashing the fourth wall to pieces. I'd kill for that.

"I'm Mr. Blue, woah-woah-ooh..."
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#157635: Jul 1st 2023 at 4:10:03 PM

She-Hulk is pretty disappointing since they wasted a really interesting concept by really under-baking it.

A damn shame.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#157636: Jul 1st 2023 at 4:50:32 PM

Eh. There's hope for someone to do better with Jennifer later on.

She is apparently going to show up in Born Again, so I'm looking forward to that.

Man, why am I the only one not hating a lot of the newer shows and movies. Either I'm insane or something is wrong with the rest of you....Probably the second one.

One Strip! One Strip!
Falrinn Since: Dec, 2014
#157637: Jul 1st 2023 at 5:38:42 PM

I want She-Hulk to appear with Deadpool just so one of them can catch the other doing a 4th wall break.

Their only response is "Oh, you see them too"

What this implies in-universe is not elaborated on.

slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#157638: Jul 1st 2023 at 5:42:22 PM

[up][up] Well thats gonna be interesting since now Jen is gonna be showing up in Matt's show.

Which if it keeps the general tone of the past DD shows then Jen will be experiencing a genre shift like Matt did.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
HandsomeRob Leader of the Holey Brotherhood from The land of broken records Since: Jan, 2015
Leader of the Holey Brotherhood
#157639: Jul 1st 2023 at 5:47:47 PM

It's also going to be interesting, since Jen is a lot higher tier than anyone else on Matt's series.

Like, we saw how Matt fared against her. He didn't even try to fight her head on, and had no answer for her shockwave clap.

Unless the Hand comes back, Jenn's gonna be unstoppable for at least the duration of the episode she appears in.

One Strip! One Strip!
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#157640: Jul 1st 2023 at 5:51:47 PM

That or we go the route of Jen's livelihood is threatened preventing her from making physical action.

Her identity is public knowledge so it be very easy to just fuck with her business' or family if they are unable to deal with her Hulk powers.

Thats why Matt was able to fight Kingpin as well as he did. His secret identity meant Kingpin couldn't just use his massive resources to bury him as he could anyone else.

Edited by slimcoder on Jul 1st 2023 at 5:52:32 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Mizerous Pet Owner from Hell Since: Oct, 2013 Relationship Status: Brewing the love potion
Pet Owner
#157641: Jul 1st 2023 at 6:03:31 PM

Jen's actor cpuld be on the court case against Kang's actor.

Just Makima.
Bullman Enid Sinclair Since: Jun, 2018 Relationship Status: Longing for my OTP
Enid Sinclair
#157642: Jul 1st 2023 at 6:36:01 PM

Personally, She-Hulk was my least favorite D series.

I disagree She Hulk was my favorite of the Disney plus shows.

My least favorite personally was What If. Which shocked me I really like anthology series, but just didn't find any of the what if's that interesting nor was I found of Ultron's new voice even if I loved his design and characterization.

My second favorite was Hawkeye due to the lower stakes, the cast, and Kate.

Edited by Bullman on Jul 1st 2023 at 8:40:11 AM

Fan-Preferred Couple cleanup thread
CharlesPhipps Since: Jan, 2001
#157643: Jul 1st 2023 at 6:40:12 PM

She-Hulk was exactly what it should have been.

Except it's not remotely like any of the rest of the MCU. It's a silly little comedy show that doesn't take any of the Marvel universe seriously.

Author of The Rules of Supervillainy, Cthulhu Armageddon, and United States of Monsters.
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#157644: Jul 1st 2023 at 6:42:28 PM

See I don't have an issue with it being a silly little comedy show, I just didn't think it did it well is the main problem.

A shame the court cases wound up being underused as the show went on.

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
LucienRen Since: Jan, 2023
#157645: Jul 1st 2023 at 8:09:25 PM

The only problem I have with What if, is that many universes felt more like bizarre universes with a good Thanos, and a Surtur flirting with the statue of liberty, than true What if.?

Anomalocaris20 from Sagittarius A* Since: Sep, 2010 Relationship Status: Love blinded me (with science!)
#157646: Jul 1st 2023 at 9:25:28 PM

What If? was awful. Easily my least favorite product in the entire MCU (I never watched Inhumans).

She-Hulk was meh. It didn't lean into the courtroom comedy element nearly enough for my liking.

Honestly the only D+ shows I've liked without significant qualification are WandaVision and Moon Knight.

You cannot firmly grasp the true form of Squidward's technique!
KnownUnknown Since: Jan, 2001
#157647: Jul 1st 2023 at 9:44:22 PM

The attachment to the movies really does What If a disservice. It's not really the attachment to the MCU that's a problem, really.

It's that many episodes had to framed as "what if the plot to X movie, but slightly different?" They had to repeat familiar scenes, follow familiar plots, and and match the stories closely as they could.

The best episodes imo are the one that leave that behind to try something very new, like the Zombies one or Party Thor.

Edited by KnownUnknown on Jul 1st 2023 at 9:44:33 AM

RedHunter543 Crimson Paladin Since: Jul, 2016 Relationship Status: Barbecuing
Crimson Paladin
#157648: Jul 1st 2023 at 9:45:19 PM

I personally really enjoyed the Dr. Strange episode.

"The Black Rage makes us strong, because we must resist its temptations every day of our lives or be forever damned!"
slimcoder The Head of the Hydra Since: May, 2013
The Head of the Hydra
#157649: Jul 1st 2023 at 9:49:34 PM

This is a weird critique to make but I feel like She-Hulk focused too much on Jen's personal life/struggles over the courtroom stuff. It's noticeable in the latter half of the season that she stopped doing law stuff and focused more on finding herself.

Which I guess is an issue. Since Jen spends majority of the show grappling with her dislike of She-Hulk, it felt like an elongated origin story with how dragged out her acceptance of her powers is.

And I don't even think the show actually ended with Jen forming a clear acceptance over her powers.

Edited by slimcoder on Jul 1st 2023 at 9:50:00 AM

"I am Alpharius. This is a lie."
Tuckerscreator (4 Score & 7 Years Ago) Relationship Status: Drift compatible
#157650: Jul 1st 2023 at 9:55:31 PM

The fourth wall break into Marvel Studios was a funny idea, but I think spending so long on it undercut She-Hulk’s message. Her argument is that the whole time the story has been trying to force her into a traditional superhero role, complete with a big dumb action scene at the end, but she’s gonna defeat the bad guys in her own super lawyer way. And then the show just abruptly ends shortly thereafter and we never actually see her defeat the bad guys with her court expertise.


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